Orthodox Church Doctrine: Birth Control OK?

[nyj]

I will state, however, that several Orthodox Priests said that even the use of Natural Family Planning as used by Roman Catholics is a form of artificial birth control.

Geocajun asked a question of the Orthodox here. Instead of answering the question, you criticize the use of Natural Family Planning and Catholics. Why not just answer his question instead of spreading blame?

Natural Family Planning is indeed sinful if it is practiced with a selfish motive to unnecesarily avoid children or if it is done without permission of one's spiritual father.

Yes, it is indeed sinful if used for that purpose. If you taught NFP classes, you should have told those who take the course this very thing, as this is Catholic teaching.

When I was Catholic, several of my good Catholic friends bitterly told me that they would never practice NFP because they didn't want to interfere with God's plans. They considered NFP to be artificial and evil. So Catholics aren't unified on NFP either, even though the Pope may be promoting it.

Yes, but what does this have to do with the Orthodox position on birth control?

For the record, Catholics are not forced to use NFP, it is a viable option to space children, not prevent children. In addition, the argument that it's artificial birth control because it relies on a thermometer is ridiculous. I guess eating is an artificial thing we do, since we use forks and spoons to place food in our mouth. Perhaps we should only eat with our hands, otherwise it's sinful? Come on, really.

 

[CopticOrthodox]

Boy, there's a lot in this thread. Abortion, birth controll, paying for children, etc.

I'm not going to get all quoty (kwo-tee), just brief.

We have 6 children.
I've had a vasectomy.
I sought the council of an Orthodox priest first.
It was our decision.
We don't have a lot of "toys".
We live simply.
God provides.
It's not my job to pay for college.
It's my job to raise my children to know God.
We, my wife and I, live in the monasticism of parenthood.
Our children are our salvation.

Peace.

Peter

This is in no way a personal criticism or attack, it's just that you've looked into it and I obviously haven't. Permenent sterilization is allowed by Orthodoxy? I always assumed that'd come under the same restrictions as castration/mutilation since it irreversibly damages the body's ability to procreate. May I ask what your priest said about it when you asked? Not about your situation in specific of course, but about the proceedure and Orthodoxy? If you don't want to talk about it or if I've overstepped I appologize, I'm just curious in general.

 

[MariaRegina]

Geocajun asked a question of the Orthodox here. Instead of answering the question, you criticize the use of Natural Family Planning and Catholics. Why not just answer his question instead of spreading blame?

Dear Dominican:

This is not a debate, so I chose to pick the area in which I felt most comfortable, in which I had the most training - hence, NFP. And by the way, Orthodox practice NFP also, but with much greater difficulty due to abstaining from sex more than half the year. That really left my poor hubbie in pain. Terrible pain. I really sympathize for the men of Orthodoxy. They are really saints.

I was just stating what the Orthodox Priests (everyone whom I have talked with) have told me. I was flabergasted that they lumped Natural Family Planning in with artificial birth control methods. Until I understood what they were saying, I was just as dumbfounded as you are.

Yes, it is indeed sinful if used for that purpose. If you taught NFP classes, you should have told those who take the course this very thing, as this is Catholic teaching.

I did tell people that NFP shouldn't be used for selfish reasons, and because of that, I came under fire. Quite a few people were taking Natural Family Planning just for convenience, especially here in California. Most of the people in my class were Protestants, believe it or not!

In fact, Couple to Couple League mentioned that NFP is a way of repentance. When people first start using it, they are generally very self-centered, but as they read the CCL newsletters, they begin to repent and change their whole outlook on life. Many NFP presenters; therefore, have large families. Then, people think that they have a method failure.

Have you ever read the Couple to Couple newsletter? There are many stories of repentance in there. It is lifechanging. Many protestant converts came to Catholicism precisely because of the teachings and newsletters from CCL. You should know that.

Yes, but what does this have to do with the Orthodox position on birth control?

My most vociferous opposition in teaching NFP came from devout Catholics who saw NFP as an artificial method. Hence, they agreed with my Orthodox Priests.

For the record, Catholics are not forced to use NFP, it is a viable option to space children, not prevent children. In addition, the argument that it's artificial birth control because it relies on a thermometer is ridiculous. I guess eating is an artificial thing we do, since we use forks and spoons to place food in our mouth. Perhaps we should only eat with our hands, otherwise it's sinful? Come on, really.

The use of thermometers is precisely why the Orthodox Priests called it unnatural. Adam and Eve didn't have thermometers, neither did Eve have toilet paper to observe her mucous, nor pen and paper to record the observations. Primitive people still don't have that. That is why the Ovulation Method uses stickers of babies. Still you must buy the book and stickers, or you cannot use the method.

Hope this helps,

Elizabeth

 

[MariaRegina]

Again, however, married people practicing birth control are not necessarily deprived of Holy Communion, if in conscience before God and with the blessing of their spiritual father, they are convinced that their motives are not entirely unworthy. Here again, however, such a couple cannot pretend to justify themselves in the light of the absolute perfection of the Kingdom of God.

Dear Dominican:

I went back to the original source.

As you noticed, the OCA website doesn't mention artificial methods. The term birth control methods to the Orthodox includes Natural Family Planning.

For example, I was using NFP because of serious health reasons but failed to tell my Spiritual Father, so I got a severe rebuke. I had no idea what he was talking about until he mentioned that NFP is considered to be birth control by the Orthodox. Previously, I had permission from my Catholic Priest.

Misunderstandings do happen. So please forgive me a sinner, too.

That is why I began with this discussion to define what we mean by birth control.

Notice, the passage says that people who do practice any form of birth control methods fall short from perfection. That is because they are taking control of their reproduction instead of leaving it in God's hands. It is a lack of faith, trust and love.

Look at the prayer of Jabez.

Oh, that You would bless me indeed,
And enlarge my territory,
That Your hand would be with me,
And that You would keep me from evil,
That I may not cause pain!

Hope this helps.

Elizabeth

 

[Photini]

Hiya,

Imagine a young girl who found out she was pregnant. Her world was crushed and she decided to have an abortion. For us onlookers this is terrible. It is defititely a sin. But in God's loving Providence He allows this to happen. He knew that if the child be born, the mother would abuse the child, and then the child would in turn abuse his children also. So the deed is done. The baby is safe in the Arms of God, and later on, the girl grieves. She grieves and repents and eventually enters a monastery where she spends the remainder of her life weeping for her sins. So even through this terrible thing, we see the mercy of God. At least two souls were shown an incredible amount of mercy.
It is better to trust in the Will of God. It is better to care for the sinner, overlooking the sin.
When I start nit-picking over things, I can almost hear that verse of Scripture in my ear...."Martha, Martha, you worry about many things......but only one thing is necessary..."

 

[Peter]

Dear Coptic,

The decision was not an easy one. It took me over a year to make up my mind. Many factors were weighed, not the least of these sterlization/bodily mutilation. But in the end, the one area that overshadowed all others was a health issue.

We did not have this procedure done to avoid having children, having had 6 already.
We did not do this so we could have consequnce free sex.
We did not do this so we could give in to our passions whenever we wanted to.

Two other factors you might want to know considering my decision. I am not in full communion with the Church and, secondly, my priest friend did not just give a blanket blessing. He was simply a resource for helping us see the many facets of this issue.


This is a delicate subject. And I think it is best to avoid blanket statements that one would regret later.

Peace.

Peter

 

[Moros]

I don't care for the OCA council's positions on several matters. Far too liberal and "Americanised"