Porn Misunderstanding

[morningstar2651]

You bring up a good point about peer review. Like I said earlier, I wish I were able to obtain more research articles about this topic. Perhaps I will try again.

Obviously, I do not believe our opinions about pornography will change because of this thread. But I assume we both feel somewhat passionately about the topic and we enjoy a good debate!

But for me I have never experimented with drugs and alcohol. Ever since I was a little girl I would see the negative consequences of both and it was not worth it to even try it. This is the same for pornography and I am not missing out by doing drugs, getting drunk, or looking at porn. But there are many who engage in these activities and are not addicted. Nevertheless, there are others who engage in these activities and the consequences are costly.

Everyone's opinion and perspective is different about this topic and it is difficult to not think, "well I am right and he/she is wrong." But it is important for me to acknowledge that we are have unique experiences that have created our current world view. To us, it feels right and it is crucial that we just respect and be kind to one another.

Do you have access to Proquest at your university? It has a pretty good topic search engine.

 

[Everlasting33]

Do you have access to Proquest at your university? It has a pretty good topic search engine.

I am not sure. I will look into it.

Actually, I found articles on my school's website but I was unable to post them.

 

[Christdiedforme]

Like I said in a previous post, there are more negatives and risks (risk of addiction, spouse may struggle with feeling insecure and inadequate which may lead to marital dissatisfaction, inaccurate portrayal of women in porn, children too young getting their hands on it, waste of money...etc) than positives of pornography

Perhaps if you made a list of the advantages and disadvantages of pornography you may acknowledge more harmful effects and/or risks involved than benefits. For me, this is how I determine whether it is good and healthy to involve myself in such activities.

I certainly understand why individuals do not agree with me...but that is O.K. We all have a certain perspective on a topic for good reason and I cannot blame myself or anyone else for it.

I never looked at it like that...good point.

 

[Maria3302]

Steezie,


I hope you take the time to read my post



"Research reveals many systemic effects of Internet pornography that are undermining an already vulnerable culture of marriage and family. Even more disturbing is the fact that the first Internet generations have not reached full-maturity, so the upper-limits of this impact have yet to be realized. Furthermore, the numerous negative effects research point to are extremely difficult, if not impossible, for individual citizens or families to combat on their own.


This testimony is not rooted in anecdotal accounts or personal views, but rather in findings from studies published in peer-reviewed research journals.


The marital relationship is a logical point of impact to examine because it is the foundational family unit and a sexual union easily destabilized by sexual influences outside the marital contract. Moreover, research indicates the majority of Internet users are married and the majority seeking help for problematic sexual behaviour online are married, heterosexual males. The research indicates pornography consumption is associated with the following six trends, among others:

1. Increased marital distress, and risk of separation and divorce,
2. Decreased marital intimacy and sexual satisfaction,
3. Infidelity
4. Increased appetite for more graphic types of pornography and sexual activity associated with abusive, illegal or unsafe practices,
5. Devaluation of monogamy, marriage and child rearing,
6. An increasing number of people struggling with compulsive and addictive sexual behaviour.

These trends reflect a cluster of symptoms that undermine the foundation upon which successful marriages and families are established.

While the marital bond may be the most vulnerable relationship to Internet pornography, children and adolescents are the most vulnerable audience.​

When a child lives in a home where an adult is consuming pornography, he or she encounters the following four risks:

• Decreased parental time and attention​
• Increased risk of encountering pornographic material​
• Increased risk of parental separation and divorce and​
• Increased risk of parental job loss and financial strain​

When a child or adolescent is directly exposed the following effects have been documented:

• Lasting negative or traumatic emotional responses,​
• Earlier onset of first sexual intercourse, thereby increasing the risk of STD’s over the lifespan,​
• The belief that superior sexual satisfaction is attainable without having affection for one’s partner, thereby reinforcing the commoditization of sex and the objectification of humans.​
• The belief that being married or having a family are unattractive prospects;​
• Increased risk for developing sexual compulsions and addictive behavior,​
• Increased risk of exposure to incorrect information about human sexuality long before a minor is able to contextualize this information in ways an adult brain could.​
• And, overestimating the prevalence of less common practices (e.g., group sex, bestiality, or sadomasochistic activity)."​

It sounds like that report is right on. I know many liberal counselors who deal with couples involving porn and from their personal experiences would agree with everything in the report.
Remember most liberal womens groups are united with conservative Christians on this issue.
Anyone who thinks that porn does not have a negative effect on the family is just deluding themselves.
Maria

 

[Everlasting33]

^Wow! It is quite shocking (but nice) to see someone agreeing with me in regards to this thread. Thanks for the support!

 

[WatersMoon110]

Like I said in a previous post, there are more negatives and risks (risk of addiction, spouse may struggle with feeling insecure and inadequate which may lead to marital dissatisfaction, inaccurate portrayal of women in porn, children too young getting their hands on it, waste of money...etc) than positives of pornography

Perhaps if you made a list of the advantages and disadvantages of pornography you may acknowledge more harmful effects and/or risks involved than benefits. For me, this is how I determine whether it is good and healthy to involve myself in such activities.

I certainly understand why individuals do not agree with me...but that is O.K. We all have a certain perspective on a topic for good reason and I cannot blame myself or anyone else for it.

It sounds like that report is right on. I know many liberal counselors who deal with couples involving porn and from their personal experiences would agree with everything in the report.
Remember most liberal womens groups are united with conservative Christians on this issue.
Anyone who thinks that porn does not have a negative effect on the family is just deluding themselves.

As a married woman who regularly looks at pornography, with a husband who also enjoys pornography, I would state that I feel that anyone who responsibly enjoys pornography (and bothers to keep one's children from looking at it, by actually paying attention to what one's children are watching, doing, or looking at on the internet), does not get any negative consequences from doing so.

The issues come in when a couple doesn't discuss their feelings on pornography, when one member feels the need to sneak around (or gets extra thrills from pornography being "forbidden") or when one doesn't pay attention to what one's young children are doing. Beyond such irresponsible behavior, I see no negatives that come from pornography use. Can you point out any that don't come from these irresponsible behaviors?

 

[Everlasting33]

As a married woman who regularly looks at pornography, with a husband who also enjoys pornography, I would state that I feel that anyone who responsibly enjoys pornography (and bothers to keep one's children from looking at it, by actually paying attention to what one's children are watching, doing, or looking at on the internet), does not get any negative consequences from doing so.

The issues come in when a couple doesn't discuss their feelings on pornography, when one member feels the need to sneak around (or gets extra thrills from pornography being "forbidden") or when one doesn't pay attention to what one's young children are doing. Beyond such irresponsible behavior, I see no negatives that come from pornography use. Can you point out any that don't come from these irresponsible behaviors?

Somehow I knew you would find your way into this thread, Watersmoon!

The portrayal of women in pornography is a negative.Here is what poster Alexandrah stated (since she said it best):


"On the other hand, I think that a lot of pornography helps to promote a very unrealistic portrayal of the way that women are and while I understand that the main audience it's being sold to is men--it makes the act all about men. Has anyone here ever seen pornography that portrays a sexual act where both parties are considered? Most of it ends when the man climaxes, it's done, with no regard to the woman involved. I think that it also can promote the idea that women will do anything for money, even things that the average woman might find uncomfortable or degrading.

When people say it objectifies women it is partly true. Of course, they are obviously consenting to the objectification. It turns a woman into someone that must do anything and everything with whoever because she is being paid and I think that is the most detrimental aspect of it"


However, there still are formidable risks associated with bringing pornography into a marriage and family. If I do not look at porn, there is no risk whatsoever. And it begs the question: What positives are correlated to pornography use? One could argue that there are more risks (even with responsible behavior) and there are not even positives about pornography that can convince me of its beneficial use.

Although I realize this does not apply to you, there are many women who struggle with feelings of inferiority when it comes to their loved one viewing pornography. My boyfriend has struggled with it and it negatively impacted my self-esteem. Nearly two years later, he remains free of the addiction and my self-esteem is strengthening and growing. Pornography certainly has a negative effect on the relationship but it probably more limited to religious couples than not. More often than not, human beings are simply monogamous creatures and they place loyalty and commitment as a high priority. In my relationship, loyalty and commitment does not mean looking at the opposite sex and getting off on it. Sure, our idea of loyalty and commitment is different and I guess we will just accept it!

I see no positives in drinking alcohol, so I do not.
I see no positives in taking illegal drugs, so I do not.
The same goes for pornography.

Like my boyfriend said, "And how many people actually look at porn every once in a while?" Pornography, like anything, can lead to addiction and it one less risk that I want to take into my marriage! Pornography simply just generates negative connotation and there is a reason for this!

What positives are correlated to pornography use?

 

[Washington]

It sounds like that report is right on. I know many liberal counselors who deal with couples involving porn and from their personal experiences would agree with everything in the report.
Remember most liberal womens groups are united with conservative Christians on this issue.

Maria

​

 

[morningstar2651]

I'll admit that most porn portrays women unrealistically, but I (fortunately) haven't met anyone who has watched porn and not realized this. Additionally, this isn't a flaw inherent in pornography.

Pornography tends to be unrealistic because porn actors are actors. In fact, they tend to be bad actors. It is a product of the porn industry rather than the medium itself. Porn videos are produced on small budgets to maximize the publisher's return on investment. They're required to use smaller budgets than other videos because other videos have a wider distribution. Wal-Mart refuses to carry anything over an R rating.

Don't blame the medium; blame the industry.

 

[Mling]

I'll admit that most porn portrays women unrealistically, but I (fortunately) haven't met anyone who has watched porn and not realized this. Additionally, this isn't a flaw inherent in pornography.

Pornography tends to be unrealistic because porn actors are actors. In fact, they tend to be bad actors. It is a product of the porn industry rather than the medium itself. Porn videos are produced on small budgets to maximize the publisher's return on investment. They're required to use smaller budgets than other videos because other videos have a wider distribution. Wal-Mart refuses to carry anything over an R rating.

Don't blame the medium; blame the industry.

Well, all art portrays people unrealistically. I saw an interesting documentary on the evolution of artistic portrayals of people. It was pointed out that, since Medieval times and before, there was an ongoing pursuit to portray people as realistically as possible. And once that goal was reached...it lasted for about 10 years.

For the most part, people don't *want* to look at pictures or sculptures of ordinary people. there has *never* been a market for it. Ever. People who *do* like it...don't need published works. They can go sit on a park bench and watch real people.

Don't blame the industry. Blame people.

 

[WatersMoon110]

Somehow I knew you would find your way into this thread, Watersmoon!

Um..Thank you?

The portrayal of women in pornography is a negative.Here is what poster Alexandrah stated (since she said it best):


"On the other hand, I think that a lot of pornography helps to promote a very unrealistic portrayal of the way that women are and while I understand that the main audience it's being sold to is men--it makes the act all about men. Has anyone here ever seen pornography that portrays a sexual act where both parties are considered? Most of it ends when the man climaxes, it's done, with no regard to the woman involved. I think that it also can promote the idea that women will do anything for money, even things that the average woman might find uncomfortable or degrading.

When people say it objectifies women it is partly true. Of course, they are obviously consenting to the objectification. It turns a woman into someone that must do anything and everything with whoever because she is being paid and I think that is the most detrimental aspect of it"

As many other people have already pointed out, pornography is not reality. It isn't supposed to portray reality. It is a fantasy, as many people, especially men, already have in their minds. Like any fantasy, the fun comes from either seeing/experiencing things that one desires or from seeing/experiencing something uncommon or taboo.

I think that pornography actors do not show that "people (particularly women) would do anything for pay" or at least no more than any other actor. They are people who are just trying to make a living, and do so by giving people what they want. Like any other actor (or any worker, for that matter) they might sometimes be offered a job that they don't want, and it is up to them to turn it down.

If the worry is that women (or actors) are being objectified or taken advantage of, then the solution isn't to ban the industry, but to reform it. Unionizing (if there isn't already a union, I don't know) and organizing the actors would certainly help.

And, of course, there is the "amateur" porn industry. Where, since the videos/photos are made by the participants, there is less chance of a producer or manager forcing anyone to play a part they don't like (though, admittedly, more chance of a participant being drunk and doing something they might not have done while sober).

However, there still are formidable risks associated with bringing pornography into a marriage and family. If I do not look at porn, there is no risk whatsoever. And it begs the question: What positives are correlated to pornography use? One could argue that there are more risks (even with responsible behavior) and there are not even positives about pornography that can convince me of its beneficial use.

Many people use pornography as couples, to "spice up" their marriage. That is certainly a benefit. And, as other people have mentioned, pornography allows sexual release for one partner when the other partner is not interested in sex, causing less sexual frustration.

Outside of a relationship, pornography is a completely safe way to allow for sexual release. No one gets pregnant or catches an STI from watching pornography.

Although I realize this does not apply to you, there are many women who struggle with feelings of inferiority when it comes to their loved one viewing pornography. My boyfriend has struggled with it and it negatively impacted my self-esteem. Nearly two years later, he remains free of the addiction and my self-esteem is strengthening and growing. Pornography certainly has a negative effect on the relationship but it probably more limited to religious couples than not.

I'm sorry to hear that your self-esteem was negatively effected by your boyfriend's addiction, and I'm happy to hear that he has overcome it. All addictions, we can agree, are negative for people struggling with them, and for their loved ones.

However, many couples are able to have healthy relationships while one or both members enjoy pornography. Also, if someone doesn't treat pornography (or any activity) as the only way to have fun, or as an escape, they run very little chance of becoming addicted. Since pornography is an object (of some form: picture, video, painting, sculpture, story), it can't cause an addiction. It is only when a person treats the activity of viewing pornography in an unhealthy way that they can become addicted to the emotions that such an activity creates in them. They mentally crave that activity, even though what their body actually desires is the emotional chemicals that it produces.

Someone who doesn't think of pornography in an unhealthy way will not, ever, become addicted to the activity of viewing it.

More often than not, human beings are simply monogamous creatures and they place loyalty and commitment as a high priority.

Actually, we aren't "monogamous creatures". There is a biological drive to spread one's genes around, even though there might be a mental desire to remain faithful to only one person. I think that accepting that one's partner is still going to find other people attractive, and even sexually desirable, but will not act upon that desire (except with the other partner's permission, if that is what both desire), is a far healthier way to deal with this, personally.

In my relationship, loyalty and commitment does not mean looking at the opposite sex and getting off on it. Sure, our idea of loyalty and commitment is different and I guess we will just accept it!

Glad I'm not in a relationship with you, then. *wink*

But yes, I can certainly accept that we have different ideas of what a relationship should be. And, so long as both of you are happy, I wish you and your boyfriend well.

I see no positives in drinking alcohol, so I do not.
I see no positives in taking illegal drugs, so I do not.
The same goes for pornography.

So I'm glad you don't do those things. However, can you accept that other people do see positives in all of those activities? And that you disliking them doesn't make them wrong for everyone?

Like my boyfriend said, "And how many people actually look at porn every once in a while?"

Most of them. Almost all of my (admittedly mostly male) friends view pornography. So far as I know (and I do think that I know) not a single one of them does so to excess.

Perhaps this lack of negative consequences comes from believing that liking to look at/watch/read about naked people or people having sex is natural and enjoyable? Instead of believing that pornography is evil, and desire for it is shameful?

Pornography, like anything, can lead to addiction

The key words being "like anything"!

and it one less risk that I want to take into my marriage!

Good for you. Don't view pornography, and don't marry anyone who does. That is certainly your right! But I don't feel that this means that all marriages need to be pornography-free.

Pornography simply just generates negative connotation and there is a reason for this!

Again, I would state that the negatives come not from the pornography itself, but from people who believe it to be shameful, or people who are irresponsible about it (like leaving it laying around for young children to find).

What positives are correlated to pornography use?

Many couples use it as a way to "spice up" their marriage, or as a mutually enjoyable adult activity. It also can be used to provide sexual release when one partner doesn't feel like having sex, but the other does; which means that there can be less sexual frustration and the couple can avoid arguments about "not having sex enough". And pornography can be used by single people as a safe way to find sexual release, without risking STIs or pregnancy.

Not to mention that it provides jobs to many professional and amateur pornography stars. As well as to directors, camera operators, photographers, sound engineers, and other crew needed for pornographic movies and pictures.

Also, indirectly, pornography has protected the First Amendment, through many court cases that have ruled that it is freedom of speech. And also cases like Falwell v. Flint have helped strengthen the ability to parody (leading to better freedom for television shows and movies).

In conclusion: The Internet is for Porn.

 

[Everlasting33]

^Wow! What a detailed reply.

I have laid out some of my arguments against pornography and you have done the same. I disagree with you and you disagree with me. But I cannot help but think if the world was void of pornography, what kind of world would it be? Better? Worse? In my eyes, it would be a better place and the positives do not outweigh the negatives. Of course, you and many others disagree and that is fine.

But anyway, this debate will simply go round and round and there is no end in sight. But it is always enjoyable to engage in a good debate!

 

[TeddyKGB]

I have laid out some of my arguments against pornography and you have done the same. I disagree with you and you disagree with me. But I cannot help but think if the world was void of pornography, what kind of world would it be? Better? Worse? In my eyes, it would be a better place and the positives do not outweigh the negatives.

Which porn-free world is this? One in which people forego pornography freely or one in which it is legislatively and judicially prohibited?

 

[WatersMoon110]

^Wow! What a detailed reply.

It's like a blessing of insomnia, that I have nothing better to do at 5am than write out a very detailed response! *wink*

I have laid out some of my arguments against pornography and you have done the same. I disagree with you and you disagree with me. But I cannot help but think if the world was void of pornography, what kind of world would it be? Better? Worse? In my eyes, it would be a better place and the positives do not outweigh the negatives. Of course, you and many others disagree and that is fine.

It's pretty hard to imagine a world without pornography, since even Cave Paintings depicted naked people, sexual organs, and people having sex. The Ancient Greeks loved portraying the nude body, both male and female. During the Renaissance, many paintings of nude women were created. I think that there is a natural desire for humans to want to look at naked people, and I feel that modern pornography is just another way of fulfilling this desire.

But anyway, this debate will simply go round and round and there is no end in sight. But it is always enjoyable to engage in a good debate!

Very much agreed! It's been very enjoyable!