Prayer doesn't work ?

[Prayerworks]

This depressed me ....
NEW YORK (AP) -- In the largest study of its kind, researchers found that having people pray for heart bypass surgery patients had no effect on their recovery. In fact, patients who knew they were being prayed for had a slightly higher rate of complications.

Researchers emphasized their work does not address whether God exists or answers prayers made on another's behalf. The study can only look for an effect from prayers offered as part of the research, they said.

They also said they had no explanation for the higher complication rate in patients who knew they were being prayed for, in comparison to patients who only knew it was possible prayers were being said for them.

The work, which followed about 1,800 patients at six medical centers, was financed by the Templeton Foundation, which supports research into science and religion. It will appear in the American Heart Journal.

Dr. Herbert Benson of Harvard Medical School and other scientists tested the effect of having three Christian groups pray for particular patients, starting the night before surgery and continuing for two weeks. The volunteers prayed for "a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications" for specific patients, for whom they were given the first name and first initial of the last name.

The patients, meanwhile, were split into three groups of about 600 apiece: those who knew they were being prayed for, those who were prayed for but only knew it was a possibility, and those who weren't prayed for but were told it was a possibility.

The researchers did not ask patients or their families and friends to alter any plans they had for prayer, saying such a step would have been unethical and impractical.

The study looked for any complications within 30 days of the surgery. Results showed no effect of prayer on complication-free recovery. But 59 percent of the patients who knew they were being prayed for developed a complication, versus 52 percent of those who were told it was just a possibility.

Does this disprove prayer ?Can someone help me come up with a comforting conclusion ?

 

[graysparrow]

What's prayer? (in Jesus own words) Mathew 6:10

Our Father..... Thy Kingdom come. Thy Will be done

To attempt a scientific research in prayer is either misunderstanding science or prayer. Prayer is not magic. We try not to manipulate God to do what we please (that would be magic), rather we submit to God's Will.

Secondly to count the number of people praying for some is ridicolous. I don't know in other denominations but catholic monks and nuns(each one) is ordained to pray for everybody in someway or another on a daily basis; that's their main job. Add to that the apostollic congregations, the priests, the lay people who associate to prayer etc and you'll see how counting the number of people who pray for someone makes no sense. And that counting catholics only.

 

[graysparrow]

I think this post belongs in GT or something.

 

[JacobsDream]

Ok, I heard this in the news, it is ridiculous in my opinion but rather than get emotional about this, I'll explain why we shouldn't accept this:

We DO NOT test God, the bible cleary states that. You don't put God on a scale and size Him up and thats exactly what is going on.

DO NOT BELEIVE THIS or you'll dump God over what people who dont' have a relationship with God have to say.

Remember when Jesus was fasting and the devil challenged him to turn stones into bread and eat his fill, wasn't Jesus hungry? He was being tempted and tested and he rebuked the devil.

Praying is NOT a test, it is a geniune and beleiving request and not a SCIENTIFIC STUDY.

 

[ByLoveAndGrace]

We as christians are called to pray, however, you cannot measure something that is so unmeasurable. We can barely fathom how God can hear all of our pleas, and cries, so how therefore, can we measure the way it works, in order to do that, they would have to measure it worldwide, rather than just one tiny study, which is nearly impossible. Prayer is powerful. God is All powerful, trusting in him, is worth more than this silly research.

 

[JacobsDream]

The bible says that what the world thinks is wise is realy foolishness to God and that God's foolishness is greater than the world's wisest.
They are completely in the dark as to how God works like you said (ByLoveAndGrace) and don't have any crediblity in deciding for us whether to believe God or not.

My prayer is for all who are mislead or are deeper grounded in their unbelife because of this. I ask that God reveal himself to them individually for a personal experience with him, more than anybody can quantify.

 

[foundationguy]

In a real sense, prayer doesn't work ... God works. Prayer is just asking Him to work. He works according to His will and His time.

Like others have said, we are not to "test" God. This study is just like standing somewhere and saying "God, if you are real, turn the sky green and the grass blue".

Also, there are requirements for prayer being answered aren't there? We must be abiding in Him. We must be obeying His Word. We must be praying for His will to be done, etc. Were these people that were part of the study meeting these requirements? Who knows?

I would say the conclusion that you can draw from this is God will not dance to the tune of men. He will not perform parlor tricks just because we ask. He is not a cosmic vending machine who gives out treats. He will not fit in the mold or box that man would put him into. We are to align ourselves to Him, not the other way around.

 

[JacobsDream]

I concur

 

[Prayerworks]

WOW ! Thank you sooooo much guys! Ive been depressed all week, now i feel God again ! Thank you all !

 

[beehoney]

This depressed me ....
Does this disprove prayer ?Can someone help me come up with a comforting conclusion ?

God chose not to participate in the research project.

 

[gbear]

There is no thing as disproving prayer... the world wants to hide from the TRUTH... Jesus said "I AM the Truth" John 14:6.... In Romans 1:18 you can read about this kind of thing... these kind supress the TRUTH.

People in the world are afraid of the Truth... if things were as simple as "lets pray about that" Which is the TRUTH by the way... then there would be no room for the endless drivel and quibbling that people who go after their own appetites in pride, flesh and knowledge of trivial things to manuver.

Lord, we lift all of the deceived souls in the world to you, including our own to you... keep us clinging to Your Word and the things of the one True and living God... may we run long and hard after you and may many souls come to you understanding the power of pray according to your will in Jesus name AMEN

 

[Tzutchka]

In a real sense, prayer doesn't work ... God works. Prayer is just asking Him to work. He works according to His will and His time.

Like others have said, we are not to "test" God. This study is just like standing somewhere and saying "God, if you are real, turn the sky green and the grass blue".

Also, there are requirements for prayer being answered aren't there? We must be abiding in Him. We must be obeying His Word. We must be praying for His will to be done, etc. Were these people that were part of the study meeting these requirements? Who knows?

I would say the conclusion that you can draw from this is God will not dance to the tune of men. He will not perform parlor tricks just because we ask. He is not a cosmic vending machine who gives out treats. He will not fit in the mold or box that man would put him into. We are to align ourselves to Him, not the other way around.

AMEN! I agree! God isn't going to give because we put scientific "fact" (and I use that word very loosly!) in the middle of His work. Just think of how God has answered your prayers and worked in your own life... that's all the proof you need! Be blessed!

 

[Prayerworks]

what about 1 Thess. 5:21 " test everything, and retain what is good "

 

[graysparrow]

I don't think he meant to test God

 

[leanne708]

HI, Im not sure if some of you read a post wrote in last week about my heart being in distress well the next day I had a heart attack quite a serious one and aside from everyone on the forum praying for me, my aunt, granny and mother prayed and we got to my doctor they couldnt understand why I was still breathing as it appears that the blood had clogged and no blood was flowing through the main artery. Im not even hospitilized and that is thanks to prayer.

 

[cab]

God chose not to participate in the research project.

You said it.