Thanks! I guess my question would be, what impact does the Orthodox belief in the Energies of God have on our soteriology?
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Now, with regard to your question as to how "how the belief in indulgences could get in the way of Orthodox theology dealing with the Energies of God," I cannot say, because I cannot discern any way in which the notion of indulgences, which Orthodox Christianity does not share, and the energies of God connect. I suppose that one could argue that the superabundant "merits" possessed by Christ -- merits He obviously does not need for Himself -- could be, if one so chose, considered among His "energies," and that one could deduce that those who reject His merits -- unrepentant sinners -- somehow refuse to know God because they refuse to accept His "merits," or something to this effect, but the fact remains that, since in Orthodox theology there is no intersection between God's energies and "merits" -- in part because the whole "merit" thing is foreign -- there is no conflict since the "merit/purgation" thing does not exist in the first place. As I said, if someone chooses to consider "merits" as an "energy" of God -- which Orthodox Christianity wouldn't -- then one could, in the end, deduce that God's "energies" can only become effective or manifest if one chooses to embrace them, but in the end, this would be to say that God's actions/energies/activities can be limited by the human will and require ascent on the part of humans in order to be "activated," or some such bla bla. So I can't really say how belief in indulgences would get in the way of God's energies, since there de facto is no connection in Orthodox theology -- unless I missed something when I was in seminary.
Hope this helps.
From listening to my bishop speak a few months ago on the differences between the western approach and the Orthodox approach, he said the two approaches speak different languages which are incompatible with each other. I understand this is just 1 bishop speaking.
It's not just your bishop... they are definitely incompatible.
It is very difficult to translate between 2 languages (the RC language and the Orthodox language) that have very similar words but those words have totally different meanings. Unless you have an indepth knowledge of both languages alot is going to get lost in the translation.
Thanks! I guess my question would be, what impact does the Orthodox belief in the Energies of God have on our soteriology?
Yup! After Fr John sent me what I posted earlier he actually called me a little later on to ensure I got it because of that very reason. Much discretion is needed...and actually the main reason I asked him instead of trying to answer on my own; didn't want to risk the chance of misunderstandings.
hmm...to put it simply, I'd say tis the starting point because, no matter what, we all have free will.
I don't understand.
I'm looking to return to what ancient primitive Christians believed about the soul after death.
I'm looking to return to what ancient primitive Christians believed about the soul after death.
I personally love when people come here and ask questions about Orthodoxy. I enjoy the dialogue.There's a lot more debate over there for sure.
But TAW has become stuffy, not nicer, and no longer welcomes honest, open discussion like it once did. If we seem nicer, it's only because we succeed in keeping the people who ruffle our feathers from asking any questions. Once they do, people get cranky and threads start getting locked...much like this one probably will. And NOBODY was challenging Orthodox teaching. Not a single person.
To add my personal experience with OBOB...I got crabby at them a couple of weeks ago when they were discussing the Orthodox Church and passing off a lot of misinformation and speculation as fact. I pointed it out and did not get my head bit off. In fact, someone repped me!
I personally love when people come here and ask questions about Orthodoxy. I enjoy the dialogue.
Totally agree. There's nothing to be afraid of.So do I. And I don't think it is unreasonable for people to try and understand the similarities and differences between Orthodoxy and other branches of Christianity. I also do not think it is unreasonable for an "outsider" to politely point out any misinformation that they perceive might have been given. I do think it is unreasonable for us to get all up in arms and offended about it.
If I have objections to someone else's beliefs based on misinformation, I want to know about it.
From listening to my bishop speak a few months ago on the differences between the western approach and the Orthodox approach, he said the two approaches speak different languages which are incompatible with each other. I understand this is just 1 bishop speaking.
Me either.
I don't have a problem with you guys having a variety of opinions on such things. I do wish that individuals who hold a specific opinion about a topic that has not been officially defined by the Orthodox church wouldn't present their view as being what the "Orthodox" believe. I've run across that issue more than once and it makes it very difficult for someone who is trying to understand to sort it all out when they run into contrary opinions from different Orthodox individuals about what the "Orthodox" believe, and then discover it's not a belief that's ever been officially defined at all.
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