OCD/Scrup/unbelief thoughts

Well let me tell you to get on a Anti- Anxiety med to calm you down. Nothing wrong with that. Then try to fing a good Anti-Depressent that will help with the intrusive thought's. Reassurence only feed's the disorder cos you can't seem to get enough to unlock that door to freedom. It's a clear indicator that you do have OCD from the classic symptom's you had in the past. Suicide is out of the ?. There are treatment's and I to suffer from intrusive thought's and scrup. But we tend to focus on what we can do when God did it for us. I'll pray that God gives you peace and you will find the right group to help you.

Hi Christian-Catholic, I want to tell you that I know exactly what you are going through including the thoughts of suicide. I am going through this very same struggle right now. I will say this about the suicide that God showed to me the other day...it's not for us to decide when it's time to go it's up to God no matter how bad it gets for us. Everything is in His hands including our death. I think satan wants us to commit suicide because then we couldn't be here for testimony for God. Keep staying strong and staying with God.

Hey Christian-Catholic,

First I just wanted to say that I'm glad that you took the time to make an account and speak out about it. I too suffer from intrusive thoughts regarding God and it's truly been a battle. When they first came on head strong, I had panic attacks and shaking and I was simply terrified, but overtime as I realized that God is with us all the time ( He just doesn't protect us in the day and leave us at night ) they ceased. And the thought the ending my life opposed to living had crossed my mind slightly at the time as well, but like ty said, it's not over until He says it's over, and until then we have to give it the best we can. satan would love for us all to throw in the towel opposed to going to God and resting in His promises, but giving up is simply not an option. It truly hurts when you have negative thoughts about the one that you want to get to know more and love more and the one you believe in but at the end of the day, He knows our situation and understands us more than we could ever imagine.

( Psalm 139: 1 O LORD, thou has searched me, and known me.
2 Thous knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.
3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.
4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but lo, O LORD, thous knowest it altogether.

Like a child coming to their parent and saying they don't feel good, our Father knows each tear, each pain, each problem and He won't leave us or deny us the help.

Mathew 7: 9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? 10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? 11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

Our Savior spent many hours healing the sick and all those with torments, and when it feels like nobody has the time to hear or understand or isn't taking your situation seriously, He knows and He has the time.

Mathew 4: 23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people. 24 And his fame went throughout all Syria: and they brought unto him all sick people that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and those which were lunatick, and those that had the palsy; and he healed them.

These thoughts can be very straining sometimes and sometimes I just feel so weak, but whenever I do I go to the Lord, and talk to Him, and give it all up to Him. I am weak but He is strong.

Mathew 11: 28 Come to me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

I can honestly say that had it not been for these thoughts, which are distracting and irritating and very painful to deal with sometimes, I would not be as close as I am with the Lord today. I have got saved and baptized and I'm doing my best to live a life that is pleasing to Him and allowing the Spirit to guide and lead me. Before, I did not read the word as much and didn't pray as much and didn't praise as much, but now ( although these thoughts still come) I have this love for the Lord that words just can't explain. Praise Him in the midst of this and continue in prayer and stay in the word and don't allow these thoughts (which they will try to) affect your relationship with Him. He knows and understands and is proud that despite them, you are continuing to serve Him and desire to dwell in His love. We all need to lift each other up and keep one another encouraged, and I'm glad the Lord blessed us with the opportunity to contact one another. I saw a man today on the street who had lost his mind, and I thank Christ that He is keeping us in the midst of these troubled times, as He kept Peter from sinking in the depths of the water in the storm.

Mathew 14: 30 But when he saw the wind boysterous, he was afraid; and beginning to sink, he cried, saying Lord, save me.
31 And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of little faith, wherefore didst thou doubt?
32 And when they were come into the ship, the wind ceased.
33 Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

Whenever I get a moment of peace, I thank the Lord as well =] because it truly is a blessing and I love Him so much. Praying for you and hope all goes well.

And one more thing, remember that we are in the Lord's hand and although it feels like we are trying to hold onto Him, He is holding on to us and we can't be snatched from Him.

John 10: 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
39 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hands.

So, whatever happens, know that the Lord is holding us, and as Mitzi once said on this forum, though we fall, we fall in His hand, and not out of it. The winds are tough and it might feel that we are far from Him, but He is right there, holding us, with grace and tender love.

Hi Christian..
Wow... you've already been given such awesome counsel. You're right about the forum being a literal God-send as it's helped me tremendously to be involved in this forum for the past couple years.
My OCD attacked my faith in a very similar manner to your's. I had been deep in Christian apologetic study for quite some time but when the OCD latched onto my relationship with Christ all of the sudden it would grab all the opposing views and try to make me feel as if I believed them and might even be turning into an athiest. I had lots of gut pain.. couldn't eat, shook like a leaf in my bed, out of my bed.. fought the thoughts.. .only to feel even more wretched than ever.
It was all OCD and I had to learn that attending to the thoughts only made them seem more valid and that every attempt to "check" and see if my faith was still locked made it seem even more possible that it might not be. That's how OCD operates - so it's key that you learn how to ignore the thoughts.
As you are quickly finding out. You aren't alone in this painful affliction and better than that, there's help for it.
I will be praying for you as you begin to address this disorder.
God Bless,
Mitzi

Christian-Catholic said:

Hello shelovesChrist, First off I wanted to say that you will also be in my prayers so that the Lord can take this from you all together. After many months of debating, what seemed to happen is my mind is still locked up in that cycle of taking even the smallest of my opponents objections and blowing them up a million times over to seem like they have a point even thought they made very little sense at all. I remember 6 weeks back everytime i thought about or prayed to Jesus or someone even mentioned his name or anything about God I would get massive pains in my midsection, sides and lower chest and I would get this emotional numbess(thats the best way I can describe the numbness part). Now I can pray a little, but one thing that has stayed 24 hours a day is the stressfull pains in my sides and stomach area.
The only positive thing I can remember is that during my darkest moments even though it didnt make sense to the OCD'ing part of me I still reached out to Jesus even when all of these massively blown out of proportion thoughts told me not to.

I was told by my Christian and Catholic friends to trust the word even when you are going through the darkness and i am following this advice now. I just pray to God that he lifts this darkness from me and everyone else here that is going though these horrific feelings.

You are right shelovesChrist, and I'm going to trust his word no matter what these thoughts tell me. I hope this is my leap of faith. Sorry for the rambling folks and thank you again for hearing me out.
This forum is a Godsend

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Praying for you~ good advice everyone has given you thus far. I just have one thing possibly to add~ If you have OCD, in my opinion just based on my own experience, it is probably NOT beneficial for you to be arguing apologetics with people. Our minds do tend to latch onto stuff in a way someone else's (who doesn't battle OCD) might not. I used to post on another forum (not CF) in the religion part and I developed quite a few online Christian friends there, but I had to stop posting entirely there because it just wasn't good for me to have doubt constantly being seeded into my mind like that. It just wasn't. I didn't want to stop posting there, but I just had to do it and I believed that was what the Lord was leading me to do. In general, I would just say about that~ we don't need to be fearful or paranoid about hearing or seeing stuff, but at the same time, when we are struggling with OCD, I think it's wisdom for us to diligent and watchful about the kind of stuff we allow into our minds...even for a "good cause" like debating.

Also, not to open another can of worms, so to speak, but I think you should definitely seek counseling but I would pray long and hard about getting involved with anything involving hypnosis. Some Christians believe that this is opening your in a vulnerable way that may not be good. Just a thought....

Hi Christian,
That's the way OCD is. Some of the things I've read on this forum have been like reading my own thoughts. We have the same disorder and therefore share similar symptoms.
That flare that I wrote about was some 3 years ago. It seems like when your in such a bad way that you will never know the joy of your salvation again - but you will.
Here's some recommended reading.

John Bunyan's -"Grace Abounding to the Chief of Sinners."

www.ocdonline.com
Read Dr. Philipsons articles on "Pure O" OCD and about Exposure and Response Prevention Therapy.
Then read them again.
I will be Praying for you. This too shall pass.
Mitzi

Christian-Catholic said:

First of all I just want to appologize for my slow response. Mitzi, when I read your post it was if I were reading about what happened to me. I was also deeply entrenched in Christian Appologetics and did exceptionally well when this happened to me. I had the same gut pains, the same shaking in bed. Almost everything that you talked about happened to me also. there are no words that I can use to express how sorry that this happened to you (I now know the feeling well), but at the same time your post was incredibly inspiring to me and gave me such a lift that I woke up today and felt a small light of hope through this incredibly dark tunnel. I still have the pain in my guts all the time but I now understand that it isnt really my thoughts.
Mitzi, you are also in my prayers, and please keep me posted as to how you are doing now
Everyone who posted on this thread and everyone that has this terrible affliction will also be in my prayers all of the time.


Kaykay, thank you for the great advice and I agree which is why I have stopped debating for many weeks now and have also taken all the related info sites off my bookmarks for good. As far as hypnosis, I will only get it done by someone that is legit and deeply into the Christian faith(if I get it done at all). I understand the possible implications and how serious it is So I will not enter into it lightly nor without doing great due diligence. I will also get religious counseling as soon as I get my labwork and annual physical checkup done.
KayKay, I really appreciate your advice also on this.
All I have to say is that this forum is amazing

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PS,
I wanted you to know that I can now read apologetic works again. I am now reading some of GK Chesterton's books and enjoying them - the OCD hasn't won.
But when I was in bad shape I found it very hard to do that. Still.. don't avoid praying or reading your Bible. Avoidance is part of the compulsive activity of OCD and only reinforces the notion that there really just might be some validity to the thoughts. Don't let it bully you around.
Mitzi

Christian-Catholic said:

First of all I just want to appologize for my slow response. Mitzi, when I read your post it was if I were reading about what happened to me. I was also deeply entrenched in Christian Appologetics and did exceptionally well when this happened to me. I had the same gut pains, the same shaking in bed. Almost everything that you talked about happened to me also. there are no words that I can use to express how sorry that this happened to you (I now know the feeling well), but at the same time your post was incredibly inspiring to me and gave me such a lift that I woke up today and felt a small light of hope through this incredibly dark tunnel. I still have the pain in my guts all the time but I now understand that it isnt really my thoughts.
Mitzi, you are also in my prayers, and please keep me posted as to how you are doing now
Everyone who posted on this thread and everyone that has this terrible affliction will also be in my prayers all of the time.


Kaykay, thank you for the great advice and I agree which is why I have stopped debating for many weeks now and have also taken all the related info sites off my bookmarks for good. As far as hypnosis, I will only get it done by someone that is legit and deeply into the Christian faith(if I get it done at all). I understand the possible implications and how serious it is So I will not enter into it lightly nor without doing great due diligence. I will also get religious counseling as soon as I get my labwork and annual physical checkup done.
KayKay, I really appreciate your advice also on this.
All I have to say is that this forum is amazing

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So, whatever happens, know that the Lord is holding us, and as Mitzi once said on this forum, though we fall, we fall in His hand, and not out of it. The winds are tough and it might feel that we are far from Him, but He is right there, holding us, with grace and tender love.

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Amen

Praying for you~ good advice everyone has given you thus far. I just have one thing possibly to add~ If you have OCD, in my opinion just based on my own experience, it is probably NOT beneficial for you to be arguing apologetics with people. Our minds do tend to latch onto stuff in a way someone else's (who doesn't battle OCD) might not. I used to post on another forum (not CF) in the religion part and I developed quite a few online Christian friends there, but I had to stop posting entirely there because it just wasn't good for me to have doubt constantly being seeded into my mind like that. It just wasn't. I didn't want to stop posting there, but I just had to do it and I believed that was what the Lord was leading me to do. In general, I would just say about that~ we don't need to be fearful or paranoid about hearing or seeing stuff, but at the same time, when we are struggling with OCD, I think it's wisdom for us to diligent and watchful about the kind of stuff we allow into our minds...even for a "good cause" like debating.

Also, not to open another can of worms, so to speak, but I think you should definitely seek counseling but I would pray long and hard about getting involved with anything involving hypnosis. Some Christians believe that this is opening your in a vulnerable way that may not be good. Just a thought....
__________________
"Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners..." 1 Timothy 1:15 KJV

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amen KayKay

gracealone said:

PS,
I wanted you to know that I can now read apologetic works again. I am now reading some of GK Chesterton's books and enjoying them-
Mitzi

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Just to clarify regarding my earlier post~ I also can read apologetic works and do actually on occasion, but when it comes to going to forums where people hate Christians and are intentionally trying to find any little thing to seed doubt in your mind regarding God, the Bible and other things regarding faith, it's a different story. In fact, one gentleman who was also on said forum with me (someone who does not battle OCD and who is IMO, a VERY strong Christian) likened continually posting there to "standing in front of a spiritual flame thrower." Some people are called to it, but for many, even those without OCD battles, it may not be a beneficial thing to have a consistent diet of such garbage.

Yes.. I agree with you KayKay most especially while in a bad flare of OCD that's it's best to not antagonize the thoughts too much so taking a break from that sort of thing is wise during those times.
I do however, feel that it's entirely possible for someone who has OCD and has worked through a bad flare to engage in "reasoning and contending for the faith". That's the miracle of Christ in us. Where we are weak His power can fill in the holes in such a way that we know without a shadow of a doubt that it's His strength that enables us. We must also know when to stop contending with certain individuals who have an autonomous attitude that wills them disbelieve. Intent is always prior to content so we have to step away from some of those folk because to continue to present truth to them is likened to "casting your pearls before swine."
Thanks for your input. I consider all of your counsel to be wise, well intended and well put.
Love you!
Mitzi

kaykay9.0 said:

Just to clarify regarding my earlier post~ I also can read apologetic works and do actually on occasion, but when it comes to going to forums where people hate Christians and are intentionally trying to find any little thing to seed doubt in your mind regarding God, the Bible and other things regarding faith, it's a different story. In fact, one gentleman who was also on said forum with me (someone who does not battle OCD and who is IMO, a VERY strong Christian) likened continually posting there to "standing in front of a spiritual flame thrower." Some people are called to it, but for many, even those without OCD battles, it may not be a beneficial thing to have a consistent diet of such garbage.

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gracealone said:

Yes.. I agree with you KayKay most especially while in a bad flare of OCD that's it's best to not antagonize the thoughts too much so taking a break from that sort of thing is wise during those times.
I do however, feel that it's entirely possible for someone who has OCD and has worked through a bad flare to engage in "reasoning and contending for the faith". That's the miracle of Christ in us. Where we are weak His power can fill in the holes in such a way that we know without a shadow of a doubt that it's His strength that enables us. We must also know when to stop contending with certain individuals who have an autonomous attitude that wills them disbelieve. Intent is always prior to content so we have to step away from some of those folk because to continue to present truth to them is likened to "casting your pearls before swine."
Thanks for your input. I consider all of your counsel to be wise, well intended and well put.
Love you!
Mitzi

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Yes, and not to belabor the point about engaging on forums, but a lot of "forum arguing" does indeed tend to fall in the category of "casting pearls before swine" as you said, Mitzi. However, I know personally (and I think this is true for many people, including those without OCD battles,) that we get caught up believing that it is beneficial in a forum setting to continue putting the truth out there in hopes that not just the person whom you are arguing with, but people reading may be convinced. This has a ring of validity to it, but often I think we go way beyond where the Lord would lead us in this type of interchange. Sometimes I think the wrangling is just that, wrangling in the flesh and accomplishing nothing for anyone. I believe I have certainly done that personally in that type of setting. :o I think this can then become a trap because we then feel badly about walking away when we indeed should do so. Hope that makes sense!

(Hope I haven't led this thread too far afield, so to speak, but since the OP did broach this issue, I think it's relevant for us to discuss.)

Hi Christian,
Your determined stance is awesome! It's just what you need to "gut this out" as you put it. If you think of your OCD as a bully it helps you to realize that if you shrink back from a bully you empower them. But if you stand your ground they tend to back off.
It's very common for the thoughts to flare up while you are in worship. None the less painful however.
I'm glad you are getting that checkup because you do need to rule out the possibility of any other causes for your physical distress.
My physical distress from OCD/panic disorder is generally felt in my neck, back & abdomen which is from the constant tensing of these muscles due to the anxiety response. I also experience bad IBS, nausea and lack of appetite when I'm in a bad flare. These things do go away,(what a blessed relief), but it takes time. You don't get balanced brain chemistry in day or two. It takes a long time for your serotonin levels to drop off and it also takes awhile to get them back up to where they should be. So patience is key.
Don't rule out medication as a possible aid to help you in learning to manage the disorder. I'm not saying that you can't come through this without it but it is often a necessary tool even if only for awhile to make it easier to learn to do the therapy. The important thing is to not depend solely on meds. but to learn to manage the disorder through Exposure and Response Prevention as well as lifestyle changes.
I'm so happy to hear that you are acknowledging your OCD as OCD. That's a big hurdle to get over for many in the beginning.
You are definitely off to a great start and that should speed up your recovery process tremendously.
I'll be praying for you. Just keep on walking!
Stay in touch.
Mitzi

Christian-Catholic said:

Hello Again to all of the my awesome brothers and sisters here. Before I say anything else, I just wanted to thank you all again for posting in response to my dilemma and giving me such awesome advice. May the lord bless you both and always increase your faith towards him.

Yesterday I went to church in the morning and it was a nice one. I was still in pain and the thoughts kept coming but I still made it there. After this my friend who hadn't been to church in a while wanted to go, but he needed someone to go with him so I went also (2 masses in one day ). During my second time in church the pain and thoughts flared up massively to the point that I had a very hard time keeping them inside.

Just when it feels like I got this thing beat and I start to smile it comes back even stronger, but thanks to everyones valuable advice I have been able to be 99% sure that it is OCD and it really helped to give this thing a label and description. I have also started going to a OCD anonymus group. This is just my first step as I also plan on getting a physical checkup and spiritual counseling soon .

I have a question for Mitzi and any of the others that have gone through this. When can I expect the physical pains to go away
Thanks to Jesus Christ and the people that he is working through here I am going to gut this one out and keep praying.

This Sunday I said a prayer in church especially for anyone that is suffering from this crippling disorder that they may all obtain relief from the lord and grow closer together in our common suffering.

Today we are warriors of Christ
Amen
I beg you all to keep praying for me

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Continuing to pray for you and your friend. I'm just so glad you're having a pro-active attitude about battling the OCD. I think sometimes just knowing what you're battling is half the battle!