Ostracism and how it affects people

Can relate. I can also relate to MacFall's opinion. When I was younger I was ostracized, and it hurt, but over the years things changed I guess. Now the thought of being part of a close-knit group of "friends" just makes me sort of sick to my stomach. It may be that I have an advanced case of anti-social tendencies, but, whatever... most people tend to make me miserable over time and I'm happier with just a few close connections.

Nanopants said:

Now the thought of being part of a close-knit group of "friends" just makes me sort of sick to my stomach. It may be that I have an advanced case of anti-social tendencies, but, whatever...

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That is very sad It's so vital for people to have a group to belong to that loves and accepts them. People are social animals and need a community to be healthy the same way they need vitamins and nutrients. The need for social interaction and support is so important that studies have found social isolation is as dangerous as smoking 15 cigarettes a day, as bad as being an alcoholic, and twice as dangerous as being obese.

I don't think it's helpful to start throwing around personality disorders or mental illnesses. When people get ostracized they find ways to cope, there's no mystery to it. It doesn't need to be some spooky disorder, it's just a natural means of coping with an unkind world.

It's tragic when kids get ostracized by other kinds and never recover. Kids are savage creatures and are too stupid and selfish to do anything but hurt each other most of the time. People do grow up, though, and it's worth it as an adult to give socializing a chance. There are too many wonderful people out there to simply write off the entire world because of the way little kids acted. It's a natural response to do so, but a tragic one.

Ethnog said:

I have a question: What about people who choose to isolate themselves? No matter how much help they get, how much love their receive, its always about them and never giving back. When you give, you receive, not because you want to or because you do it to get something in return, but its a natural cause and effect. Now I understand that some people are intentionally ostracized, abandoned and that is so different and you SEE the effects it causes. But what about those who are not, and yet feel the same effects?

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Even that begins with people ostracizing you much of the time. When people abuse you for long enough, you tend to withdraw from people as much as possible, and where it is unavoidable, you pray to only be ostracized instead of being actively targeted. It's still not pleasant, but it's better to be left alone than to be the target of active abuse.

This was my life for most of K-12. Thankfully, God gave me some help and in the years since I've been able to put together a social life in the context of church. I still have trouble accepting general invites which are not specified to me, and asking women out though. And my view of humanity is rather . . . dim.

I've felt ostracized for most of my life, not that it is premeditated but I do find myself usually ignored and alone. Being ostracized has its benefits.. I feel like I'm able to think for myself more. When everyone around you ignores you, the pressure to conform usually diminishes.. I feel less sorry about hurting others peoples feelings when spouting out my opinions on various subjects like religion and ways to live. One of my coping methods is "if I can't join their club I'll create my own." This has resulted in me trying to come up with my own philosophy.

I admit sometimes I want to kill myself but I think in the long run it will make me a better person. Some people go insane, some people mature and grow and some people quietly rot until they expire lol.

The only thing I wish is that I had a group of outcasts who would accept me, but alas I don't even get that. I'm working on it though.

if i had never felt ostracism when i was younger, i think i would never have been introspective and seeing another side of life other than the culture of pleasure and distraction

i have been ostracized a few times. this topic is very relevant to the current state of my life as well. the difference this time is that i haven't given people the chance to abandon me first. even though it still hurts a lot, the fact that it is self imposed also helps in a way. you don't have to feel the pain of rejection if you just assume they will hate you. you don't get confirmation and that harsh slap of reality of what they might really be like.

i don't know if i fit into your topic though since i do have mental disorders that shade my views.

Sketcher said:

Even that begins with people ostracizing you much of the time. When people abuse you for long enough, you tend to withdraw from people as much as possible, and where it is unavoidable, you pray to only be ostracized instead of being actively targeted. It's still not pleasant, but it's better to be left alone than to be the target of active abuse.

This was my life for most of K-12. Thankfully, God gave me some help and in the years since I've been able to put together a social life in the context of church. I still have trouble accepting general invites which are not specified to me, and asking women out though. And my view of humanity is rather . . . dim.

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I can relate. It was the worst for me during the elementary school and middle school years. Although high school was better, I have no desire to attend reunions or otherwise socialize with the people who weren't my friends.

Curiously, I got along well with the the kids at summer camp, and it seemed like everybody was my friend in college.

I've had my asocial moments, but don't think I've ever been antisocial. An asocial person will avoid interacting with people, perhaps because they'd rather avoid the potential pain that comes from it, but they don't necessarily harbor ill will toward humanity. For example, if the kids who taunted me in elementary school had hurt themselves, I would have come to their aid. I just didn't appreciate being subjected to their verbal, and later physical, assaults. I eventually fought back and they stopped, but the fact that people can be so cruel left me somewhat disillusioned.

blind post: I think it can happen in all stages of life and even on-line. Mostly I see ostracism as ignoring individuals- they aren't noticed, passed over, are not included, intentionally or unintentionally. It's hard to feel any feeling of worth when no one ever talks to you or acknowledges what you say or do. Adults ostrasize others; it probably even happens on this forum.

In life excluding people is horrid. Its seen even in these forums. People who you want to meet? what award you getting? um...It's mostly for fun and that's cool, but we do exclude people sometimes unintentionally without even noticing it.

It's not that we are doing it to be mean or because we are evil, but it's seen through out our whole lives...In playyards, school, highschool clicks, the top pics of ncaa, nba, nfl...I mean everything in life seems to revolve around excluding people.

We have this thing about looking for the best choice in everything. Might not necessarily be Ostracism as it was more a means to keep the peace between politicians and other things. (According to Wikipedia...Ostracism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, but yes it can hurt feelings and make some people feeling poopy. Some don't take things so seriously, but people like acceptance in the world and when a person isn't accepted you feel excluded, rejected therefore feeling horrid, bad, worthless...etc. Yes it happens, but we must learn that society works in these manners and as horrid as it might be... we must live, learn and take one step at a time. Move forward not backwards. Don't let that get to you. Just keep going.

Please don't bash me on the head for what I said. I said it with love...not meant for anyone in particular, but just observatory.

Queenaharts30 said:

In life excluding people is horrid. Its seen even in these forums. People who you want to meet? what award you getting? um...It's mostly for fun and that's cool, but we do exclude people sometimes unintentionally without even noticing it.

It's not that we are doing it to be mean or because we are evil, but it's seen through out our whole lives...In playyards, school, highschool clicks, the top pics of ncaa, nba, nfl...I mean everything in life seems to revolve around excluding people.

We have this thing about looking for the best choice in everything. Might not necessarily be Ostracism as it was more a means to keep the peace between politicians and other things. (According to Wikipedia...Ostracism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, but yes it can hurt feelings and make some people feeling poopy. Some don't take things so seriously, but people like acceptance in the world and when a person isn't accepted you feel excluded, rejected therefore feeling horrid, bad, worthless...etc. Yes it happens, but we must learn that society works in these manners and as horrid as it might be... we must live, learn and take one step at a time. Move forward not backwards. Don't let that get to you. Just keep going.

Please don't bash me on the head for what I said. I said it with love...not meant for anyone in particular, but just observatory.

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I don't think excluding people is horrible. Not everyone needs to be involved in everything. And rejection is only a blow to your ego when you allow yourself to think in terms of other people's perception of you being the truth or mattering greatly.

I think if our culture weren't so dependent on being happy and getting everything our way that we would be stronger minded and a more responsible world.

I'm not going to bash, but I do think people are too quick to jump on the "you're leaving people out" wagon. Threads about meeting people/awards, the nature of those threads is to select people you actively want to vote for/meet.

A few people are highly sensitive to it, and I think that can lead to people kicking cans around singing about nobody loving them, everyone hating them, just because they eat worms. It is a representation of friendship groups/personalities which reflect who gels with who, who makes an impression. It's far too common for people to feel pressured to include everyone and you can't do that, I do feel people should be taught that it's OK not to be included in everything, that it's OK if everyone doesn't get on with you or want to be your friend, that you can be cordial with them and not have to be included on their Top 10 Friends list.

I have seen a lot of children/young people who complain about being left out who simply do not know how to interact with people in order to be included; people may try to interact with them but if they are doing the majority of the work to include them then people can get the impression the individual does not wish to be included. Difficult, prolonged, and it requires someone with the right personality to bring them into the realm of inclusion and happy thoughts.

Unintentional ostracism is part of life, we do place too much attention on being included in everything and too little on how to cope when we are not, or even how to be included in the first place.

When people are deliberately ostracised, excluded from everything, it is horrible and very damaging. That is wrong, more so because you are intentionally seeking to cut them off from the social interaction the individual wants/needs.

As for self ostracisation;

Our interviews suggest that these individuals no longer seek others for support or companionship; they are no longer socially compliant or aggressive. Instead, they self-ostracize, perhaps avoiding further rejection by preempting the possibility of acceptance.

Furthermore, they report a substantial rate of depression, suicidal ideation, suicide attempts, eating disorders, and short-term promiscuity. They feel little ability to change their situation, and have resigned themselves to feeling unworthy of attention at all.

Clearly, the repeated themes emerging from these letters and interviews must be treated with caution: there is no way to determine cause and effect. It is just as plausible that ostracism leads to depression as depression leads to ostracism. It is likely that both co-occur, resulting in a vicious cycle.

http://research.chicagobooth.edu/cdr/docs/SocialDeath-Williams.pdf

You have to be careful when deciding someone who self-ostracises has antisocial personality disorder, or anything else for that matter, it influences how you deal with them and that can be devastating for the individual involved. But even then you can't really start jumping to "well, people do that because ..." as you simply don't know, to know why you have to spend time with them, and to spend time with them you have to break down the wall. That's hard.

I'll be back, with edits.

Socktastic said:

I'm not going to bash, but I do think people are too quick to jump on the "you're leaving people out" wagon. Threads about meeting people/awards, the nature of those threads is to select people you actively want to vote for/meet.

A few people are highly sensitive to it, and I think that can lead to people kicking cans around singing about nobody loving them, everyone hating them, just because they eat worms. It is a representation of friendship groups/personalities which reflect who gels with who, who makes an impression. It's far too common for people to feel pressured to include everyone and you can't do that, I do feel people should be taught that it's OK not to be included in everything, that it's OK if everyone doesn't get on with you or want to be your friend, that you can be cordial with them and not have to be included on their Top 10 Friends list..."

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Agreed.