Pro-life and Pro-War?

[Guyfoo]

There are many christians here(not all, i know) that are Anti-abortion but support the war. To me that seems a bit hypocritical, is it not? I mean thousands of innocents were killed by the war. Including children. So i just don't see how you can be pro-life but support something that kills so many people. But thats just my opinion. Anyway any taughts....

 

[sbvera13]

The right to life ends at birth.

Ask a pro-lifer to prove otherwise, using their own actions as examples. Can anyone here do it?

 

[Domenico]

What startles me even more are those who call themselves "pro-life" and yet support the death penalty.

 

[FaithLikeARock]

I'm real pro-life. I don't support humans killing humans, EVER.

So I agree. "Pro-lifers" who are also pro-war or pro-capital punishment, etc, are hypocrites. They're just anti-abortion.

 

[Voegelin]

There are many christians here(not all, i know) that are Anti-abortion but support the war.To me that seems a bit hypocritical, is it not?

It is not. Hypocrisy is preaching one thing and doing another. Teachings on abortion and war are not the same.

Pretty basic Christian beliefs here. Been gone over many times on this forum. For those who missed it, some of it is explained here.

The hypocrisy I see are all those who had no problem when Bill Clinton waged war but now are, for what they see is a political advantage, against war. That includes those in Code Pink and other "peace" groups who decry American actions but have, in the past, praised North Korea, Saddam and Fidel Castro.

 

[feral]

I think some individuals accept or support war because they think it has a cause behind it, like it's okay to kill innocent people in the name of a good cause. For example, they think killing people will stop terrorism, when in fact it just justifies extremist action in the eyes of those whose towns and friends are being blown up. In their view, a few dead people is worth showing Osama binLaden whose boss. The fact that Al Queda and other groups also believe it's acceptable to kill provided there is a good cause seems to go unnoticed by some. These same people often see no reason for killing unborn children, however, because killing babies doesn't make anybody feel safer or make anyone except a handful of doctors wealthier. Personally, I'm against both. I am also not against anything for political reasons. I often vote Democrat but I don't have a side, and I would claim no loyalty to a particular party. If a politician I like makes mistakes, I see no reason to deny it and I certainly would not continue to support an action by someone I liked if I felt it was a mistake. But most people don't think like that, apparently.

 

[Apollo Celestio]

They're not the same, though I'm not for either. I'm sure pro-choice people aren't FOR killing babies, and wouldn't be if that's what they thought it was. (Usually, anyway.) I don't think any Christians want war to happen. Though I think Augustine did something about that, Jus ad bello and Jus ad bellum.. I should get my notes on that. XD

 

[WatersMoon110]

I know plenty of people who are against abortion, the death penalty, and wars (or at least unjust wars). But people can be different levels of Pro-Life, just like people can be different levels of Pro-Choice.

Would you call someone a hypocrite for being against the death penalty, a vegetarian, and for legal elective abortion?

 

[Apollo Celestio]

I know plenty of people who are against abortion, the death penalty, and wars (or at least unjust wars). But people can be different levels of Pro-Life, just like people can be different levels of Pro-Choice.

Would you call someone a hypocrite for being against the death penalty, a vegetarian, and for legal elective abortion?

Probably not, since most for abortion say the child is not a child, but merely tissue, or a parasitic clump of cells.

 

[WarEagle]

What startles me even more are those who call themselves "pro-life" and yet support the death penalty.

What startles me is that there are actually people who don't know the difference between a convicted murderer and an innocent little baby.

 

[flicka]

What startles me is that there are actually people who don't know the difference between a convicted murderer and an innocent little baby.

I'm startled by the ones who don't see the difference between and innocent little baby and a zygote.

 

[Verv]

If we take a utilitarian approach, one should simply whatever prevents the most death.

If abortion is death, abortion is wrong.

If a war can be fought to save lives by destroying a tyrannical dictator, then support it.

That is the thought process that goes into it.

 

[Patashu]

If we take a utilitarian approach, one should simply whatever prevents the most death.

If abortion is death, abortion is wrong.

If a war can be fought to save lives by destroying a tyrannical dictator, then support it.

That is the thought process that goes into it.

Too utilitarian. The problem with such a scheme is that it does not take into account quality of life; if lives are all that matter, 100 miserable people is greater than 99 blissful people. If lives are all that matter, two miserable parents and a child that cannot be cared for (due to physical and/or emotional reasons) are better than two parents who can continue on with their desired lives, not having to worry about childcare.

 

[Verv]

Too utilitarian. The problem with such a scheme is that it does not take into account quality of life; if lives are all that matter, 100 miserable people is greater than 99 blissful people. If lives are all that matter, two miserable parents and a child that cannot be cared for (due to physical and/or emotional reasons) are better than two parents who can continue on with their desired lives, not having to worry about childcare.

But are the 100 people doomed to misery for life and are the 99 going to be blissful for life?

Perhaps the two parents made a mistake they have to care after...

If I find myself about to be blackmailed and have my family's life ruined due to an affair I had, I could save the rest of my life by killing the blackmailer and also help out my family's life or I can face up to the responsibility: if I did something wrong I should just let it be known and shouldn't hurt somebody else because of my mistake.

Do not kill a baby because it is an inconvenience.

 

[Wednesday]

Pro- abortion, gainst death penalty and against war.

Pro - abortion. We are aborting foetuses, clamps of cells, not babies. I support woman's right to do whatever she wants with her body and beleive that no one but her has a say in it.

Against death penalty - solves nothing, cheapens human life. Mistakes could be made, wrong people might be sentenced.

Against war. Naturally. Now I wouldn't mind it, if leaders went to war, like kings used to go to war with their army, that would be fair.

 

[Snowbunny]

What startles me is that there are actually people who don't know the difference between a convicted murderer and an innocent little baby.

you are wrong. there are no innocent people...

[bible]Romans 3:23[/bible]

[bible]Romans 3:9-19[/bible]

[bible]Luke 18:19[/bible]

life belongs to God, it's not our place to take it... Jesus abolished the death penalty in the story of the adulteress.

que Dios te bendiga

 

[SaintInChicago]

life belongs to God, it's not our place to take it... Jesus abolished the death penalty in the story of the adulteress.

que Dios te bendiga

Why thank you, but I'll pass on the bendigas, I have too many of them in my closet already.

You can claim that Christ abolished the death penalty in that instance but you could also similarly claim that he mandates drinking alcohol at all meals for Christians due to the last supper. In the Old Testament God prescribed the death penalty for sins. Verily, in the apostolic letters we hear "The penalty for sin is death". So we have a conondrum on our hands if we follow your reasoning: Christ abolished the death penalty, then died for our sins to bear our penalty. If Jesus truly was saying 'no more death penalty' then why did he take our death penalty for us? Basically your reasoning says Jesus said "There is no more death for sin. Now excuse me while I die for your sins" Rather pointless, n'est ce pas?

Also, if all have sinned, then Jesus is included in all. Thus, Jesus sinned. (Your reasoning, not mine).

 

[WarEagle]

If Jesus truly was saying 'no more death penalty' then why did he take our death penalty for us?

More to the point, if Jesus abolished the death penalty (still waiting for scripture to back that one up), then why did Jesus stand before Pilate and tell Pilate that his authority to carry out capital punishment came from God? Why did the Holy Spirit inspire the NT authors to tell us that the capital punishment is still in effect?

 

[Snowbunny]

Why thank you, but I'll pass on the bendigas, I have too many of them in my closet already.

lol... i'm glad you are so fortunate, pass them on to God if you have no use.

You can claim that Christ abolished the death penalty in that instance but you could also similarly claim that he mandates drinking alcohol at all meals for Christians due to the last supper. In the Old Testament God prescribed the death penalty for sins. Verily, in the apostolic letters we hear "The penalty for sin is death". So we have a conondrum on our hands if we follow your reasoning: Christ abolished the death penalty, then died for our sins to bear our penalty. If Jesus truly was saying 'no more death penalty' then why did he take our death penalty for us? Basically your reasoning says Jesus said "There is no more death for sin. Now excuse me while I die for your sins" Rather pointless, n'est ce pas?

God can condemn us to death for our sins.

[bible]Romans 6:23[/bible]

but we can't,

[bible]John 8:1-11[/bible]

'cuz we're not God.

que Dios te bendiga

 

[Snowbunny]

hola gentlemen,

Also, if all have sinned, then Jesus is included in all. Thus, Jesus sinned. (Your reasoning, not mine).

i didn't reason any of that... 'there are none without sin' 'all have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God' 'why do you call me good? nobody is good except for God' ... that's all scripture.

More to the point, if Jesus abolished the death penalty, then why did Jesus stand before Pilate and tell Pilate that his authority to carry out capital punishment came from God? Why did the Holy Spirit inspire the NT authors to tell us that the capital punishment is still in effect?

you haven't quoted scripture or sacred tradition... anywhere... in your post

que Dios te bendiga