Overcoming sin

[Andrew]

Yes, I agree you may go crazy for a while ...
and maybe for a very lonnggggg while ...
and hit a very low emotional and spiritual bottom ...
experiencing much self-hatred and self-condemnation ...
and a deep sense of isolation from others and distance from God ...

... IF the sin being discussed is an addictive behavior.

just a gentle warning ...
shared in love.

I think the sin being discussed is an addiction. When a Christian cannot overcome a sin and needs to talk about it and ask for help, you can be sure it's an addiction.

And yes, most people are 'afraid' of grace. They usu misunderstand it as a 'licence' to sin.

Well, all I can say is that Paul faced the same problem when he preached grace and said "Cast out the bondwoman! [law]" Many people misunderstood him and said, "What! Sin more that grace may abound?"

As my signature says, "You are not free from sin until you are free to sin."

Cheers

 

[foadle]

I think the sin being discussed is an addiction. When a Christian cannot overcome a sin and needs to talk about it and ask for help, you can be sure it's an addiction.

And yes, most people are 'afraid' of grace. They usu misunderstand it as a 'licence' to sin.

Well, all I can say is that Paul faced the same problem when he preached grace and said "Cast out the bondwoman! [law]" Many people misunderstood him and said, "What! Sin more that grace may abound?"

As my signature says, "You are not free from sin until you are free to sin."

Cheers

I know it is (or has been) an addiction. While I agree with what you are saying about grace I must add that there is something in me that desires total perfection and is upset when I fall short of that. I am always being told by friends not to be too hard on myself and I think I am getting better but I just thought I would be open and truthful with you.

 

[Andrew]

I know it is (or has been) an addiction. While I agree with what you are saying about grace I must add that there is something in me that desires total perfection and is upset when I fall short of that. I am always being told by friends not to be too hard on myself and I think I am getting better but I just thought I would be open and truthful with you.

You desire total perfection?

You'll never get there.

You just have to accept that you are there already.

Let me ask you: "Is Jesus perfectly accepted before the Father?"

So are you in this world.

"Is Jesus perfect before the Father?"

So are you in this world.

Your standing before the Father is wrapped up in Christ. There is no other way.

By one perfect sacrifice, He has perfected you forever!

Heb 10:14-15
14 For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified. (NASB)

You are already perfected, sanctified by Christ. It is His work, not yours.

You'll never find any perfection when you look at yourself. In your flesh dwells no good thing. The more you look inward at yourself, the more ugliness you will find.

Look instead to Jesus. He is like a perfect diamond. Every which way you turn Him, He is glorious.

And you are in Him. He is in you. Keep your eyes on Him and His finished work. Not your works, not what you have done right or done wrong -- all that is sickly sentimentalism and self-righteousness.

 

[KleinerApfel]

Hi Foadle,

I am rejoicing to see you receive a greater revelation of God's grace.
Looks like a breakthrough is happening for you right now.

It's a wonderful journey to be taking - I've been on the road of amazing grace a short time myself - just to believe that God wants to bless me not judge me, that there is no condemnation left for me - NONE! SUCH a relief! Jesus took it ALL for me, and for you.

It's a paradigm shift for some of us, but so awesome. Bask in the warmth of the revelation, keep on allowing yourself to receive and be built up by His outpouring.
God is awesome.

God bless you, love Sue

 

[foadle]

I receive grace a lot better now than I once did. When I first came to Mount Isa five years ago I truly believed that I was unlovable. My way of thinking was that if I could not be loved by imperfect people how much less could I be loved by a perfect God. Then God brought a very amazing woman into my life who did love me and I could find no excuse for why she should. Even when I told her about this very issue (thinking that if she knew the truth she could no longer love me) she continued to love me. It was a very hard time in my life. My whole way of thinking had to change. Suddenly I found myself starting to accept that if I could be loved by imperfect people how much more by a perfect God. I am still growing in that and all who know me would tell you how much I have changed in the last few years. Still there is a long way to go.
God is doing a great work in me and I do my best to allow him to carry it out to its fullest completion.
For me though and maybe this is wrong thinking tell me if it is, I believe that because God already sees us as perfect I want to do all I can to be deserving of a title I can never really deserve. When I fall down in "minor" areas that's sort of okay because we can work on that but when it is in the same area all the time I get so angry with myself. I feel I shame the very grace God has given me because the grace is there but I use it on the same issure repeatedly. Thus I desire perfection. I know I will never get there but should I not at least aspire to that?

 

[mourningdove~]

As my signature says, "You are not free from sin until you are free to sin."

I'm enjoying your discussion on grace.

I would have been dead a long time ago were it not for Grace.

Is there a Scripture reference for your signature quote, Andrew?

Thanks and God bless.

 

[foadle]

It is funny really because while grace has been such a struggle for me in the past it is becoming one I struggle with less and less. It is becoming easier to just accept it. I think this must be what they mean when they are talking about "growing in grace"

 

[Joseph_84]

Hi Foadle,

Let me first say I am sorry that you feel conflicted on this issue. I myself have been dealing with an issue of my recent past that I have been condemning myself over, but I was only watching Pastor Creflo A Dollar on God TV today and these scripture references he pointed out gave me undeniable hope in Christ's promise. I hope they help you too.

God Bless,

Joseph

Isaiah 43:25-26 25 I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins. 26 Put me in remembrance: let us plead together: declare thou, that thou mayest be justified.

 

[foadle]

I also watch Creflo but here it is on Imparja (a local station). Much of what he has to say is quite encouraging especially recently

 

[Andrew]

I'm enjoying your discussion on grace.

I would have been dead a long time ago were it not for Grace.

Is there a Scripture reference for your signature quote, Andrew?

Thanks and God bless.

Gal 5:1
Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondage.
NKJV

Gal 5:13-14
13 For you, brethren, have been called to liberty; only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.
NKJV

1 Cor 6:12-13
12 "Everything is permissible for me"-but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"-but I will not be mastered by anything.
(from New International Version)

1 Cor 10:23-24
"Everything is permissible"-but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible"-but not everything is constructive.
(from New International Version)

Christ has set us free. Only don't use this freedom to do bad but good.

 

[Andrew]

It is becoming easier to just accept it. I think this must be what they mean when they are talking about "growing in grace"

There are 2 ways a Christian can grow in grace:

1. By knowing Jesus and His perfect work more, grace is multiplied in your life.

2 Peter 1:2-3
2 Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, [the Greek is actually knowledge of God who is Jesus our Lord]


2. By resting in the finished work of Christ -- the Gospel of grace and peace

Gen 6:8
8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.

Noah means 'rest'. Rest found grace. Rest in the Lord and His perfect sacrifice. Enter that rest and you will find grace.

The more you study Christ crucified and the gospel (it is called the gospel of grace), the more grace will be multiplied in your life.

The promised land in the OT is a picture of rest. Live in houses you did not build and drink from wells you did not dig. It is a completed work. It is a finished work. To enter into it, from desert to promised land, they had only to believe God -- that God is that good. But they didn't and died in the desert.

That's why Hebrews says, "Today, when you hear his voice, do not hardern your hearts like your forefathers did in the desert."

Today, the promised land is the rest of God. The finished work is the perfect work of Christ at that cross. We labour to enter that rest. That is the only labouring we do. We labour to enter that rest.

Stop trying to be perfect. Stop trying to be holy. Stop trying to be sanctified. Stop trying to get God to like you. It is already done for you. You simply enter into it and enjoy the house you did not build and drink from wells you did not dig. Jesus has done it all. He cried out "It is finished!"

He has sat down at the Father's right hand -- rest. The OT priests had to keep standing becos their work was never could never be finished, not with the blood of animals.

But Christ blood is eternal. He sat down. And we sit down with him -- His rest. Come to me all you who labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Cease from your works, and enter His rest.

A Christian at rest is most effective.

 

[foadle]

That is what I mean by I think I am growing in grace - I am learning to accept that I am not perfect (though that is no reason to sin for the sake of it), that God has done all that can ever be done. While I still struggle with things the particular cause of this thread seems to have disippated into not being an issue. Something I could never have said about this area of my life before. Still that is only a week. But God is good and in control. Thank you everyone for you input on my behalf.

 

[mourningdove~]

A Christian at rest is most effective.

You've hit on something quite profound here.

(Seems there may be too few of us Christians "at rest" in The Treasure that is already ours?)

Addictive behaviors are driven by alot of things - but one thing, I believe, is the drive found in many of our cultures "to succeed", "to achieve", "to be" something.

And then there are the drives "to be loved", "to be accepted", "to have purpose and meaning" in life, etc.

Truth is, as followers of Jesus Christ, we already have all these things in Him. The Scriptures bear truth to this.

How good it is to be reminded to just "stop" - break out of the addictive thinking cycle - and just reflect on, and "rest" in, all that we already have in Him.

 

[foadle]

It is not that easy just to stop. I have tried for twenty years to just stop!

 

[mourningdove~]

It is not that easy just to stop. I have tried for twenty years to just stop!

Oh, no, no foadle. That's not what I meant, when I mentioned "stopping". I obviously didn't make my thoughts clear in my post.

The comments I made were in response to Andrew's simple, but powerful comment that "a Christian at rest is most effective".

I was speaking in general about stopping and taking the time in general to "rest" in Christ. Aside from some of the more obvious addictions, many of us are caught up in addictive life cycles and addictive ways of thinking. It was from this perspective that I was saying that it is good at times (for many of us) to just "stop" and "rest" in Him.

Sorry for the confusion. I never meant to imply that you should just be able to stop.

 

[danzr41audience]

I'm new, but I found this thread right away and it's I also struggle to accept. The truth is, it's done. Too late. Striving in our works, and straining against worldly thoughts, can't get us very far, and I've done so much striving I actually ended up mentally and physical exhausted. Christ is the Only one who made it out of here without giving in to temptation.

 

[foadle]

I have found this thread of great use danz I hope you come often to read the updates and just be uplifted. I have found CF and this thread a great blessing. People are so honest in their offers of help.

 

[Joseph_84]

I have found this thread of great use danz I hope you come often to read the updates and just be uplifted. I have found CF and this thread a great blessing. People are so honest in their offers of help.

Foadle,

You are right that these threads are a blessing. Sometimes discussing one another's situations can actually even help you understand your own situation better.

I for one haven't got the same problem, but I do struggle with my own battles and I can relate to the feelings being expressed by everyone.

God Bless,

Joseph

 

[foadle]

I have been finding just that. In the past when I thought I had beaten this area of sin I somehow knew that it would be just a matter of time before it arose again. Something over the past week has changed in me though. I can't really say what but that I am certain it has been brought on by my fellowship here. This time I am not trying to overcome the sin. My whole outlook on life has changed and though it be only a bit over a week sins last I fought with this and lost somehow I "Know in my knower" (as Creflo says) that this is beaten and I didn't have to do anything in that process. For the first time in decades I can say it is not a concern.
In fact I was in a position just the other day that would have had me falling back into the same area of sin that has been dragging me down. And you know what it didn't even cross my mind until a couple of days later what had happened. How good is God?

 

[irenemcg]

Isa 61:1 "The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon Me,
Because the LORD has anointed Me
To preach good tidings to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives,
And the opening of the prison to those who are bound;
Luk 4:18 "The Spirit of the LORD is upon Me,
Because He has anointed Me
To preach the gospel to the poor;
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives
And recovery of sight to the blind,
To set at liberty those who are oppressed;
Luk 4:19 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD."

Jesus wants to set the captives free. Many Christians are bound up with hurts from their pasts and they are actually like captives to their pasts, they don't have the liberty and freedom they should in the Holy Spirit because of past hurts, past sins.

Eph 6:12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.

Satan will try any method he can to drive us away from God, by making us think that we are not worthy of the Lord for any purpose. He'll try to make us feel as though we aren't deserving of God's love.
Jesus came to set us free from all the captivity and bondage of the past. We wrestle against principalities and powers. If you are plagued by things from your past, things of the old man, you need to be set free. If you have ever dabbled in the occult, if you have been abused, involved in sexual immorality it may be that things from your past still haunt you. Jesus came to set you free from all that. The devil and his minnions will persuade you that you are a product of your past, but you are a new creation in Christ.

2Ti 4:18 And the Lord will deliver me from every evil work and preserve me for His heavenly kingdom. To Him be glory forever and ever. Amen!

Joh 8:36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.

It is not God's will that you should be in captivity, the Lord wants to deliver you and set you free.

Rom 8:37 Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us.

2Co 10:3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh.
2Co 10:4 For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds,
2Co 10:5 casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ,
2Co 10:6 and being ready to punish all disobedience when your obedience is fulfilled.

Do you see that. The weapons of warfare we have are not carnal but mighty in God. We must cast down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bring into "captivity" every thought to the obedience of Christ. That means that any thought that is not of God, such as evil imaginations, wrong patterns of thinking, disbelief, confusion and spirits of its like, must be utterly cast down.

The verb "captive" in the Hebrew means: "To be a prisoner of war", "to lead away captive", "to bring under control", or signifies, "to take men alive." All of these things, Satan will try to do to men and women to destroy us.

You may ask if it is possible for someone who is born again, still to be in bondage. I believe it is. We need to allow the Holy Spirit to do the work in us and set us free.

Heb 2:5 For He has not put the world to come, of which we speak, in subjection to angels.
Heb 2:6 But one testified in a certain place, saying:
"What is man that You are mindful of him,
Or the son of man that You take care of him?
Heb 2:7 You have made him a little lower than the angels;
You have crowned him with glory and honor,
And set him over the works of Your hands.
Heb 2:8 You have put all things in subjection under his feet."
For in that He put all in subjection under him, He left nothing that is not put under him. But now we do not yet see all things put under him.
Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone.


We have a Great High Priest, Jesus himself who has put all things in subjection under His feet. All things are under Him. We are His children, all things therefore are placed under our feet too, because we are in Him.

1Jo 5:4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world--our faith.

We are no longer in darkness, we are born of God. We are to be overcomers. Do you see how we overcome? We overcome by faith. If you still feel opressed after praying for deliverance and to be set free, I suggest you speak to your Pastor and or the elders of your church and ask them to pray with you.

HE CAME TO SET THE CAPTIVES FREE. HALLELUJAH!