Prophecy tested but not tongues?

[PoetSaskia]

Don't see why you have a problem. I don't think anyone is saying the gifts are ours for the asking. But we are told to desire the best gifts, especially prophecy. So where's the problem?

 

[Entertaining_Angels]

Don't see why you have a problem. I don't think anyone is saying the gifts are ours for the asking. But we are told to desire the best gifts, especially prophecy. So where's the problem?

to which Bible verses are you referring?

 

[PoetSaskia]

Don't remember, but it's in there. Paul said it.

 

[Jesusong]

I feel strongly about this because I went that route too. I did not (or would not) recognize the gift I'd been gift and sought after other gifts. God let me and after time, I fell hard. It took me years to recognize my gift and it is a difficult one. I also believe God gives and takes away gifts as he chooses. But, I do believe that the Lord places these gifts on those whom He has chosen. Our job is to find our gift and use it to bless Him. I also believe if it is truly a gift from God, you will use it correctly. If it is prophesize, you will prophesize correctly. If it is healing, healing will be instantaneous so on and so forth. If your track record is dubious, it is VERY doubtful that gift is from the Lord

The gifts that are listed in 1Cor 12:7-11 are not ours for the asking. We cannot own these. I believe that how you stated it above is accurate. He will place them own whom He chooses, and when it has served its purpose He will remove that ability.

The gifts that the Lord gives us that are considered permanent are the ones listed in Romans 12:6-8, and Eph 4:11.

The tongues that are the initial evidence of the baptism in the Holy Spirit are different from the tongues & interpretation that are mentioned in 1Cor 12 & 14.

 

[AudioArtist]

I only think you get "demonic" tongues if you are not seeking Christ. God would not give us a scorpion instead of bread. That scripture when Jesus was talking about God giving us gifts is perfectly clear on the matter; if we ask for tongues of JESUS and nothing else, there is nothing to worry about.

HOWEVER, I do see there is a possibility that lots of speaking in tongues is not demonic NOR is it from God, but simply of the mind; it's quite easy to invent new words and speak in what sounds like tongues; perhaps some people think they can because they have prayed for it, when infact they can't. I could do similar stuff to tongues before I actually recieved the true gift of tongues! However, experiences I have had recently have proven that when I speak in tongues, it is of the Holy Spirit. Also, I'm not so sure it matters if it is of the mind or not-we all have a personal prayer language and as long as those "groanings" are to Christ, who cares?

 

[Jesusong]

HOWEVER, I do see there is a possibility that lots of speaking in tongues is not demonic NOR is it from God, but simply of the mind; it's quite easy to invent new words and speak in what sounds like tongues; perhaps some people think they can because they have prayed for it, when infact they can't. I could do similar stuff to tongues before I actually recieved the true gift of tongues!

Exactly, tongues can very easily be counterfeited. That is why we need to be prayed up, and use discernment, and yield ourselves to be used in the gift of discernment and word of knowledge. I believe that is the only way one can tell if tongues are genuine, unless of course they are being manifested by a cult. At that point its obvious.

 

[AudioArtist]

I agree.

But my point was-if it is of the mind, that's not *so* much of a worry, is it? Especially if people are doing it to Jesus (which of course, they are.) To be honest though, I'm a bit confused in this matter, as lots of peopl here talk of a "prayer language" and the "gift of tongues" being two different things-so maybe any Christian who "babbles" to God is manifesting *somethig* of the Holy Spirit? Correct me here, I am asking!

What is rare amongst Christians I imagine (because of the scripture I mentioned before-God giving good gifts to his children) is demonic tongues, and of course, that is very dangerous.

 

[brother daniel]

to which Bible verses are you referring?

THE REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST

19:10, I am thy fellow servant and of thy brethren that have the testimony of JESUS: Worship God; for the testimony of JESUSis the Spirit of prophecy.

1 Corinthians 14:1 Follow after charity and desire spiritual gifts, but rather ye may prophesy
!4:3 But he that prophesieth Speaketh unto men to edifacation, and exhortation and comfort.
14:12 Seek that ye may excel to the edyfing of the ecclasia/church
14 31 For ye all may prophesy one by one, that all may learn and all may be comforted.
Do what Jesus says.
with love in Christ brother daniel.

 

[Jesusong]

But my point was-if it is of the mind, that's not *so* much of a worry, is it? Especially if people are doing it to Jesus (which of course, they are.)

The "prayer language" as I understand it is or was the initial evidence of the baptism in the Holy Spirit. The other manifestations of the Spirit outlined in 1Cor 12 & 14 can only happen to the believer if they have been baptized in the Holy Spirit. If someone hasn't received the genuine baptism, and they are manufacturing the tongues then they are operating in the flesh and deceiving themselves and possibly others in the church, for they are claiming that they have received something from God which He hasn't bestowed upon them. And in some pentecostal/charismatic churches, one cannot be in a leadership position unless they have received the baptism in the Spirit.

What is rare amongst Christians I imagine (because of the scripture I mentioned before-God giving good gifts to his children) is demonic tongues, and of course, that is very dangerous.

I don't believe it's possible for a believer to manifest a "demonic tongue." When a person is saved, they are indwelt or inhabited by the Holy Spirit. They become the temple of God, and the Holy Spirit will not share His dwelling place with another spirit.

 

[AudioArtist]

Thanks for clearing that up, jesussong.

 

[NacDan]

Prayer in tongues does not need to be interpreted. Paul stated in 1Cor14:14-17:
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What's happening is this: when you are praying in tongues it is your spirit that is praying, and your mind is unfruitful because you have no idea what is being prayed, who's being prayed for, etc. Paul is saying that I will continue to pray in the Spirit (tongues) and I will pray with understanding (in normal language). When an utterance in tongues during public worship is given, then an interpretation must be given, if it is of the Holy Spirit. And this will only happen when a word from the Lord has come. If no interpretation is given, then it may mean that the utterance was of the flesh and not of the Lord. What this is also telling us is that when we pray in tongues, it should be done quietly, otherwise confusion will result. People will expect an interpretation when none should be given because it was a prayer and not an utterance of the Holy Spirit.

Now as far as interpretation of tongues is concerned, the person giving the utterance of the Holy Spirit in tongues should be the one who will interpret his or her utterance. If they aren't willing to interpret what is being said, they shouldn't be so willing to speak out. This gives a sense of accountability to themselves and to the church.

Just recently I concluded a teaching series in Sunday School on this very topic. I don't remember how many times I drilled this into the classes heads just to make sure that they understood why Paul put these types of restrictions on the manifestations of the Spirit, so to stop the spread of confusion.

Like I said, I've been wrestling with this for awhile. I don't have ANY disagreement whatsoever with the need for interpretation for PUBLIC tongues. I think the Scriptures are VERY clear on that; however, I'm still working on the private language. I guess what I'm curious about is whether my mind needs to be fruitfull or not.

Mind you, I'm not looking for an answer here on the forum, I believe all knowlege comes from God, and that it will be revealed to me as I am ready.

Danny

 

[Ann Doupont]

Hisgirl,

I've been around Pentecost (speaking in tongues) for 25 years now. I've never heard anyone speak of testing the spirit for speaking in tongues. I don't know how that would be done.

Insofar as testing the spirit for prophecy, this is in the Bible (if I'm not mistaken). Testing the spirit for speaking in tongues isn't.

Ann

 

[New_Wineskin]

I don't have a problem when someone feels led to speak in tongues and none are there for a public interpretation . Without an interpretation there is nothing to mislead anyone since none know what it means ( unless it is a private ineterprtation to an individual or two ) . The person can learn from the experience . However , if several do so and meetings typically have several without interpretation , I would find them distracting . I wouldn't have a problem with the people but I would be distracted . Then again , maybe I wouldn't be distracted . I have never been in such a situation . I may just toon them out after a while .

 

[Entertaining_Angels]

This is such a tough one for me too. As I've said before, I've seen something evil occur while the 'Holy Spirit' was 'supposed' to be working so I definitely lean toward testing the gift of tongues. And I don't understand how an unbeliever can speak tongues in the midst of Christians speaking tongues. I have a hard time believing one is of the devil and the others are not. But, like I've said, God's working on me here. He's taken me away from tongues right now because of my past and the 'twisted' gospel I was raised with. I grew up with tongues used in a circus like atmosphere and, looking back, I am sure that was not the Holy Spirit. For now, I feel tongues is a gift and not one that I'm given right now. Like I've said before God gives gifts to some and can take them back and give other gifts.

 

[Ann Doupont]

OreGal, I think it's Romans 11:29 that says that the gifts of God (and the calling) are without repentance. In other words, He doesn't give them and then take them back. He can and does give more gifts to those He can trust, but He doesn't take away what He's already given.

A question I would have for those here who think that tongues should be tested: How would you go about testing tongues? Is there such a test? (If so, I've never heard of one.)

Ann

 

[Entertaining_Angels]

OreGal, I think it's Romans 11:29 that says that the gifts of God (and the calling) are without repentance. In other words, He doesn't give them and then take them back. He can and does give more gifts to those He can trust, but He doesn't take away what He's already given.



Ann

Actually, I now believe Romans 11:29 to be an indicator that the gifts of the Spirit have not ceased which many Christians seem to believe. I completely believe that God gives and takes away certain gifts of the Spirit. I don't look at it as a 'punishing' act. He just knows which ones are needed and at one time. I have a gift now that I am just learning about. I know now that He has been 'grooming' me for this gift most of my life but I know that the gift is for His glory and not mine and I will not be surprised if I 'lose' it one day.

Ah well, just one gal's beliefs.

God bless.