Orwell's 1984, have you read it?

[vajradhara]

Namaste all,

I'll see if i can make this into a poll but i'm curious to know how many people have read George Orwell's 1984?

If you have, what are your views regarding the society which is depicted in the novel?

 

[Arthra]

Yep I read Orwell's "1984" away back in 1957 when it was still twenty years away... and yep it had a profound influence on my thinking. You see i was in HIgh School at the time and the cold war was going and so one of the comparisons I drew was the conflict between Oceania and Eurasia in 1984 and the cold war then going on between the Societ Union/ China and the former British ares and America on the other. So yes it had an impact in my thinking...and of course the otehr similarity was how "Big Broher" being able to spy on the citizens in the book which of course was similar to our current eaves dropping techniques of today..

There were of course a few ways Orwell's 1984 didn't really pan out... No one is really anti-sex or trying to control sexual relationships as much as 1984 and while it's possible we could slip into a fascist dictatorship it hasn't really happened yet... finally the internationalism we have today wasn't really foreseen I think by Orwell.

Another book though was also very prophetic I think was Aldous Huxley's "Brave New World"... Here I think that has in a way been realized in our advances in genetic engineering and growing dependence on chemicals and pharmaceuticals. Society is pleasure seeking and probably going in that direction.

- Art

 

[Isambard]

I have 1984 but I havent read it. I remember when I read the synopsis I said, "Ahhh! So thats were Saudi Arabia got its gov't planning model!"

 

[psychedelicist]

i have read it and remember it being pretty influential to me but its been so long that i cant remember it very well

 

[Beanieboy]

I think it is a commentary on Society. Animal Farm, as you may recall, was about a revolution of the animals, and an elite group slowly morphed into the very oppressors that they overthrew.

In 1984, news is doctored so that society believes what is printed, and doubting what they know to be true. People are to report anyone who is breaking the rule of thinking for themselves and reading.

Today, does anyone know what is really happening with the war in Iraq? Does anyone trust the US news anymore? When you watch the documentary The Control Room, you see the BBC and other non-American countries reporting a much different story.

Who do we believe? If you protest the war, you are branded UnAmerican. Americans are encouraged to spy on their neighbors, and report any suspicion of terrorism.

It's a culture of fear. The government has been found intercepting emails illegally, tapping phones randomly... all the while claiming to be fighting for Freedom, while eroding it.

 

[Montalban]

My thoughts on the book...?

It was double plus good

 

[Eudaimonist]

I'll see if i can make this into a poll but i'm curious to know how many people have read George Orwell's 1984?

Yes, I have. Several times.

If you have, what are your views regarding the society which is depicted in the novel?

Oceania is doubleplusgood, comrade!

Just kidding. I wouldn't last two seconds in such a society. Have you read Ayn Rand's dystopian novel Anthem? I would have the same difficulties there.

My view of such dystopian worlds is that they exist philosophically on what Ayn Rand calls the mystic-altruist-collectivist axis. They attempt to contradict reality by collectivizing the way in which knowledge is gained and validated in order to control human individuals and cause them to serve the State, meaning of course the people in charge in the Inner Party.

There is a deep relationship between the willingness of people to think for themselves, and political freedom. I recommend that you read the following article to learn more:

http://www.objectivistcenter.org/ct...d_Politics_Ayn_Rands_Cultural_Commentary.aspx


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[InnocentOdion]

If you have, what are your views regarding the society which is depicted in the novel?

Pretty scary. Check this out for scary similarities too
http://www.newspeakdictionary.com/go-now.html

 

[Montalban]

Pretty scary. Check this out for scary similarities too

Big Brother is watching you!

 

[vajradhara]

Namaste all,

thank you all for the responses.

from what i gather most respondents wouldn't be keen to live within such a society as depicted in the book.

if you knew that a group or organization had that very plan and was actively working towards making it a reality would you do something to prevent it?

Mark, no i've not read that book of hers and i'll certainly check out that link.

metta,

~v

 

[Rasta]

I've read it. It's a good book.

And, no, I would not want to live there. I value free thought.

 

[MercuryAndy]

Yep I read Orwell's "1984" away back in 1957 when it was still twenty years away... and yep it had a profound influence on my thinking. You see i was in HIgh School at the time and the cold war was going and so one of the comparisons I drew was the conflict between Oceania and Eurasia in 1984 and the cold war then going on between the Societ Union/ China and the former British ares and America on the other. So yes it had an impact in my thinking...and of course the otehr similarity was how "Big Broher" being able to spy on the citizens in the book which of course was similar to our current eaves dropping techniques of today..

There were of course a few ways Orwell's 1984 didn't really pan out... No one is really anti-sex or trying to control sexual relationships as much as 1984 and while it's possible we could slip into a fascist dictatorship it hasn't really happened yet... finally the internationalism we have today wasn't really foreseen I think by Orwell.

Another book though was also very prophetic I think was Aldous Huxley's "Brave New World"... Here I think that has in a way been realized in our advances in genetic engineering and growing dependence on chemicals and pharmaceuticals. Society is pleasure seeking and probably going in that direction.

- Art

indeed i agree with your opinion on a brave new world. However I think it must be remembered that infact the social divides were still existant when it was written but in my opinion they have widened further.

 

[Montalban]

BUMP

My thoughts on the book...?

It was double plus good

No one got my joke

 

[vajradhara]

BUMP




No one got my joke

Namaste Montalban,

oh.. a few of us got it, i think

you'd have to remember the book though... or have recently read up on Newspeak.

metta,

~v

 

[Montalban]

oh.. a few of us got it, i think

you'd have to remember the book though... or have recently read up on Newspeak.

Yes, Newspeak was essential to control. By reducing the vocabulary they took away man's ability to think creatively and thus to (potentially) start thinking about issues such as "Is this the best life I can have?"

"Double plus good" was a great way of reducing the vocabulary, getting rid of words such as 'exquisite' and 'excellent'.

I think it has relevancy today in that the media uses phrases such as "near miss" for 'near hits' of aircraft.

Or other loaded terms viz. "suicide bomber", "homophobia".

And the amount of times people use the word "evolution" or "evolving" to non-biological situations I think helps people accept biological evolution as a given.

 

[Rasta]

I think it has relevancy today in that the media uses phrases such as "near miss" for 'near hits' of aircraft.

We can learn a lot from stand up. It makes for a funny joke too.

Or other loaded terms viz. "suicide bomber", "homophobia".

What do you mean by this?

And the amount of times people use the word "evolution" or "evolving" to non-biological situations I think helps people accept biological evolution as a given.

Who is doing this?

 

[keith99]

Yep I read Orwell's "1984" away back in 1957 when it was still twenty years away... and yep it had a profound influence on my thinking. You see i was in HIgh School at the time and the cold war was going and so one of the comparisons I drew was the conflict between Oceania and Eurasia in 1984 and the cold war then going on between the Societ Union/ China and the former British ares and America on the other. So yes it had an impact in my thinking...and of course the otehr similarity was how "Big Broher" being able to spy on the citizens in the book which of course was similar to our current eaves dropping techniques of today..

There were of course a few ways Orwell's 1984 didn't really pan out... No one is really anti-sex or trying to control sexual relationships as much as 1984 and while it's possible we could slip into a fascist dictatorship it hasn't really happened yet... finally the internationalism we have today wasn't really foreseen I think by Orwell.

Another book though was also very prophetic I think was Aldous Huxley's "Brave New World"... Here I think that has in a way been realized in our advances in genetic engineering and growing dependence on chemicals and pharmaceuticals. Society is pleasure seeking and probably going in that direction.

- Art

It has been a long time since any of these. If memory serves 1984 really lacks much of the shock of "Brave New World". 1984 was always nasty. Brave New World starts with such hope. Did not the hero, the savage, say something like "Such a brave new world with such wonderful people in it!". But in the end we see something much different, we wonder just who was savage. And of course an ending like.. North, Northeast, East, Southeast, South, Southwest... is rather depressing. As it should be.

 

[keith99]

My thoughts on the book...?

It was double plus good

+1000

Just saying looks like we are heading towards one thing from the book!

 

[Montalban]

What do you mean by this?

A suicide bomber is not a 'suicide' - a suicide is where someone's bascially tired of life and commits this act out of depression. They're a 'martyr' someone who kills themselves for a purpose. Thus Moslems apologists can argue that suicide bombers are against the Koran, because 'suicide' is against the Koran.

Homophobia - a phobia is a fear and alludes to an irrational response.

Who is doing this?

Many people talk of 'society' evolving. Computer (design) has evolved, etc.

 

[vajradhara]

Namaste Montalban,

thank you for the post.

ah.. i thought you were going to go down the homicide bomber route..

a suicide bomber only kills themselves whereas a homicide bomber kills others and kills themselves in the process.

metta,

~v