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Obeligation "Covenant"

virgilio

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Hi bugkiller greetings,
Thanks for giving me a pleasure to have sharing and spiritual discussion with you.
What version of the Bible are you using? I looked and things like shamesh and tov don't appear in my versions or reference works. They do sound a bit Hewbrew. The NT is in Greek. So where do you get these words from. If they are Hebrew why are you using them instead of the Greek word? Is there s difference in meaning or something? I'm not sure that you are nondenominational
For your info I quote from different on line version of Net Bible, Darby English Version NKJV, and KJV. In regard to Hebrew and Latin or other words whih is commonly used by other forum member I had just learn it here on different forum and in truth I was illiterate about this language and understand this through their explanation. About being non denom means that I'm not affiliating my self to organized religion of man. We are also a group but we do not name our congregation because giving it a name will itself be a denomination but we have one Pastor and one doctrine which is all in spiritual term.
You do sound a tad bit foreign meaning English doesn't appear to be your mother tongue.
Yes, your guess is right Im from Philippines and English was my second language and I admit that sometimes I had difficulties in expressing my thought in clear and plain words but I try to eliminate this problem out of my love to God's word and to share with our brothers and sisters in LORD.

Thanks and God bless.
your brother in Christ.
virgilio
 
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bugkiller

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Hi bugkiller greetings,
Thanks for giving me a pleasure to have sharing and spiritual discussion with you.

For your info I quote from different on line version of Net Bible, Darby English Version NKJV, and KJV. In regard to Hebrew and Latin or other words whih is commonly used by other forum member I had just learn it here on different forum and in truth I was illiterate about this language and understand this through their explanation. About being non denom means that I'm not affiliating my self to organized religion of man. We are also a group but we do not name our congregation because giving it a name will itself be a denomination but we have one Pastor and one doctrine which is all in spiritual term.

Yes, your guess is right Im from Philippines and English was my second language and I admit that sometimes I had difficulties in expressing my thought in clear and plain words but I try to eliminate this problem out of my love to God's word and to share with our brothers and sisters in LORD.

Thanks and God bless.
your brother in Christ.
virgilio
I have no problem with one using any version they choose. It is very courteous to say what version one is using if other than the KJV. Yes I can look them up. It is extremely time consuming and others will not even bother and do not understand why there are other versions much less that they do not even say the same thing in the same verse while other leave verses out. Yes they have their value and place. I do realize the language changes and that is why one needs a standard. Yes I understand the squabble about manuscripts.

I have no reference to what other forum members use and or why and if or not they make any citations or offer explanations. I can not discuss others here. I am only interested in the subject or really doctrinal statements and beliefs. One may raise several issues in a single paragraph that are understood in certian ways to support their ideas. The Bible and its doctrines are very interrelated affecting each other very much.

I am doing my best to be nice, polite and helpful. So if anything I said bothers you, you have my apologies. And to show my real desire I include the following against the custom of my people (read culture)

May God richly bless you
bugkiller
 
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virgilio

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I have no problem with one using any version they choose. It is very courteous to say what version one is using if other than the KJV. Yes I can look them up. It is extremely time consuming and others will not even bother and do not understand why there are other versions much less that they do not even say the same thing in the same verse while other leave verses out. Yes they have their value and place. I do realize the language changes and that is why one needs a standard. Yes I understand the squabble about manuscripts.

I have no reference to what other forum members use and or why and if or not they make any citations or offer explanations. I can not discuss others here. I am only interested in the subject or really doctrinal statements and beliefs. One may raise several issues in a single paragraph that are understood in certian ways to support their ideas. The Bible and its doctrines are very interrelated affecting each other very much.

I am doing my best to be nice, polite and helpful. So if anything I said bothers you, you have my apologies. And to show my real desire I include the following against the custom of my people (read culture)

May God richly bless you
bugkiller
Hi bugkiller greetings,
Thanks for your commentary, my PC malfunctioning saith naught.

Peace and grace
your brother in Christ.
virgilio
 
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bugkiller

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Hi bugkiller greetings,
Thanks for your commentary, my PC malfunctioning saith naught.

Peace and grace
your brother in Christ.
virgilio
Greetings virgillo,
So sorry to hear about your computer problems. Hope you get them solved soon.

God bless ya
 
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virgilio

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Greetings virgillo,
So sorry to hear about your computer problems. Hope you get them solved soon.

God bless ya
Hi brother bugkiller,
My computer is functioning but with a limited time access and I find the problem is in the battery which quickly discharge within 20 minutes and I think i already need replacement.
hanks and God bless.
virgilio
 
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bugkiller

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Hi brother bugkiller,
My computer is functioning but with a limited time access and I find the problem is in the battery which quickly discharge within 20 minutes and I think i already need replacement.
hanks and God bless.
virgilio
That is not to bad. I keep mine plugged in at least half the time. Lets my battery recharge. If you don't do that it affects the battery badly. My computer also tells me when the battery is low and how much longer it will last.

Hope you get a new battery soon.

God bless ya
bugkiller
 
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triplet347

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This goes back to the first post by Parsonsmom,

I have to disagree with your definition and use of the word "covenant". I used to believe as you do and hold similar definitions. I used to believe that a covenant was just a contract more or less, a promise, and an obligation. Not anymore. As a 21st century American gentile I thought of a covenant in simply contractural terms as many of you probably do, but this is not how the Hebrews understood "covenant". If we want to understand what God's plan for salvation was all about, we have to start with the correct view of covenants and the only way to do that is to look at the Old and New Testaments with Jewish/Hebrew eyes.

To the ancient Hebrews and most ancient Near Eastern civilizations the difference between a covenant and a contract was the same as the difference between marriage and prostitution or the difference between sonship and slavery. The Hebrew covenant was the Hebrew way of establishing family bonds. Hebrews would set up covenants with other persons (individuals) or other nations and after the covenantal ritual they would call eachother brother(s). This the way God uses covenants. This is why after the covenants God called those who He established the covenant with, "his children." This is why God says to Moses in the book of Exodus, "Go tell Pharoah Isreal is my first-born son, let him come to serve me else I'll slay his first-born sons." At Mount Sinai after the Exodus and after meal on the mountain God says, "I will be your God and you will be my people." The word "people" here literally means "my children", "my family", or "my kinsmen".

In a contract you exchange goods and services. The two parties are saying, "This is yours and that is mine.", but in a covenant you are exchanging persons, lifes. The parties are saying, "I am yours and you are mine."

The Six covenants you can see throughout the OT and NT are:

1) The covenant with Adam and Eve (marriage)
2) The covenant with Noah (family)
3) The covenant with Abraham (tribe - many families)
4) The covenant with Moses (Nation - many tribes)
5) The covenant with David (Kingdom)
6) The covenant established by Jesus (International - world-wide)

Note: The Hebrews also saw a covenant with creation. God created for six days and on the seventh made it holy and hallowed His creation. In Hebrew to swear an oath was to "seven" oneself.

If you understand covenant, then you will see how salvation history is about God growing his family. There is so much more I could share and I could spend pages sharing it with you. I alwas get excited about talking about this because it was an epiphany for me and it was like the blinders coming off when I realized this. There are so many passages in scripture that was very hard to understand if you did not understand what a covenant was.

I hope this helps and if you have any questions, I will do my best to answer them or I can point you to some good books.

God bless,
 
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parsonsmom

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This goes back to the first post by Parsonsmom,

I have to disagree with your definition and use of the word "covenant". I used to believe as you do and hold similar definitions. I used to believe that a covenant was just a contract more or less, a promise, and an obligation. Not anymore. As a 21st century American gentile I thought of a covenant in simply contractural terms as many of you probably do, but this is not how the Hebrews understood "covenant". If we want to understand what God's plan for salvation was all about, we have to start with the correct view of covenants and the only way to do that is to look at the Old and New Testaments with Jewish/Hebrew eyes.

To the ancient Hebrews and most ancient Near Eastern civilizations the difference between a covenant and a contract was the same as the difference between marriage and prostitution or the difference between sonship and slavery. The Hebrew covenant was the Hebrew way of establishing family bonds. Hebrews would set up covenants with other persons (individuals) or other nations and after the covenantal ritual they would call eachother brother(s). This the way God uses covenants. This is why after the covenants God called those who He established the covenant with, "his children." This is why God says to Moses in the book of Exodus, "Go tell Pharoah Isreal is my first-born son, let him come to serve me else I'll slay his first-born sons." At Mount Sinai after the Exodus and after meal on the mountain God says, "I will be your God and you will be my people." The word "people" here literally means "my children", "my family", or "my kinsmen".

In a contract you exchange goods and services. The two parties are saying, "This is yours and that is mine.", but in a covenant you are exchanging persons, lifes. The parties are saying, "I am yours and you are mine."

The Six covenants you can see throughout the OT and NT are:

1) The covenant with Adam and Eve (marriage)
2) The covenant with Noah (family)
3) The covenant with Abraham (tribe - many families)
4) The covenant with Moses (Nation - many tribes)
5) The covenant with David (Kingdom)
6) The covenant established by Jesus (International - world-wide)

Note: The Hebrews also saw a covenant with creation. God created for six days and on the seventh made it holy and hallowed His creation. In Hebrew to swear an oath was to "seven" oneself.

If you understand covenant, then you will see how salvation history is about God growing his family. There is so much more I could share and I could spend pages sharing it with you. I alwas get excited about talking about this because it was an epiphany for me and it was like the blinders coming off when I realized this. There are so many passages in scripture that was very hard to understand if you did not understand what a covenant was.

I hope this helps and if you have any questions, I will do my best to answer them or I can point you to some good books.

God bless,




+++++++++++++========================++++++++++++++++++++++

Shaloom to you, And respect your view, but I will not change my understanding in this. I have studied some Hebrew,and I do agree that you can show Yahshua in Moses writings. He is YHWH's Man.
Thank you for presenting this nicely, May I ask, how would you present
Galations3: 8And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

9So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
15Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according
to the promise. Respectfully,Parsonsmom.
 
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triplet347

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Parsonsmom,

I appreciate your question and I will try to answer it fully here but keep in mind it is not a short answer for there are a lot of verses to look at. I’ll go through most of them, but I will focus on the parts referring to “will”, “promise”, and “covenant”.

Gal. 3:8
All the nations be blessed: The citation combines the Greek version of Gen. 12:3 and Gen. 18:18. God promised blessings for Abraham that extended well beyond both his tribal family and his lifetime. It was a promise of worldwide salvation to come.

Gal. 3:10
Cursed be every one -- A citation from Deut. 27:26. This is the final and climactic curse that Israel invoked upon itself in the oath ceremony that ratified the Deuteronomic covenant. In the subsequent context, Moses predicted the rebellion and cursing of Israel (Deut. 28:47-68) as well as the eventual restoration and blessing of Israel (Deut. 30:1-10). It is possible this passage was used by the Judaizers to insist on the necessity of circumcision, lest nonobservance of the Law result in a curse. Paul, however, uses it against them, charging that everyone who embraces the Law embraces the curse, for not even the Judaizers follow all of its demands to perfection (Gal. 6:13).

Book of the law: A technical term for the Book of Deuteronomy (Deut 29:21; 30:10), which was written on a scroll and placed beside the Ark of the Covenant (Deut. 31:26). Some read it with reference to the Mosaic Law more generally.

Gal. 3:11
He who through faith: A citation from Hab. 2:4. Habakkuk is assured that, despite the coming invasion of Judea by the Babylonians, the one who clings to the Lord in faith will be given the grace of protection and will survive the catastrophe. From this text Paul hails faith, not observance of the Law, as the foundation of justification (3:21-22; Rom. 1:17).

Gal. 3:12
He who does them: A citation from Lev. 18:5. Leviticus promises life to Israel for observing the Torah and shunning the sins of the Gentiles. Yet, as the recurring transgressions of Israel show (Neh. 9:29), the Mosaic Law did not come with the grace needed to keep it (Rom. 8:4). Paul may be interpreting this passage through the lens of Ezek 20:11, 13, 21, where the Prophet contrasts the Levitical promise of life given at Sinai with the Deuteronomic promises of curse and death issued on the plains of Moab (Ezek. 20:25-26).

Gal. 3:13
Cursed be every one: A citation from Deut. 21:23. This refers to the practice of hanging executed criminals on trees to avert the wrath of God (Num. 25:4; 2 Sam. 21:9). For Paul, Jesus bore the curses pressing down upon Israel when he mounted the Cross (Gal. 3:10). This act enabled the blessings of the Abrahamic covenant, held back for centuries because of the curse, to pour forth upon Israel and the world as a result (3:14). The Dead Sea Scrolls likewise associate crucifixion with the curse of Deut. 21:22-23.



Gal. 3:14
The blessing of Abraham: I.e., the Spirit, which is the messianic blessing revealed by the Prophets (Is. 44:3; Ezek. 36:26-27; Joel 2:28). The exact expression is from Gen. 28:4, where Isaac confers the blessing of Abraham upon his son Jacob. This shows that Isaac alone was the bearer of the Abrahamic blessing, not Ishmael or any other of Abraham’s sons (Rom. 9:7-9). Paul will capitalize on the significance of this in Gal 3:16 and 4:28.

Gal. 3:15-18
The major premise of Paul’s covenant theology in Galatians, namely, that Israel’s failure to keep the Mosaic covenant did not relieve God of his prior obligation to fulfill the Abrahamic covenant ratified centuries earlier. Since even human covenants are inviolable once they are ratified by oath, the covenant oath that God swore to Abraham is even more so (Gen. 22:16-18; Heb. 6:13-18). Not even the ratification of subsequent covenants under Moses could alter or annul God’s unconditional pledge to bless the world through Abraham’s offspring. In effect, then, the Abrahamic covenant both precedes and supersedes the Mosaic covenant that came after it.

Gal. 3:15
Will: The term means “testament” or “will” in secular Greek usage but “covenant” in biblical Greek usage. Despite the translation, the biblical sense of “covenant” is probably intended here, since (1) Paul uses the term this way in his other writings (Rom. 9:4; 11:27; 2 Cor. 3:6, 14; Eph. 2:12), (2) he uses it this way elsewhere in Galatians (3:17; 4:24), and (3) it is a known fact that a will in Greco-Roman antiquity could be altered or even annulled after the death of the testator who drafted it, which is the very point Paul denies in this verse. For a similar translation issue in Hebrews see Hebrews 9.

Gal 3:16
And to his offspring: A reference to Gen. 22:18. Paul is alluding to the covenant oath that God swore to Abraham to bless all nations through Isaac and his descendants (Sir. 44:21). It is significant for Paul that Abraham’s other son, Ishmael, was disinherited in the preceding chapter of Genesis and thus excluded from this covenant (Gen. 21:10-12). Thus, when Paul stresses that the word “offspring” is singular rather than plural, he is (1) alluding to the divine election of Isaac over Ishmael in the Genesis narrative (Gal 4:28-31; Rom. 9:7-8) and (2) implying that Isaac is a type of Christ, so that the act that elicits the promised blessing (the sacrifice of Isaac) prefigures the act that fulfills it (the sacrifice of Jesus).

Gal. 3:17

Four hundred and thirty years: The duration of Israel’s stay in Egypt before the Exodus (Ex. 12:40-41). Thus, the Abrahamic covenant, last confirmed with Jacob (Gen. 28:14), preceded the ratification of the Mosaic covenant by more than four centuries (Ex. 19-24).

Gal. 3:19
It was added: The Torah was inserted into history between the Abrahamic covenant and the New Covenant.

Because of: The Greek can indicate either the goal (“for the sake of”) or the cause (“by reason of”) for adding the Law. Paul may have both ideas in mind: the goal of the Law was to expose transgressions and heighten Israel’s awareness of sin (Rom. 3:20; 5:20; 7:7); the cause for adding the Law, at least the bulk of its sacrificial and ceremonial rites, was the rebellion of Israel during the Exodus period, particularly the golden calf transgression

Ordained by angels: Jewish tradition based on the Greek version of Deut. 33:2 held that Moses received the Torah from the hands of the angels (Acts 7:53; Heb. 2:2; Josephus, Antiquities 15, 136).

Gal. 3:20
An intermediary: Moses, who delivered the Torah to Israel (Ex. 20:18-22; Deut. 5:4-5). That the Mosaic covenant involved a mediator implied that more than one party was responsible for fulfilling the terms of the covenant – God and Israel. The Abrahamic covenant, by contrast, was a unilateral arrangement, i.e., God alone swore an oath and assumed the responsibility of blessing the world through Abraham’s offspring (Gen. 22:16-18).

God is one: The monotheistic creed of ancient Israel (Deut. 6:4).

Gal. 3:22
Consigned all things to sin: Scripture declares all peoples, Jews and Gentiles alike, prisoners of sin. Paul spells this out in Rom. 3:9-19 and Rom. 11:32.

Gal. 3:23
Kept under restraint: The mass of ethical, juridical, and ceremonial laws codified in the Torah was designed to keep Israel in temporary protective custody, lest it imitate the depravity of the Gentiles.

Gal. 3:27
Baptized into Christ: Baptism is the sacrament of faith (3:26) and the rite of Christian initiantion that replaces circumcision (Col. 2:11-12). It cleanse us of sin, joins us with Christ, and makes us righteous children of God (Acts 22:16; Tit. 3:5; 1 Pet. 3:21). Paul’s description of this mystery reflects early liturgical practice where the newly baptized put on a white garment to symbolize their purity in Christ (Rom. 13:14; Eph 4:24).

Gal. 3:28
You are all one: All peoples, irrespective of ethnic, gender, and social distinctions, are equal candidates for salvation and sonship in Christ (Col. 3:11).

I hope this helps.

Here’s more on the question of “Will or Covenant”:

Seventeen times the Letter to the Hebrews uses the Greek term diatheke, which is normally and rightly translated “covenant”. Most modern translations, however, make an exception for Heb. 9:16-17, where this same word is rendered either “will” or “testament” in two successive verses.

This shift in translation reflects an interpretive shift on the part of many scholars, who hold that the author of Hebrews jumps momentarily from a theological discussion about “covenants” to establish a legal analogy with last “wills” and “testaments”. The aim is to illustrate how the death of Jesus was necessary in order for Israel to receive its Christian inheritance. In support of this, scholars point out that in secular Greek, diatheke does indeed refer to a last will and testament. Moreover, it is said that a person’s will, once documented in writing, had no legal force while the person who drafted it was still alive; only when he died would the terms and benefits of the will go into effect. This testamentary view, which interprets Heb. 9:16-17 against the backdrop of secular Hellenistic culture, represents the majority opinion among biblical scholars today.

There is reason to believe, however, that the author may be thinking of a “covenant” in these two verses and not a person’s “will”. The literary context of Hebrews supports this, as does the historical context of testamentary practice in the New Testament period:

(1) Literary Context: Scholars are united in holding that every occurrence of diatheke in the Letter to the Hebrews, outside of these two disputed verses, refers to a covenant. No one doubts, in other words, that its author stands firmly within the stream of Jewish tradition represented by the Greek Septuagint, where diatheke is the standard translation for the Hebrew term berit, “covenant”. This is especially pronounced in Hebrews 8-9, where the author is drawing lines of comparison and contrast between the Old Covenant ratified under Moses and the New Covenant sealed by the blood of Jesus Christ. Since Heb. 9:16-17 is woven into the fabric of this discourse on covenant theology, there is every reason to believe that the author has a biblical background in mind when he speaks of a diatheke rather than a secular and Hellenistic one.

(2) Historical Context: Another strike against the testamentary reading of Heb 9:16-17 is that the author’s statements do not correspond precisely to accepted legal practice. For instance, Hebrews insists that a diatheke is confirmed only at death; yet history is clear that a last will and testament was considered valid before death, that is, as soon as it was properly drafted, publicly witnessed, and officially notarized. Hebrews likewise contends that a diatheke is not in force as long as the one who made it is living; yet history again shows that sometimes a testamentary inheritance was distributed to beneficiaries while the testator who drafted it was still alive. This to makes it unlikely that the author of Hebrews is thinking of a “will” instead of a “covenant” in Heb. 9:16-17.

The real benefit of translating diatheke as “covenant” in Heb. 9:16-17 is that it makes superior sense of the theological point being made. In other words, these verses are meant to explain how the death fo Jesus redeemed Israel from its “transgressions of the Mosaic covenant (Heb. 9:15) According to covenant practice in ancient Israel, parties who enter a covenant swear an oath that invokes the curse upon anyone who would dare to violated the covenant. This is precisely what Israel did at the foot of Mount Sinai when the nation entered its covenant with Yahweh. The ratification ceremony, which involved the slaying of oxen in a symbolic blood ritual, was a visible and tangible sign of the oath curse, signifying that Israel chose to accept the same deadly fate should it transgress the covenant (Ex. 24:1-8; Heb. 9:18-20). In other words, the animals slain by the covenant maker signified the curse of death that God would impose on the covenant breaker. Thus, as soon as Israel betrayed the covenant at Sinai, falling down in worship before the golden calf (Ex. 32:1-6), the nation placed itself under the curse of death (Ex. 32:27-28). However, instead of activating the full force of the curse then and there, God mercifully allowed Israel to live (Ex. 32:30-34) and instituted the annual Day of Atonement (Lev. 16:1-34) to hold the curse of death an bay until such time as he would deal with the transgressions of his people in a definitive way (Heb. 9:24-26).

Understood in these terms, the crucial text in Heb. 9:16-17 refers directly and specifically to the Sinai covenant and may be paraphrased as follows: “Where there is a covenant (like the one made at Sinai), the death of the (unfaithful) covenant partner must be endured (once it is broken). For a covenant is confirmed (as being in effect) when death occurs, since it is never in force when the (guilty) covenant partner is living.” The author is thus explaining how Israel, despite being guilty of transgressing the Mosaic covenant, was spared the curse of national death it had invoked upon itself. Instead, Jesus took this curse upon himself, finally putting the sanctions of the Mosaic covenant into full effect and bringing it all to an end (Heb. 9:15). This is the atonement theology of the Letter to the Hebrew, which is a covenant theology through and through. It shows us that Christ gave consent to death, not only to seal a new diatheke with the world, but to deal with the unfinished business of the old diatheke broken by Israel.


All of this is taken from Dr. Scott Hahn, who wrote the book, "Kinship By Covenant: A Canonical Approach to the Fulfillment of God's Saving Promises" He is also one of the most respected biblical theologian in the world.



Please read this fully. If you haven't read about covenants and covenant theology, then pick up a good book. I hope this helps.


God bless and Shabbat Shalom,
 
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parsonsmom

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Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. 14How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? Respectfully, Parsonsmom


I will be posting my ans.one at a time.
 
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triplet347

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That is no problem. Take your time and please don't rush to answer. I've been studying and reading about the covenant for almost 8 years. I find it to be central to understanding everything else about salvation history, God's oikonomia.

God bless,

I'll look forward to reading your responses as the come.
 
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parsonsmom

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shabot Shalom, I WILL BE POSTING THE SCRIPTURES YOUR POST ONE AT A TIME BY SUBJ.

Romans 10

King James Version (KJV)1Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.


2For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.
3For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
4For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)
7Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
12For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. 14How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?




 
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ReformedPharisee

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OBELIGATION "covenant" (lit., "a coming together"), which signifies a mutual undertaking between two parties or more, each binding himself to fulfill obligations, it does not in itself contain the idea of joint obligation, it mostly signifies an obligation undertaken by a single person. For instance, in Gal_3:17 it is used as an alternative to a "promise" (Gal_3:16-18). God enjoined upon Abraham the rite of circumcision, but His promise to Abraham, here called a "covenant," was not conditional upon the observance of circumcision, though a penalty attached to its nonobservance.
"The NT uses of the word may be analyzed as follows:
(a) a promise or undertaking, human or Divine, Gal_3:15;
(b) a promise or undertaking on the part of God, Luke_1:72; Acts_3:25; Rom_9:4; Rom_11:27; Gal_3:17; Eph_2:12; Heb_7:22; Heb_8:6,8,10; Heb_10:16;
(c) an agreement, a mutual undertaking, between God and Israel, see Deut_29; Deut_30 (described as a 'commandment,' Heb_7:18, cp. Heb_7:22); Heb_8:9; Heb_9:20;
(d) by metonymy, the token of the covenant, or promise, made to Abraham, Acts_7:8;
(e) by metonymy, the record of the covenant, 2_Cor_3:14; Heb_9:4; cp. Rev_11:19;
(f) the basis, established by the death of Christ, on which the salvation of men is secured, Matt_26:28; Mark_14:24; Luke_22:20; 1_Cor_11:25; 2_Cor_3:6; Heb_10:29; Heb_12:24; Heb_13:20.




Gal.3:15
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15Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
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To speak in terms of human relations, if even a man makes a last will and testament; merely human

covenant, no one sets it aside or makes it void or adds to it when once it has been drawn up and signed;

ratified,or confirmed.

Now the promises; covenants, agreements were decreed and made to Abraham and his Seed; his

Offspring, his Heir. He; God does not say, And to seeds; descendants, heirs, as if referring to many

persons, but, And to your Seed; your Descendant, your Heir, obviously referring to one individual, Who is

none other than Christ; the Messiah. This is my argument: The Law, which began 430 years after the

covenant concerning the coming Messiah, does not and cannot annul the covenant previously

established; ratified by God, so as to abolish the promise and make it void;For if the inheritance of the

promise depends on observing the Law; as these false teachers would like you to believe, it no longer

depends on the promise; however, God gave it to Abraham as a free gift solely by virtue of His promise.

What then was the purpose of the Law? It was added later on, after the promise, to disclose and expose

to men their guilt because of transgressions and to make men more conscious of the sinfulness of sin;

and it was intended to be in effect until the Seed; the Descendant, the Heir should come, to and

concerning Whom the promise had been made. And it; the Law was arranged and ordained and appointed

through the instrumentality of angels; and was given by the hand; in the person of a go-between;

Moses, an intermediary person between God and man. Now a go-between; intermediary has to do with

and implies more than one party; there can be no mediator with just one person. Yet God is only one

Person; and He was the sole party in giving that promise to Abraham. But the Law was a contract

between two, God and Israel; its validity was dependent on both. Is the Law then contrary and opposed

to the promises of God? Of course not! For if a Law had been given which could confer; spiritual life, then

righteousness and right standing with God would certainly have come by Law; But the Scripture; picture

all mankind as sinners; shut up and imprisoned by sin, so that the inheritance, blessing, which was

promised through faith in Jesus Christ; the Messiah; might be given; released, delivered, and committed

to all those who believe; who adhere to and trust in and rely on Him.

Now before the faith came, we were perpetually guarded under the Law, kept in custody in preparation

for the faith that was destined to be revealed; unveiled, disclosed, So that the Law served to us Jews as

our trainer our guardian, our guide to Christ, to lead us until Christ came, that we might be justified;

declared righteous, put in right standing with God by and through faith. But now that the faith has come,

we are no longer under a trainer; the guardian of our childhood.

For in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God through faith.

For as many of you as were baptized into Christ; into a spiritual union and communion with Christ, the

Anointed One, the Messiah; have put on; clothed yourselves with The annointed one.

Respectfully, Parsonsmom.


What is your point or question in all of this?
 
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ReformedPharisee

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That is no problem. Take your time and please don't rush to answer. I've been studying and reading about the covenant for almost 8 years. I find it to be central to understanding everything else about salvation history, God's oikonomia.

God bless,

I'll look forward to reading your responses as the come.


Triplet...you are correct! I didn't see your question, but understanding the New Covenant IS most definitely paramount to correctly understanding and applying covenant principles. We cannot enter into eternal life without entering into the covenant, but even then, we have people running around the landscape today with false ideas about covenant understanding.
 
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parsonsmom

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Triplet...you are correct! I didn't see your question, but understanding the New Covenant IS most definitely paramount to correctly understanding and applying covenant principles. We cannot enter into eternal life without entering into the covenant, but even then, we have people running around the landscape today with false ideas about covenant understanding.

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Shalom Triplet; We must understand thatThe First Covenant was not abolished; The whole of the Word must be recoganized for us to see the full impact of the Word. Jesus became the curse; He actually became that curse; see the latter part of Duet.28; the first verses are the blessings,

Gal.3:
11But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

12And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hanged on a tree: 14That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
it is so clear if you approach; with an open mind;
so when Jesus was raised up from the dead; He became our High Preast; the change of the High Preast had to be changed so the rabenecal law was abolished; however;
The People still remain in the bondage even after they are born again because; they perish because of lack of knowledge; but to know the WORD; The Truth; The Truth; The Word; will set you free.
So People quote; The Truth will set you free; is not a true statement; is a half truth; but if you know the Word;
the Word;Truth; will set you free.it is a good time to make
a decision to put all man made rules out of your life; they are the law to you;if you follow something other than
Gods word. Respectfully; parsonsmom
 
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