Prayer by a non-Christian?

[Fuzzy Fungi]

Many people suggest to non-believers that we should pray to God to "try out faith".

A prayer is essentially "being in communion with God" or "speaking to God". That implies a belief in God. If I do not have faith that God is there, and I pray to him, would that not make me a liar?

 

[DanteRisen]

No, it just means that you are kidding yourself. To say that you do not have faith that God is there, then prayer would be a waste of time. But if you are thinking of praying to God, then it may be that you do think that He is there.

But it's quite possible that He is reaching out to you if you are thinking of speaking to Him. He may start His work with you with just a prayer. You'll start to see a dominoe effect if you pursue it, it did with me. For most of my life I didn't believe, but that didn't stop Him from reaching out to me. The true question then is, when he answers that prayer, will you listen to his answer, even if it is not what you want to hear? That is where you will have to make your choice of faith.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

Many people suggest to non-believers that we should pray to God to "try out faith".

A prayer is essentially "being in communion with God" or "speaking to God". That implies a belief in God. If I do not have faith that God is there, and I pray to him, would that not make me a liar?

One may conduct an experiement to prove that ether doesn't exist. This doesn't mean the person believes in ether.

 

[ChristianDude777]

No, it just means that you are kidding yourself. To say that you do not have faith that God is there, then prayer would be a waste of time. But if you are thinking of praying to God, then it may be that you do think that He is there.

But it's quite possible that He is reaching out to you if you are thinking of speaking to Him. He may start His work with you with just a prayer. You'll start to see a dominoe effect if you pursue it, it did with me. For most of my life I didn't believe, but that didn't stop Him from reaching out to me. The true question then is, when he answers that prayer, will you listen to his answer, even if it is not what you want to hear? That is where you will have to make your choice of faith.

Excellent post. I've read a couple of yours. You seem to have a bit of a calling in you to be a teacher. You've got a gift for explaining things very well.

Keep up the good work...

Tim L.

 

[heron]

"But if you are thinking of praying to God, then it may be that you do think that He is there."

So true. We had a thread on this a week or two ago, and I was surprised to see how many people had a solid dividing line between faith and no faith.

The New Testament is full of statements that if we believe, we are saved. That's awfully simple. Imagine how much simpler prayer is, just talking to God.

People have to start somewhere. Communion and communication can involve talking, listening, mulling over statements, noticing attention from the other, and resting in each others' presence. Don't be afraid of saying the wrong thing, it's not like a job interview. God already knows you.

 

[Fuzzy Fungi]

How exactly does one know whether or not God has answered their prayers? Will there be something tangible, or will I have to rely on my, quite unreliable, emotions and feelings?

 

[ChristianDude777]

How exactly does one know whether or not God has answered their prayers? Will there be something tangible, or will I have to rely on my, quite unreliable, emotions and feelings?

I shared this in another forum but...

One night in prayer in my bedroom, I pleaded with God to let me know He loved me.

Two days later in the mail I received a booklet that I didn't order entitled "How God has loved us."

A couple of days later a friend told me she was having trouble hearing from God. Again at night in my bedroom I prayed about that. The following day I received a cassette tape that I didn't order entitled "Hearing God."

A few days later I was praying and asked God to let me know, in His own Words, if I was indeed saved. That Sunday my Pastor preached on salvation and showed within God's very own Word how to know if you're saved or not.

All of this happened within a one week period. I was alone at the time of prayer. The first two things arrived in the mail unexpectedly.

God's pretty awesome....

Yep..

Tim L.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

How exactly does one know whether or not God has answered their prayers? Will there be something tangible, or will I have to rely on my, quite unreliable, emotions and feelings?

Relying too much on emotions and feelings can be as dangerous as relying too much on logic. I would find a wise priest or monk who can help you. An experienced monk especially may give you detailed answers to a prayer he never heard you pray. That's God at work

 

[Fuzzy Fungi]

Relying too much on emotions and feelings can be as dangerous as relying too much on logic. I would find a wise priest or monk who can help you. An experienced monk especially may give you detailed answers to a prayer he never heard you pray. That's God at work

How can one rely too much on logic? I am certain that with enough knowledge, logic could define truth. Truth cannot contradict truth, so if God is the truth, logic can do no harm.

How would I go about "hunting down" P, I thought of the wording and thought I should change it, but it made me laugh too much) a priest or monk in my local area?

 

[ChristianDude777]

How can one rely too much on logic? I am certain that with enough knowledge, logic could define truth. Truth cannot contradict truth, so if God is the truth, logic can do no harm.

But logic has very rigid confinements. God doesn't. God can perform many miracles that go far beyond logic. Also, I've seen very recently examples of "logic" that were completely flawed.

Logic can't envelope God...

Tim L.

 

[Vigil]

How exactly does one know whether or not God has answered their prayers? Will there be something tangible, or will I have to rely on my, quite unreliable, emotions and feelings?

You could try an Prayer Journal.
It's quite, well, Impacting.

God Bless
Vigil.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

How can one rely too much on logic? I am certain that with enough knowledge, logic could define truth. Truth cannot contradict truth, so if God is the truth, logic can do no harm.

How would I go about "hunting down" P, I thought of the wording and thought I should change it, but it made me laugh too much) a priest or monk in my local area?

CD777 gave a good response to that. Logic is a powerful tool, but it has its limits. Using logic too much is just as bad as using it too little. Moderation.

For a priest, www.oca.org lists local parishes. A priest can probably answer all of your questions.

 

[SHEApherd]

Also, I've seen very recently examples of "logic" that were completely flawed.

I'm very interested to know what recent examples of logic were flawed? logic is flawed everyday, but is there an instance in questioning of Christianity or something close to faith that you were specifically referring too?

Back on subject, I couldn't have said it any better than DanteRisen. If you seek him, and pray for his help or forgiveness, you undoubtably are relying on him. Giving yourself and God knowledge that you believe and trust in him.

 

[ChristianDude777]

I'm very interested to know what recent examples of logic were flawed? logic is flawed everyday, but is there an instance in questioning of Christianity or something close to faith that you were specifically referring too?
QUOTE]

The logic that says God is to blame for the bad things that happen in the world. "He created evil, therefore He's either mean or imperfect..." {That was a paraphrase...}

Satan is the evil one...not God.

Tim L.

 

[SHEApherd]

The logic that says God is to blame for the bad things that happen in the world. "He created evil, therefore He's either mean or imperfect..." {That was a paraphrase...}

Satan is the evil one...not God.

Tim L.

I agree, but the subject of good vs. evil is very misunderstood in society as a whole.

Any others? Just curious

 

[Fuzzy Fungi]

For a priest, www.oca.org lists local parishes. A priest can probably answer all of your questions.

I did a search for my region of Canada, NB:

There are no results for this region!

Oh snap.

---

If someone has flawed information to base their thinking on, of course their conclusions will be wrong. I am sure, assuming God exists, his methods could be understood with logic. However, we do not have any information of how he does it.

 

[DanteRisen]

How can one rely too much on logic? I am certain that with enough knowledge, logic could define truth. Truth cannot contradict truth, so if God is the truth, logic can do no harm.

When speaking of God and things that pertain to Him, logic is, honestly speaking, the last and worst thing to use. Logic is a creation of man, much like time. If you are using logic, you are using human presumptions and human knowledge. God thinks nothing like us. Technically you could say God is illogical because from a human point of view, he is even when what He does makes total sense.

And yes, God is truth, but He is not OUR truth, He is THE truth. We can not fully, or sanely for that matter, understand His truth. So in the end, yes logic can do harm, but only to yourself.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

I did a search for my region of Canada, NB:

Oh snap.

---

If someone has flawed information to base their thinking on, of course their conclusions will be wrong. I am sure, assuming God exists, his methods could be understood with logic. However, we do not have any information of how he does it.

Hmm, well try also http://www.gocanada.org/, maybe one of the dioceses have a parish near you.

Once again, logic does produce good results, when you use it in its realm. Just like you don't use a surgeon's tools too repair a house, logic has its limits.

 

[heron]

Hm, I see logic as a creation of God. But the point is, your reliance on logic is what becomes an obstacle. A person's logic comes from what they already know. Everyone knows a different collection from experience and reading, teachings and upbringing. Logic is a synthesis of information.

Answers to prayer are new input.

How do you know when they're answered. Ha, I like ChristianDude's story. It's typical of the way that God doesn't just answer, but does it with individualized wit and care. Often we forget that we asked for help, and when situations resolve, we pat ourselves on the back. Knowing God answered a prayer involves an underlying gratefulness so we can recognize when it happens.

When you pray for something like "make me humble," or "help me be a better public speaker," though, you will not likely recognize God working! The character-development prayers can place us into arenas where are skills get exercised. Go for the burn.

 

[~*ZEE*~]

Many people suggest to non-believers that we should pray to God to "try out faith".

A prayer is essentially "being in communion with God" or "speaking to God". That implies a belief in God. If I do not have faith that God is there, and I pray to him, would that not make me a liar?

I don't know if the suggestion to pray to God is so much 'trying out faith', but rather to reach out with the amount of faith that you own.
Even in questioning the possibility of the existence of God requires some iota of faith - if you take that and harness it into an attempt to seek God, that is faith.

If you decide to 'give it a go' and try to talk to the Creator of the Universe who you've heard maybe cares about you as an individual...that is one step in what I, personally, see to be the right direction. Even if you have only moved forward a minute fraction of a millimetre - God will meet you where you are.

If you then respond to His response and you keep meeting Him - your faith can only increase. It is when you shrug off God's response to your heart as a conincidence or you somehow 'willing' and 'creating' your own response - that your faith diminishes. Don't let you get in the way of your faith (or anybody else for that matter).

To whom does it most matter if God exists and cares for you? You are the only one responsible for your response to God - you decide whether you take what faith you have and present it before God.

Go as you are.