Political Issues Are Killing Evangelicals

[Bill5612]

Evangelical Christian leaders are questioning whether their influence is declining after many losses in this past election. The New York Times has a very good article which quotes many of these leaders as they discuss their disappointment. I could care less.

I am a small church pastor fighting in the trenches of the culture vs religion war. I've been ministering in New Jersey for ten years, and I can tell you that from where I am at, we Christians are getting trounced. I am surrounded by an increasingly secular group of people who view churches as piles of conservative, republican political manure. I don't even get a chance to talk about the Good News of Jesus Christ before I am judged as a conservative political crank. All of the anger and frustration felt by the liberal leaning people of NJ is thrown at us evangelicals because of the label of political conservative attached to us, despite our wonderful and life changing ministries.

And so, it would help me and my blue state evangelical brothers and sisters a great deal if the rest of Evangelical Christian America would lay off politics and focus on ministry. You guys are killing us in the northeast. We want to talk about Jesus, everyone else wants to talk politics. Enough is enough. If you want to be a politician, be a politician. If you want to be a minister, do the Lord's Work. Mixing the two is not working. Jesus said; "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's Render unto God the things that are God's". Amen to that.

God bless you,

Pastor Bill
First Baptist Church of Rahway


Link to the New York Times article...

 

[HiLo]

In my view, it's not the politics. It's the hypocrisy within the churches that turns people off. Politics just makes this truth much more public. Churches need to focus on their own houses instead of trying to clean up their neighbors house. Focus on loving one another as we love ourselves and let God do the rest.

No one says we have to agree with everything going on in society but when we let society drag us away from the commandment of Christ to love one another as ourselves, we've already lost.

Lastly, if more ministers started teaching the Truth instead of forcing Gentiles to swallow Jewish law, we'd all be a lot better off. Christ came to free us from the Law, yet most churches are delusional in their thinking that putting people back into bondage of the law, is some how righteous. Dual covenant theology is the root of all the churches trouble and the lack of moral courage by the rest of the Christian community, to stand against such false teachings, is the first branch on that bush of thorns.

 

[Yarddog]

And so, it would help me and my blue state evangelical brothers and sisters a great deal if the rest of Evangelical Christian America would lay off politics and focus on ministry. You guys are killing us in the northeast. We want to talk about Jesus, everyone else wants to talk politics. Enough is enough. If you want to be a politician, be a politician. If you want to be a minister, do the Lord's Work. Mixing the two is not working. Jesus said; "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's Render unto God the things that are God's". Amen to that.

God bless you,

Pastor Bill

I used to be a 700 Club member way back and cut that off because of Pat Robertson's politics.

Christianity is not about politics. It is about our relationship with Jesus Christ and I abhor both liberals and conservatives who judge each others faith, based on political stands.

God Bless,
Yarddog

 

[P1LGR1M]

Evangelical Christian leaders are questioning whether their influence is declining after many losses in this past election. The New York Times has a very good article which quotes many of these leaders as they discuss their disappointment. I could care less.

I am a small church pastor fighting in the trenches of the culture vs religion war. I've been ministering in New Jersey for ten years, and I can tell you that from where I am at, we Christians are getting trounced. I am surrounded by an increasingly secular group of people who view churches as piles of conservative, republican political manure. I don't even get a chance to talk about the Good News of Jesus Christ before I am judged as a conservative political crank. All of the anger and frustration felt by the liberal leaning people of NJ is thrown at us evangelicals because of the label of political conservative attached to us, despite our wonderful and life changing ministries.

And so, it would help me and my blue state evangelical brothers and sisters a great deal if the rest of Evangelical Christian America would lay off politics and focus on ministry. You guys are killing us in the northeast. We want to talk about Jesus, everyone else wants to talk politics. Enough is enough. If you want to be a politician, be a politician. If you want to be a minister, do the Lord's Work. Mixing the two is not working. Jesus said; "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's Render unto God the things that are God's". Amen to that.

God bless you,

Pastor Bill
First Baptist Church of Rahway


Link to the New York Times article...

Preach it, brother!

But be encouraged, my friend, because the work you do is what makes the difference, and what we can be sure of is that the ministers of God are always going to have a struggle on thier hands. If we got to the point where we thought everyone was saved and in obedience to the Gospel then it might be time to wonder if we have died and gone to Heaven, lol.

I think there is a validity to fear that the voice of the Christian has lost it's impact in America, but then again we have to look at what passes for obedience to God and the "faith" that is embraced by many. It is men like you that leads those in need of godly leadership that are the ones on the frontlines. I have a friend that is a Pastor that struggles against the politics many in his congregation have as traditions, and it is a source of anguish for him. But he keeps at it, and I believe, because he is not only sound in his doctrine but I believe the hand of God is on him strongly, that he will be used to break down these strongholds and that the congregation will benefit from his perseverance.

And the OP is a message that needs to be heard, so, as I said, preach on, brother.

God bless.

 

[Ave Maria]

My view is that religion and politics goes hand in hand. As Catholics, we are obligated to vote:

2240 Submission to authority and co-responsibility for the common good make it morally obligatory to pay taxes, to exercise the right to vote, and to defend one's country:
Pay to all of them their dues, taxes to whom taxes are due, revenue to whom revenue is due, respect to whom respect is due, honor to whom honor is due.
[Christians] reside in their own nations, but as resident aliens. They participate in all things as citizens and endure all things as foreigners. . . . They obey the established laws and their way of life surpasses the laws. . . . So noble is the position to which God has assigned them that they are not allowed to desert it. The Apostle exhorts us to offer prayers and thanksgiving for kings and all who exercise authority, "that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way."

I believe that a person's religious beliefs should also influence their political beliefs.

That said, I sympathize with the OP about being judged based upon religion. Believe me, there are plenty of Catholics out there who vote Democrat and they have their reasons. Some of those reasons I would consider to be justifiable. Catholic positions do not fit the Republican Party perfectly. There are a number of things that the Catholic Church would disagree with the Republican Party platform on.

 

[Fireinfolding]

And so, it would help me and my blue state evangelical brothers and sisters a great deal if the rest of Evangelical Christian America would lay off politics and focus on ministry. You guys are killing us in the northeast. We want to talk about Jesus, everyone else wants to talk politics. Enough is enough. If you want to be a politician, be a politician. If you want to be a minister, do the Lord's Work. Mixing the two is not working. Jesus said; "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's Render unto God the things that are God's". Amen to that.

God bless you,

Preach it, brother!

Nice to agree together on that

 

[Lovely Lane]

Thanks for the article and thoughts.

You haven't seen nothing compared to what the clergy and congregants went through in the 1860's leading up to the War between the States. Now they had something to really complain about. Until a preacher is set adrift on the Missouri River and then later tarred and feathered for not succumbing to majority opinion then one hasn't experienced real political division.
Prior to the great war, a little denomination called The Christian Union Church was formed in 1864,Columbus Ohio, by splitting from the Methodist Episcopal Church, it's principles still hold true today. They learned to keep politics out of the church and many refused to speak politics outside of church.

PRINCIPLES: We recognize and uphold the following seven cardinal principles established by our founding fathers of Christian Union in 1864:

1. The Oneness of the Church of Christ​

2. Christ the Only Head​

3. The Bible The Only Rule of Faith and Practice​

4. Good Fruits the Only Condition of Fellowship​

5. Christian Union Without Controversy​

6. Each Local Church Governs Itself​

7. Partisan Political Preaching Discountenanced​

 

[wordsoflife]

Bill, we live in a country where God has granted us the grace to participate in our nations politics. We should be grateful for this opportunity and as Christians it is our duty to take an active role.

 

[Verticordious]

Jesus criticized politicians all the time. The Pharisees and Sadducees were the political leaders of Israel, and Jesus saved his harshest words for them. Also, many famous people in the Bible were political leaders, such as Moses and King David, and prophets such as Elijah and Jeremiah were sent by God to deliver messages to the political leaders of Israel and Judah. John the Baptist was beheaded for telling Herod, a political leader, that he was commuting adultery. When Jesus heard about it he said that no one born of men was greater than John the Baptist, he did say "sigh... I warned him not to get involved in politics".

Politics is simply the exercise of religion in everyday life, the two cannot be separated. If you believe it's ok to murder an innocent little baby, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that government has a right to steal from people and redistribute it to others, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that Sodomy base marrage is just as good as heterosexual marriage, your public policy will reflect that. Virtually every single political issue can be found to have been addresses in the Bible, so there is just no way to separate religion from politics.

 

[Lovely Lane]

Jesus criticized politicians all the time. The Pharisees and Sadducees were the political leaders of Israel, and Jesus saved his harshest words for them. Also, many famous people in the Bible were political leaders, such as Moses and King David, and prophets such as Elijah and Jeremiah were sent by God to deliver messages to the political leaders of Israel and Judah. John the Baptist was beheaded for telling Herod, a political leader, that he was commuting adultery. When Jesus heard about it he said that no one born of men was greater than John the Baptist, he did say "sigh... I warned him not to get involved in politics".

Politics is simply the exercise of religion in everyday life, the two cannot be separated. If you believe it's ok to murder an innocent little baby, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that government has a right to steal from people and redistribute it to others, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that Sodomy base marrage is just as good as heterosexual marriage, your public policy will reflect that. Virtually every single political issue can be found to have been addresses in the Bible, so there is just no way to separate religion from politics.

See Bill5612, there is just no stopping it. The religion of politics continues onward in guise of following Jesus.

 

[wordsoflife]

Politics is simply the exercise of religion in everyday life, the two cannot be separated. If you believe it's ok to murder an innocent little baby, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that government has a right to steal from people and redistribute it to others, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that Sodomy base marrage is just as good as heterosexual marriage, your public policy will reflect that. Virtually every single political issue can be found to have been addresses in the Bible, so there is just no way to separate religion from politics.

Amen!

 

[Bethesda]

Jesus criticized politicians all the time. The Pharisees and Sadducees were the political leaders of Israel, and Jesus saved his harshest words for them. Also, many famous people in the Bible were political leaders, such as Moses and King David, and prophets such as Elijah and Jeremiah were sent by God to deliver messages to the political leaders of Israel and Judah. John the Baptist was beheaded for telling Herod, a political leader, that he was commuting adultery. When Jesus heard about it he said that no one born of men was greater than John the Baptist, he did say "sigh... I warned him not to get involved in politics".

Politics is simply the exercise of religion in everyday life, the two cannot be separated. If you believe it's ok to murder an innocent little baby, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that government has a right to steal from people and redistribute it to others, then your public policy will reflect that. If you believe that Sodomy base marrage is just as good as heterosexual marriage, your public policy will reflect that. Virtually every single political issue can be found to have been addresses in the Bible, so there is just no way to separate religion from politics.

I'd have to add that if you believe that its OK to waterboard people, hold people in off-shore prison facilities without a fair trial or for those who presided over the financial ruin of thousands to walk away with huge payoffs, your public policy will also reflect that - and as said, the rightness of any of these will also be addressed in the Bible.

PS on the government stealing from people, given that selective payment of tax is not possible (since otherwise it will be "i don't want to pay for welfare for those I see as lazy but that lady over there doesn't want to pay for more ammo for Apache gunships as she is a pacifist"), presumably those who resent such stealing have no need for the police and fire service having a gun and a garden hose! Of course we in the UK had a national hero who stole from the rich and gave to the poor (Robin Hood) - I imagine that some sections of the US root for the Sheriff of Nottingham and Sir Guy of Gisborne in their attempts to stop that darned commie in green tights, when watching the various films on said subject

 

[Albion]

And now for a little pastoral "tough love."

Where did you get the idea that preaching the Gospel is supposed to be a matter of reinforcing the existing prejudices of the people you meet? We have pastors trying to stay alive while fearlessly preaching Christ in Muslim and Atheistic countries, but you can't endure the ignorance of the people you encounter?

That's what you're there for--not to preach only half the Gospel!

Do you really want to teach abstract principles but never, never, the obvious application of them to our daily lives? Because somebody might have already been influenced by secular thinking?

Perish the thought. These are the people who MOST need to hear the Gospel, and yet you are pouting because it doesn't come easy.

Snap out of it.





.

 

[P1LGR1M]

And now for a little pastoral "tough love."

Where did you get the idea that preaching the Gospel is supposed to be a matter of reinforcing the existing prejudices of the people you meet? We have pastors trying to stay alive while fearlessly preaching Christ in Muslim and Atheistic countries, but you can't endure the ignorance of the people you encounter?

That's what you're there for--not to preach only half the Gospel!

Do you really want to teach abstract principles but never, never, the obvious application of them to our daily lives? Because somebody might have already been influenced by secular thinking?

Perish the thought. These are the people who MOST need to hear the Gospel, and yet you are pouting because it doesn't come easy.

Snap out of it.





.

Hello Albion, nice to meet you.

I am in agreement with what you say, but you do not say who it is you are addressing, which would help to put your statement in perspective.

Where did you get the idea that preaching the Gospel is supposed to be a matter of reinforcing the existing prejudices of the people you meet?

Who is doing this?

God bless.

 

[Albion]

Hello Albion, nice to meet you.

and it's nice to meet you, too.

I am in agreement with what you say, but you do not say who it is you are addressing, which would help to put your statement in perspective.

I was addressing the author of the OP, Bill.

 

[Lovely Lane]

And now for a little pastoral "tough love."

Where did you get the idea that preaching the Gospel is supposed to be a matter of reinforcing the existing prejudices of the people you meet? We have pastors trying to stay alive while fearlessly preaching Christ in Muslim and Atheistic countries, but you can't endure the ignorance of the people you encounter?

That's what you're there for--not to preach only half the Gospel!

Do you really want to teach abstract principles but never, never, the obvious application of them to our daily lives? Because somebody might have already been influenced by secular thinking?

Perish the thought. These are the people who MOST need to hear the Gospel, and yet you are pouting because it doesn't come easy.

Snap out of it.





.

This post sounds like Red States have God, Blue States do not. And Bill seems to be saying that one should preach and reach everyone and others here just don't get it. Either get in the field and labor or stay out of the way, is the message I see from Bill. Which I agree with, the Christian mouthpiece from mega pulpits are closing doors instead of opening them.

 

[Albion]

This post sounds like Red States have God, Blue States do not.

The OP pointed to the difference between the regions of the country.

 

[Lovely Lane]

The OP pointed to the difference between the regions of the country.

Correct, I saw that. I took it to mean that most mega Pulpits need to shut up (with divisive speech imo) leave politics to the politicians, and concern themselves more with what they wrote in their 501(c)(3) applications and in their articles of incorporation form. None of which include Politics.

 

[LLWHA]

Bill, we live in a country where God has granted us the grace to participate in our nations politics. We should be grateful for this opportunity and as Christians it is our duty to take an active role.

Actually God forbids left and right blood sucking (poli*many, ticks*bloodsuckers).
We here in the u.s. have a Babylonian, Roman system that is anti Christ. The Babylonians and Romans were always the enemies of Gods Chosen Nation (Israel).

 

[Cuddles333]

I think it was when rich Republicans wanted to create the 'image of righteousness' in the early 1980s that the 'church' identity was taken into the political realm. A lot of people not familiar with the scriptures may have began to then associate Christianity with Republican politics and tune out whenever they heard the Bible being brought up in discussion. They may have saw the conservatives trying to make the U.S.A. a Theocracy like the Israelites had in the Old Testament.

It is true that the U.S.A. has laws based off of the Bible. This is why about every person from any other country wanted to live here. Those of the secular persuasion fail to see how entire countries thought and behaved when they were not exposed to the spiritual light that first shone through the ancient Israelites...and the brighter light that later came from Jesus and His church.