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It was feasible and we did achieve it. For over 100 days we had absolutely no covid transmission in society.Not a rant. Just the truth. The eradication strategy for COVID was never feasible. While New Zealand liked to pretend that "zero-COVID" was a viable strategy, we can look at the data and see what a foolish idea it was from the beginning.
It was feasible and we did achieve it.
For over 100 days we had absolutely no covid transmission in society.
Once vaccinations were created for Smallpox it took 50 years to irradicate it.
History of smallpox vaccination
One of the deadliest diseases known to humans, smallpox remains the only human disease to have been eradicated. Many believe this achievement to be the most significant milestone in global public health.www.who.int
They had to reach a very high takeup level of vaccinations. They would never be able to acheive that today, especially in USA where you have the Republican supporters going against common sense and science and trying to make everything political.
Having 20-40% of people refusing to get vaccinated guarantees that a diesease will be prevalent in society and that means even the vaccinated people will likely catch it.
It is proven that vaccinated people are far less likely to need hospital care and far less likely to die from the disease.
They just follow the data, the results, the evidence
This is a lie.
Many people of all ages have died from the disease, even healthy people have died from it. Chances of death are around 10x less if you have been vaccinated regardless of age.
There are no guarantees.
Some people react mildly, some people get severe infections. But statistically speaking, vaccinated people are far less likely to go to hospital or to die.
Many people get flu vaccinations every year. So what?
The current state of this is that some (definitely not all) agencies think that the lab leak hypothesis is more likely than others to be true, but they're not very confident in that assessment.
That's not a ringing endorsement of it. It's still true that the people pushing the theory a couple years ago were talking out of their back sides, likely for political reasons, with no evidence to back up their claims
You say that as if vindication was needed at this point. There's only hard evidence for the lab leak, plenty of evidence for a cover-up, and no reason to believe that a wet market scenario is even plausible anymore.. You guys have not been vindicated.
Show many any statement I've made about smallpox that is innaccurate, rather than make a vacuous attack like this.Ignoring everything you don't seem to understand about the smallpox vaccine....
Yes, thanks for asking.Do you understand why there is a seasonal flu vaccine?
Read this and educate yourself.Then I'd like to know how you would answer those questions as they relate to covid vaccines and boosters. Do you think that the covid vax loses effectiveness because covid has changed so much in 6 months that the vax you initially got is no longer effective? Or do you think that unlike every other vaccine....the covid vax basically just wears off over a long enough time?
And this is why you are not worth talking to. You deny reality. I can't discuss in a cordial fashion a topic with a person that lies and denies.It was not, and you did not.
And this is why you are not worth talking to. You deny reality.
I can't discuss in a cordial fashion a topic with a person that lies and denies.
I've told you what happened here. I lived through the whole thing. You brought up a state about covid cases and deaths during the erradicated phase and I explained they were only at the border in the quarantine fascilities. But it seem you cannot understand that fact.
I don't know how we can continue with this coversation if you are not willing to listen or accept facts.
There was no silent circulating of the disease. Our country had one of the best testing initiatives in the world. Testing was frequent and regular and nothing was found until, after 100 days we had an outbreak in Auckland, Auckland went into lockdown again, but the rest of the country remained open.COVID was never "eradicated" in NZ. Just because you carried on maskless at large events doesn't mean COVID wasn't silently circulating amongst you. If it had been "eradicated", there would not have been such a precipitous increase of cases.
There was no silent circulating of the disease.
Our country had one of the best testing initiatives in the world.
Testing was frequent and regular and nothing was found until, after 100 days we had an outbreak in Auckland, Auckland went into lockdown again, but the rest of the country remained open.
During the 100 days, covid cases and some deaths were recorded in the quarantine facilities from NZers coming home from overseas.
Yes you do explain it that way. The R0 rating of the disease is very high, especially Omicron variant.Sure there was. How else do you explain this precipitous increase in cases?
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You don't go from zero cases to nearly a million cases in just a few short months if the virus wasn't already present.
Yes you do explain it that way. The R0 rating of the disease is very high, especially Omicron variant.
And also if you look at many other countries you can see that covid numbers and deaths hit mostly in 2022, because countries who had bothered to protect their citizens finally opened up that year once the population was vaccinated.
NZ were very special compared to other western countries because we were able to eliminate the disease entirely.
Our line prior to 2022 was virtually flatlined but with some slight gradual numbers in the quarantine facilities at the border so no exponential growth at all and no community transmission. Australia weren't able to eliminate it from their community, but they managed it very well also.
Whether you believe it or not is beside the point. I don't have to convince you of anything.
It's just that I find it difficult having a discussion with someone who denies basic facts like this.
I understand you perhaps don't believe what NZ has been reporting, maybe you are convinced it is impossible to do what we actually did.
But NZ is a first world free well developed democratic country. I lived through every minute of what happened here. Saw it first hand. We really did eliminate the disease,
but were always at risk of disease re-entering society
due to NZr's coming home from overseas, we had a few scares of people escaping quarantine facilities and we had a couple of outbreaks localised to Auckland which we were able to get on top of and stamp out, until Omicron came along, but by that time we were very close to having most people vaccinated.
Prevaccination death rate is much higher than post vaccination death rate. Orders of magnitude higher.Bothered to protect their citizens... then died in 2022. Are you sure you understand what "protect" means?
Thus it is not possible to discuss this topic with you. Since you deny reality.You were not able to do any such thing.
There is a pandemic going on.So well, that they're now experiencing excess death rates not seen in more than 80 years!
Do you understand the concept of time?The basic facts are that nearly half of NZ's population has had COVID. This does not happen with "eradicated" diseases.
This is just so very dumb.Tell me, how many people in NZ have had smallpox in the last year? Because those are the same numbers one would expect when a disease is legitimately "eradicated" from society.
Prevaccination death rate is much higher than post vaccination death rate. Orders of magnitude higher.
Thus it is not possible to discuss this topic with you. Since you deny reality.
There is a pandemic going on.
Do you understand the concept of time?
For a substantial period of time we eliminated the disease from our communities.
Then later (before and after are relevant in the concept of time) once our population was vaccinated and once Omicron came along, we opened up our borders (no more quarantine) and no longer was elimination our goal.
When NZ eliminated the disease from our community, we did not eliminate it from the entire world. Even though we eliminated it from our community, there was still the real possibility that it comes back. Duh.
It's like a person having a flu. Their body fights off the infection and eliminates it from the person's body.
Then at a later time in the person's life they catch the flu virus again. Just because they caught it again, doesn't mean that they never eliminated it from their body in between.
Please just stop being so dishonest in your way of discussing things.
Death rates of Covid are way higher than for the fluThe pre-vaccination IFR was a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a percent. I already posted a study showing that earlier in the thread. Also, young, healthy people were never at a very high risk. In many cases, young, healthy people (and I'm talking about people all the way up to age 65 or 70 in most cases) had experienced higher mortality from the flu in prior years than they did from COVID.
I showed you the raw numbers and you complained.Except many of the excess deaths are not attributable to COVID. But you already knew that, since I already showed you.
Not at all. Because prevaccination deaths are orders of magnitude higher than post vaccination deaths.Good for you. Now, more than half of your population has been infected regardless of vaccination status, some multiple times. Your ostensible "elimination" was all for naught.
Death rates of Covid are way higher than for the flu
2017 total deaths 33,342
2018 total deaths 33,225
2019 total deaths 34,260
2020 total deaths 32,613
2021 total deaths 34,932
2022 total deaths 38,574
This shows that 2022 was unusually high, with approximately 4K more deaths than usual
And lo and behold, NZ had 3,944 Covid deaths in 2022.
Not at all. Because prevaccination deaths are orders of magnitude higher than post vaccination deaths.
Show many any statement I've made about smallpox that is innaccurate, rather than make a vacuous attack like this.
Focus on points, not on me.
There are two aspects in play. Vaccines effectiveness wanes over time (this is not unique to the Covid vaccine),
viruses, bacteria, fungus mutates over time. Omicron is more resistant to prior Covid vaccines and that is why there is the bivalent vaccine.
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