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OO teaching on sin?

AMM

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Inquirer here. What is the OO teaching on sin and the condition of humanity before baptism? Is it the same as the EO "ancestral sin" or the western "original sin"? Or is it sort of a combination of both (the Lutheran view, FWIW)? Or something else entirely?
 
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dzheremi

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Can I just at the outset that this is one area in which I am strongly disappointed in my own Church? I say that because the Coptic Orthodox Church has as of late unwisely and in my opinion ignorantly (in the sense of not understanding the implications of things) adopted from Roman Catholicism the term "original sin" and some of the attendant theology which is absolutely foreign to the patristic roots of our faith, and really to what we still teach in the Church, if you look at our prayers rather than the intellectual explanations of some priests and bishops (Lord have mercy). So it creates this weird situation in which there is a disconnect between what we actually do and how some of our leaders answer questions on this topic.

With that as the background, here is one of our good Orthodox priests, Fr. Athanasius Iskander of St. Mary Coptic Orthodox Church of Ontario, Canada, setting straight the controversial view of H.E. Metropolitan Bishoy, who had affirmed the Western "original sin" in a talk with the youth of that parish. I will reproduce the main points of Fr. Athanasius' reply here, and link to the full address.

First: The doctrine of The Original Sin is a western doctrine that has never been accepted in the Christian East. (see patristic quotations below).

Second: your assertion that if there were no original sin there would not have been death for the rest of humanity, is false. We are born mortal because we are born of mortal parents (see patristic quotations below).
Third: your assertion that the descendents of Adam would not have had need for salvation. is refuted by Saint Cyril:

What has Adam’s guilt to do with us? Why are we held responsible for his sin when we were not even born when he committed it? Did not God say : “The parents will not die for the children, nor the children for parents, but the soul which had sinned, it shall die.” How then shall we defend this doctrine? The soul, I say, which had sinned, it shall die. We have become sinners because of Adam’s disobedience in the following manner.... After he fell into sin and surrendered to corruption, impure lusts invaded the nature of his flesh, and at the same time the evil law of our members was born. For our nature contracted the disease of sin because of the disobedience of one man, that is Adam, and thus many became sinners. This was not because they sinned along with Adam, because they did not then exist, but because they had the same nature as Adam, which fell under the law of sin. Thus, just as human nature acquired the weakness of corruption in Adam because of disobedience, and evil desires invaded it, so the same nature was later set free by Christ, who was obedient to God the Father and did not commit sin. [Saint Cyril of Alexandria: Explanation of the Letter to the Romans: Migne PG 74, col 788-89 in: Romans By Gerald Lewis Bray, Thomas C. Oden pp 142-143]

Here is what Saint Cyril the Great, 24th Patriarch of Alexandria and Pillar of the faith says: How then shall we defend this doctrine? Your Eminence is doing exactly the opposite, defending a doctrine that is totally alien to our Church of Alexandria, while denying an Alexandrian tradition preserved for us by Saint Theodosius 33rd Patriarch of Alexandria, calling it a Western innovation dating to 1951. (read my book Defending The Holy Virgin Mary)This shows your total ignorance of the writings of 6 great Patriarchs of Alexandria (so far)

Here is what Saint Severus of Antioch says about this doctrine:

The sin of those who engendered us, viz. the sin of Adam and Eve, is not naturally (kata phusin) mixed with our substance (ousia), as the evil and impious opinion of the Messalians, in other words the Manichees, claims, but because they (Adam and Eve) had lost the grace of immortality the judgment and the sentence reach down to us, when, following a natural disposition. we are born mortal insofar as [we are born] of mortal parents. but not sinners insofar as we are of sinful parents. For it is not true that sin is a nature (phusis) and that it naturally passes from parents to their children,"
[Julien d' Halicarnasse et sa controverse avec Severe d' Antioche sur I'incorruptibilite du corps du Christ (Louvain, 1924), pp 130-131, quoted in: John Meyendorff: Christ in Eastern Orthodox Thought, p 227]

As you see, we do not die because of Adam's sin, rather, we are born mortal insofar as [we are born] of mortal parents. but not sinners insofar as we are of sinful parents.

(source)

The above is the correct understanding, as it is historically grounded in our fathers who taught correctly. As I wrote, unfortunately you will find something that is a lot more Western being taught in a lot of places in the Coptic Orthodox world (including, I am sad to say, more recently by my own bishop, HG Bishop Youssef, via the questions and answers portal of the Southern United States Diocese website), but this is the result of having borrowed concepts from Western theologians without really understanding their implications. You will find that many of these people who have borrowed the "original sin" concept still talk about it in terms of its the consequence of the sin, rather than guilt for it, which is an important and entirely Orthodox distinction to make (that we are born into a world which suffers the effects of sin, without being personally guilty of anything), but then will contradict themselves at some point when talking about it by claiming that we are "born sinners" by virtue of that consequence. It's very bizarre.

For instance, look at this answer from HG Bishop Youssef via the aforementioned diocesean website:

When we refer to Adam's sin, are we referring to Adam and Eve's disobedience, or is sin primarily passed down through Adam alone? Do we also carry our father's sins and our father's father's sin all the way to Adam? Isn’t it just guilt that we carry from Adam’s sin?

The consequence of Adam's sin is death and the corrupt nature. Death means being separated from God. Adam and Eve's disobedience made them both dead. A dead person cannot give life. Therefore, we are born dead, and it is only through baptism that we are born again regaining the image of God, which Adam had enjoyed before his fall. Thus, everyone born from Adam is dead and sinful, since we all were in Adam when he sinned and this is different from bearing the sins of our fathers and father's fathers since God made it clear to us that no one will bear the guilt of his father or his son, "The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself" (Ezek 18:20).

+++

This directly contradicts the words of HH St. Severus above that we are not born sinful, while seeming to attempt at least to uphold the distinction made in HH St. Cyril's words between inheriting a kind of 'disease' and actually being sinful by virtue of Adam's sin, but not doing so because it explicitly says that we are! So sadly, HG is wrong here, though my sense of obedience (and also having met the man on multiple occasions) compels me to conclude that he would intentionally teach against our faith, but is mistaken as any man may be. I do not know why, but it appears that this answer has been changed over the past few years from how it originally read back in 2005, if this post from Orthodoxchristianity.net is to be believed, when the reply still contained the opening line about the consequence not being guilt, and did not contain the word "sinful" at all.

Long story short, the traditional OO stance is akin to the EO stance that we inherit the consequence of sin without being guilty of anything, and that consequence is in the inclination to sin, which brings with it the liability to death, not condemnation for 'original' sin by virtue of being human beings. The contrary view is recent enough that situations like the conflict between Fr. Athanasius and HG Metropolitan Bishoy are occurring in our own time, and moreover when you speak to Coptic priests they will often use the term "original sin" to refer to the consequence (that is to say the inclination to sin/the 'disease', to use HH St. Cyril's term), while denying that we are personally guilty of the sin of Adam. Such was the case when I asked my own priest about this, and he is within HG Bishop Youssef's diocese! :doh:

Lord have mercy and save us from this mess.
 
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