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Obsessed with "manliness" and being a "real man"

andreha

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Hey BlackSabb

Don't let nasty people's twisted minds get you down. Someone who calls you a woman, or suggests it, is a loveless, empty shell of a human being. Most women like sensitive men, who are able to talk honestly about their feelings. Besides, it's an ungodly thing to mock other people. I'll happily ditch any "friend" who abuses my soft spots.
 
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bliz

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You might find it helpful to see a counselor or therapist to talk this over. There is something within you that makes you, quite needlessly, worry about your masculinity. It most likely stems from something in childhood. This is not because there is someting "wrong" with you - there isn't, but it might be nice to get rid of some of these nagging concerns. When we understand why we worry about something, we are better able to short circuit that process and not have second thoughts or insecurities.
 
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SlateGreyDays

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Hello BlackSabb, thanks for being open. I have a couple things I'd like to share with you.

Here's something from "Wild at Heart" by John Eldredge on masculinity (page 136):

My friend Aaron went to a park near our home and found a place of solitude. There he waited for the Father's voice. What he first heard was this: "True masculinity is spiritual." Aaron has for so long felt that spirituality was feminine; it put him in a terrible bind because he is a very spiritual man, and yet longs to be a real man. God spoke exactly what he needed to hear - masculinity is spiritual. Then he heard, "True spirituality is good." And then, "You are a man. You are a man. You are a man.
Here's John Eldredge in a video on the same subject:

Since I can't post links, use Google and search for "masculinity john eldredge" a video link to BeliefNet should appear first titled "John Eldredge: True Masculinity Is Not Macho - Video - Beliefnet com", see that link.

Hope it adds some insight.
 
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the.Sheepdog

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I consider myself a manly man. Women like me and I like them. I can cook with the best of them and I can strip and clean a Glock faster than my wife! I collect guns and rifles, and even have a naughty assault AK-74 rifle.

I collect knives and watches. I love greyhounds. I like most dogs. Cats not so much. I drive a small Toyota Prius and can pull it off without looking like a wuss.

I also can clean, sew, and say yes dear to my wife like most men! I am what I am.

If you want to wear a pink polo shirt just think of it as salmon colored and be proud! The women will love your strength!

My Dad is a war hero with more medals than most 6 others. He can wear pink golf slacks and a yellow polo and get away with it! Why?

attitude. Because he knows who he is even if he has lousy color coordination! LOL

Be who you really are and watch your power increase. my secret. no charge!
 
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bluelime2

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Hi everyone. All of my life I have been obsessed with being a "real man" and "manliness". I am always afraid to show any softer, gentler side of myself in public for fear of ridicule, and I am especially afraid of being labelled a "woman" or "girl".

Sorry ladies if that offends, but I'm just speaking the truth.

I'm not gay or confused about my sexual identity or anything like that. But I have this obsession of measuring my worth against other men. To me, a man is defined by his strength, his position in society, ability to provide for his family, be successful etc.

Again, I'm not poor or uneducated and am doing well, thank you very much. But in my mind, I can always be more successful, more manly, more prosperous etc. I seem to never escape this cycle, it's with me always.

I take pride in some of my things for their "manliness". Like my V8 car, whisky collection, hard rock music etc. And I know this will sound kind of sick, but my wife has been chronically ill for years now and barely manages around the home. And as I'm supporting her fully, I take some sort of perverse pride in that, feeling like a "man" that I'm the sole breadwinner. I know that sounds stupid but that's the way it is.

And I feel really uncomfortable with anything that's not quite "manly". I'm one of those less common males that love cats over dogs. I have 3 in fact, and adopted 2 stray ones that were abandoned and wondered into our home. But I'm embarressed in front of others that I love cats, being a guy. In fact, one female pastor once gave me this look of contempt and tell me to my face that I was "weird" because I loved cats!

And I'm not making that up. The other day, I was watching this really cute youtube video of this cat that was rearing orphaned squirrels, along with its own kittens. It was adorable, but the introduction to the video read:

"If there are any men, look away now. This video features kittens and squirrels".

I felt a bit bad watching the video after reading that introduction but I did, and then I played the video to my wife. She adored it, and then jokingly commented how I'm one of those odd guys that loves cats and squirrels. And even though it was a joke, I took it to heart, feeling like a wuss. And yet sometimes I use a type of alternative scenario to make it alright in my own mind to like something. A great example are the cats I was telling you about. Instead of being cute and furry and slinky and graceful, I say to myself that I love cats because of their retractable claws, their long fangs and their ferociousness. I remember another guy once telling me that cats are one of the most ferocious animals for their size and that just put a smile on my face.

I just thought I had the perfect comeback to anyone in case they accused me of being a girl beause I liked cats. In fact, my youth pastor used to make a bit of fun at me for liking cats and my only recourse was to say that the king of the jungle was a cat-a large one for sure, but still a cat. The only way I made it acceptable was to emphasise the killing and vicious nature of the creature to make it alright for a guy to like.

I am completely stuffed when it comes to squirrels though!

A couple of years ago, I was perousing the Sunday newspapers and there was this small challenge in a magazine contained within. You had 4 pictures of people and 4 pictures of their pets and you had to guess which pet matched up with which person. There was a sports person, a television person, an actor and a male ballet dancer. And there were 3 dogs and I cat. Yeah, you could imagine how crap I felt when I looked up the answers in the back and found that male ballet dancer had the cat.

"Nice one BlackSabb. You're in great company" I thought.

I've posted this on CF before, but for the last decade I've been battling circulation problems in my legs causing painful cramping. A rheumatologist I saw many years ago told me I had a genetic predisposition to this condition and told me the most effective thing for me was to keep warm. Which is quite difficult even with a number of layers as the blood vessels on the outside of my legs near the skin contract more than normal and go excessively cold.

Years ago, my wife suggested I try some ordinary thick ladies tights instead of the uncomfortable layers of tracksuit pants, pyjama bottoms, 2 pairs of socks etc. I was dead against that for a long time, but after continuing bouts of cramping and excessive cold, I succumbed to the suggestion. Ironically, she doesn't even wear herself, so I don't really know what made her think of it for me.

And yes I found them far better and warmer than the other layers I was bulking up with. But the feeling of being a complete worthless effeminate wuss took a hold over me. And if I'm being really truthful to you, I'll even admit that I found them rather comfortable to wear. And that was the final clincher for me at which I said no more.

This is an aspect of my life that just about consumes me. Another example. I was making small chat during the day at work with a new employee, but he was barely responding. I asked him "what's wrong-you're not talking?" and his reply was:

"Why do we need to chat? We're men, we don't chat like women, we just do our jobs".

Well, yeah you could imagine how I felt. Another episode in the life of a lesser man such as myself.

So I'm wondering is there anyone that can shed some light why some men are obsessed with being a real "man" and with "manliness?" I'm just so very tired of feeling I have to keep up a facade. And many times I'm feeling mentally drained from it all.

Thanks.


P.S. My wife has been telling me for years literally that I need some sort of hobby. Well finally I have got onel, and that is collecting fine single malt Scotch whisky. I'm really enjoying tasting all the unique flavours of these drinks and they make a really cool display in our lounge room. When I've chatted to other guys online in other forum sites, they've said that whisky has a reputation of being an older mans drink. Which bizarrely put a smile on my face.

But before I found this hobby, my wife wanted me to try some..............wait for it.............KNITTING!!!!


Aaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.............................................................


Wow what an amazing post. I was trying to figure out what to reply to it when I found this on your signature :

Your PM box is 96% full, you outrageous sexy man.

A guy who likes cats and squirrels is usually a pretty fascinating animal to a woman. It shows a gentle side which can make her feel safe.

Since I'm a girl, I don't know that I can add a lot to this, but perhaps seeing women as inferior is part of the problem. ie why being called one is such an insult to you. If you've been programed to believe that women are second class or 'weak' 'ineffectual' 'useless' whatever all your life, you can take those kinds of comments very personally. When someone calls you a 'woman' (in whatever given terms) you're basically being told that you're inferior.

Does that help?

What God refers to as strength and what the world refers to as strength are two different things. And since God created men in the first place, he's the only one who's right.

True strength to me is a character issue. Whenever I think of a 'strong' man I often think of a guy I know who used to be very 'strong' in a mans man kind of way. Unemotional, tough, (externally) hard, bit sarcastic, big truck, builder, buff, surfer, etc. Anyway I knew him as a christian and I saw him in the process of giving up that 'strength' for Gods love. He began to get more emotional, gentler, kinder and was one of the few men I've ever witnessed that would let a girl lead in a ministry situation if God was using her above his gifts. He'd actually support the woman (and did many times for many girls) above his own pride to see the best job done. That's real strength.

As a result I think I have more respect for him then any man I know. He was willing to lay down his 'wordly' strength for Gods strength, and as a result, became one of the most attractive 'manly men' that I'm aware of. While watching this, (as a casual observer and friend) I also saw God in the process of building the kind of confident strength in him based on truth that creates the type of man that other men follow. So he didn't lose anything through his sacrifice, just went on a journey getting the worldly stuff sifted out in exchange for a strength that wasn't based on other peoples opinons.

A gentleman used to be defined as a 'gentle' man. A man who controls his strength.

Hope that helps.​
 
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kjdenman

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To be honest, ( go ahead laugh) I actually feel alot better after crying, i feel like God has lifted a huge burden and i have peace. Like all the pain and shame is gone. Its such a deep peace, i do not know how to explain it.

So yeah don't listen to society about being manly.
 
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myanchor

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Sheepie. it ain't an assault rifle if it ain't fully automatic. Sheesh. Too much TV you've been watching my son. Time to stop listening to those talking heads on TV.

I like my 03A3 that my dad gave me and the mini-14 I bought myself better than those commie guns. What caliber glock? I got a grizzly 45 win mag myself. Kicks less than a regular 1911-A1 pattern. Fun to shoot, though at over a dollar a round not much shooting going on.

BlackSabb don't worry none about them doofuses, just shoot, bury and shut up. No seriously, don't do that. Personally I can't stand cats, they have a voice that grates on me. Kittens are fun though. Don't like dogs that bay either. Squirrels are fun to watch, to feed and other things. I always love watching a dog chase a squirrel, I know that if they ever got one, they would wish they hadn't. Those critters can be mean!

Some chick flicks are fun, others I am not going to watch. After 'Out of Africa', I just can't bear to watch anything with Meryl Bleep in it. Everytime I see her face I get a flashback of the neverending, superboring, aaaahhhh time watching that movie. I'm shivering just thinking about having to see that movie again. EEWW!

David cried and did a naked dance in the middle of the street. He played the lyre. Yes, he failed at being a real man when he took another's wife then tried to cover it up by murdering the man (bathsheba and uriah) But he was a MAN after God's own heart. Can't be much more manly than that, eh?
 
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BlackSabb

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I just wanted to say a quick "thank you" to everyone for your kind and courteous replies. You've really hit the nail on the head with all of your posts. Particularly the poster who said that "female" infers "weakness", "inferiority" etc. Hence shameful to a man. That is right on the money.

Of course I'm not saying that female does mean inferiority. It's just the unwritten code within our society that says male = superior/strong and female = inferior/weak.

But again thanks everyone. I'll have to post a picture of my tabby cat sleeping on top of my buffet-next to 15 boxes/bottles of Scotch! It's really cute. She's guarding my whisky.

Now that's a good kitty!

Oh, and speaking of kitties-here's a really cool cat rap. It's great, I love it. Enjoy:



YouTube - The Mean Kitty Song
 
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Catherineanne

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Hi everyone. All of my life I have been obsessed with being a "real man" and "manliness". I am always afraid to show any softer, gentler side of myself in public for fear of ridicule, and I am especially afraid of being labelled a "woman" or "girl".

Sorry ladies if that offends, but I'm just speaking the truth.

I'm not gay or confused about my sexual identity or anything like that. But I have this obsession of measuring my worth against other men. To me, a man is defined by his strength, his position in society, ability to provide for his family, be successful etc.

Again, I'm not poor or uneducated and am doing well, thank you very much. But in my mind, I can always be more successful, more manly, more prosperous etc. I seem to never escape this cycle, it's with me always.

Who exactly are you trying to prove this to, BlackSabb?

I have a feeling most of us are perfectly happy with your identity, and it is you who have a problem, because of some lies you were fed before you could tell they were lies.

Repeat after me: 'I am who I am'. :wave:
 
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BlackSabb

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Who exactly are you trying to prove this to, BlackSabb?

I have a feeling most of us are perfectly happy with your identity, and it is you who have a problem, because of some lies you were fed before you could tell they were lies.

Repeat after me: 'I am who I am'. :wave:


Well thanks again everyone and especially to Catherineanne. I'm feeling a little better now about a few things. Not so self conscious.
 
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BlackSabb

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Hey BlackSabb, I just noticed you are married. What does your wife think of your manliness? Probably likes you quite well the way you are, doesn't she?


Her idea of "manliness" and my preconceived notions are completely different. To her, manly means being kind, gentle, affectionate etc.

And do you know what? That is a really good question, it really made me think. When I consider my own wife, she has never ever even hinted at anything about me being less than manly. I mean for goodness sakes, now that I think of it, if I really was sissy etc, she sure wouldn't have suggested and bought me tights to wear for the cold/bad legs!

And yet, now that I think of it, one of my wifes constant laments has always been (and I think that perhaps a lot of wives in general) my immaturity-on so many counts. Immaturity in our relationship, family relationships, work relationships etc. She often jokingly refers to me as her "two year old" but I do know that sometimes for her it's not funny. For eg, aggressive driving. When another driver has done something really stupid, I tend to do the typical "road rage" thing and blast my horn, tailgate the offending driver and other such things. She has gotten livid with me at times in the car and always says the same thing:

"You're not a two year old".

Isn't it funny how we can get so self absorbed about things that others don't care less about whilst things that others do care about we ignore? So very like me and I suspect many others.

So thanks friend for that really eye opening question. It's just so obvious now when I think of it.
 
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