"Palin emerges with more clout"

[SOAD]

there is more to Christianity and acceptance in the existence of a higher power than what is written in the one book you reference.

There is the written word in the Bible, and a belief in God, and Jesus as the Savior. There is nothing else required to be a Christian except faith. No other books required.

 

[Nathan Poe]

OK, in the spirit of consistency, I will admit that post number 57 was out of line. However, there is more to Christianity and acceptance in the existence of a higher power than what is written in the one book you reference.

Which is why I didn't say "Christian," I said "fundie."

 

[KIYX]

Atheist only think they have the universe and everything in it all figured out. They don't, really.

I can tell you don't know any atheists.

 

[EdwinWillers]

It's hard to tell what impact the Palin/tea party effect really had -- I'd say it hurt the GOP more than it helped, actually.

Did the Palin/Tea Party support actually win any races where a moderate GOP "Rino" would've lost? I can't think of any cases.

OTOH, look at Angle in Nevada and O'Donnell in Delaware -- a moderate Republican might've taken Delaware, and could've easily taken Nevada (Reid's not all that popular down there, from what I've heard) But given the choice between Democrats and the Tea Party, Americans chose the lesser of two evils.

Well, the "lesser of two evils" stance is certainly debatable. What isn't debatable is the massive support Reid had from unions - and given unions are now pitching their 'plight' to the world for redress of their grievances here in America, it's not altogether improper to question their 'American' status in the first place.

What is also true is the utter hatred and contempt some in the GOP have for conservatives in their ranks. Elite careerists in the GOP don't care about much other than themselves being the ones keeping their seats warm in 'their' hallowed chambers.

The problem with the GOP is the insidious presence of such as these in its ranks who have no principles other than those which get them re-elected. They're neither a help to the GOP nor a help to America proper. Would that they would exile themselves to their posh country clubs and leave America to heal from their scourge.

GOP senators fight over failure - Jonathan Martin and Manu Raju - POLITICO.com

 

[lordbt]

A Harry Reid victory is actually a benefit to republicans in 2012. The same three figures--Pelosi, Reid, and Obama--that inspired much of the voter anger against the dems will still be around defending all the bad policies they rammed through congress. 2012 is going to look identical to 2010.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Well, the "lesser of two evils" stance is certainly debatable. What isn't debatable is the massive support Reid had from unions - and given unions are now pitching their 'plight' to the world for redress of their grievances here in America, it's not altogether improper to question their 'American' status in the first place.

So, unions are unAmerican because they're complaining?

By that rationale, the entire Tea Party should be deported and/or shot.

What is also true is the utter hatred and contempt some in the GOP have for conservatives in their ranks.

From what I've seen thus far, the feeling is more than mutual.

Elite careerists in the GOP don't care about much other than themselves being the ones keeping their seats warm in 'their' hallowed chambers.

We'll see if the Tea Party acts any different now that it's their rumps warming the seats.

The problem with the GOP is the insidious presence of such as these in its ranks who have no principles other than those which get them re-elected. They're neither a help to the GOP nor a help to America proper. Would that they would exile themselves to their posh country clubs and leave America to heal from their scourge.

Not saying I disagree -- just saying that five years from now, you'll be saying the exact same thing about the Tea Party politicians.

 

[Nathan Poe]

A Harry Reid victory is actually a benefit to republicans in 2012. The same three figures--Pelosi, Reid, and Obama--that inspired much of the voter anger against the dems will still be around defending all the bad policies they rammed through congress. 2012 is going to look identical to 2010.

Probably -- but it depends on what the GOP/Tea Party does or doesn't get done between now and then.

If nothing changes (and it probably won't) then voter anger is likely to be split between the Big bad Democrats with their bad policies, and the Tea Partiers who promised to fight those bad policies, but failed.

2010 elections were bad for the Dems, but should have been a lot worse -- I didn't expect them to keep either of the houses. If the Dems take a hint and shift closer to Center, then 2012 is still up in the air.

 

[EdwinWillers]

So, unions are unAmerican because they're complaining?

That's not what I said, anymore than it would be what you said were I to ask, 'So, it's American to complain?'

They're taking their grievances to the united nations for redress. That is un-American and worse - treasonous.

We'll see if the Tea Party acts any different now that it's their rumps warming the seats.

Not saying I disagree -- just saying that five years from now, you'll be saying the exact same thing about the Tea Party politicians.

That may very well be - the allure and addiction to absolute power that characterizes Washington these days due to its massive size and over-extended reach would taint all but the very strongest of individuals.

That is in fact THE REASON for limiting the size and power of the federal government - and the strongest argument for cutting it back to its constitutionally limited size there is.

If the size of our federal government corrupts the majority of those who enter it - which is in fact true and exactly what you are acknowledging - and if even those who stand for limited government cannot avoid the trap of its allure, I'd say we'd well and truly have a huge, huge problem on our hands - wouldn't you?

 

[Nathan Poe]

That's not what I said, anymore than it would be what you said were I to ask, 'So, it's American to complain?'

They're taking their grievances to the united nations for redress. That is un-American and worse - treasonous.

Well, that's what the UN is there for -- just because you despise it doesn't mean anything.

Unless you think "Bending over the table and taking it with a smile" is the American way -- the Tea party doesn't seem to think so, so why should the unions?

That may very well be - the allure and addiction to absolute power that characterizes Washington these days due to its massive size and over-extended reach would taint all but the very strongest of individuals.

It's been over 200 years since such individuals were involved in American politics -- I fear we're just not producing folks of that stock anymore.

That is in fact THE REASON for limiting the size and power of the federal government - and the strongest argument for cutting it back to its constitutionally limited size there is.

And the REASON we must do it is the very same REASON we can no longer do so -- quite the Catch-22 we find ourselves in.

If the size of our federal government corrupts the majority of those who enter it - which is in fact true and exactly what you are acknowledging - and if even those who stand for limited government cannot avoid the trap of its allure, I'd say we'd well and truly have a huge, huge problem on our hands - wouldn't you?

I would completely agree -- but alas, the trap has already been sprung.

 

[SOAD]

That's not what I said, anymore than it would be what you said were I to ask, 'So, it's American to complain?'

They're taking their grievances to the united nations for redress. That is un-American and worse - treasonous.

It is treasonous to address the United Nations?

Since you are throwing out accusations of treason, go ahead and present your case of why any of the orginizations planning to speak at the United Nations is treasonous.

 

[Jase]

It is treasonous to address the United Nations?

Since you are throwing out accusations of treason, go ahead and present your case of why any of the orginizations planning to speak at the United Nations is treasonous.

Yeah, I find this amusing, since we're one of the founders and permanent members of the UN. I like what the UN tries to accomplish (even though it's very hard to do much). I don't see how this is treason.

 

[EdwinWillers]

It's been over 200 years since such individuals were involved in American politics -- I fear we're just not producing folks of that stock anymore.

And the REASON we must do it is the very same REASON we can no longer do so -- quite the Catch-22 we find ourselves in.

I would completely agree -- but alas, the trap has already been sprung.

Sadly, you might be right. The individuals we need to be we no longer are - and probably haven't been for quite some time. As we've degenerated and left voids in the landscape of personal responsibility and integrity, the federal government has relentlessly siezed each opportunity and taken each one over willingly, incrementally expanding its power as we've incrementally abdicated it [to them].

The pain of recovery will be intense, but I still think there's hope. It's out of the pain of such struggle the sort of individuals are forged who can turn us around; but not before.

I don't think we're yet to the point that recovery necessarily demands a death and resurrection of our nation either; at least I hope not, for no nation can die and ever [hope to] resurrect itself anew; it merely dies, and that forever.

 

[variant]

O'Donnell's republican counterpart in Delaware would have lost, too. Some seats were not to be had by republicans period.

Delaware is not one of those seats.

Castle was a former governor and a former holder of the lone congressional district. It is not as if he would have found it hard to get elected.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Sadly, you might be right. The individuals we need to be we no longer are - and probably haven't been for quite some time. As we've degenerated and left voids in the landscape of personal responsibility and integrity, the federal government has relentlessly siezed each opportunity and taken each one over willingly, incrementally expanding its power as we've incrementally abdicated it [to them].

Well, let's not pretend that "the Federal government" is some kind of nebulous boogyman -- it's people just like us, who saw an opportunity for power and grabbed it, exploiting the apathy of the masses.

In the interest of personal responsibility, we must all admit that we brought this on ourselves.

The pain of recovery will be intense, but I still think there's hope. It's out of the pain of such struggle the sort of individuals are forged who can turn us around; but not before.

We shall see.

I don't think we're yet to the point that recovery necessarily demands a death and resurrection of our nation either; at least I hope not, for no nation can die and ever [hope to] resurrect itself anew; it merely dies, and that forever.

But we can come pretty close to the brink sometimes -- witness the Civil War.

Hopefully, our own recovery won't be quite so dramatic.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Delaware is not one of those seats.

Castle was a former governor and a former holder of the lone congressional district. It is not as if he would have found it hard to get elected.

Haven't polls been posted (if not here, than in other threads) that show Castle would've won had he run?

 

[EdwinWillers]

Well, let's not pretend that "the Federal government" is some kind of nebulous boogyman -- it's people just like us, who saw an opportunity for power and grabbed it, exploiting the apathy of the masses.

In the interest of personal responsibility, we must all admit that we brought this on ourselves.

I absolutely agree; and to turn it around we need as one step to resume the reigns of personal responsibility rather than cast it onto a federal government just waiting to take it. The federal government is what it is because we don't want to be what we're supposed to be - responsible for our own lives.

The 'pain' we need to experience is the consequences of our own apathy and irresponsibility. At the same time, we need to de-construct the constitutionally illegitimate structures we allowed the federal government to erect. Whether they must be done consecutively or concurrently is open to discuss; but both must happen to aright what is obviously a capsized ship - top heavy at the helm and dangerously light in the hull.

But we can come pretty close to the brink sometimes -- witness the Civil War.

Hopefully, our own recovery won't be quite so dramatic.

I don't know - I hope so too. Whether in conflict or depression, something's gotta give, and I think it's gonna be in the economy personally.

 

[variant]

Haven't polls been posted (if not here, than in other threads) that show Castle would've won had he run?

He would have won easily.

This was about the Tea Party being unhappy with a moderate republican representing a state with those same political sentiments. So they helped a democrat get elected instead.

 

[lordbt]

He would have won easily.

This was about the Tea Party being unhappy with a moderate republican representing a state with those same political sentiments. So they helped a democrat get elected instead.

The point of the tea party wasnt to just get anyone with an R next to their name elected. There was a good deal of anger at republican politicians as well. Castle was the typical, establishment backed, career politician that so many people find objectionable. Would he have won? Who knows? And who cares? Putting back in power the type of republican who was tossed out in '06 and '08 was not exactly the type of change the TP was looking for.

 

[brindisi]

He would have won easily.

This was about the Tea Party being unhappy with a moderate republican representing a state with those same political sentiments. So they helped a democrat get elected instead.

It would be no victory for the Tea Party or conservatism to fill up the halls of congress with "Republicans" who believe in big, unrestrained government every bit as much as Democrats.

 

[tanzanos]

Yeah, I find this amusing, since we're one of the founders and permanent members of the UN. I like what the UN tries to accomplish (even though it's very hard to do much). I don't see how this is treason.

The US congress authorised the use of the METRIC system in 1866, yet they still cling to the illogical and impractical imperial system. I suppose that anyone using the Metric system in the US would be considered Un-American too and treasonous. I wonder how many people can correlate 1 pound of water to fluid ounces? Or 50 & 16/32 square feet to square inches?