Obama in Berlin!

[SpiritualAntiseptic]

hmmm I don't know about hating America because "They're just jealous!!" it might be because they don't like having people starting wars that can be avoided for bogus reasons. I myself don't particularly care for that aspect of America.
tulc(just a thought)

i don't think there is any large group of people that hate America for that reason.

 

[Izdaari Eristikon]

Which ones, specifically? I've had a hard time finding McCain supporters who actually want to discuss the issues. The only one anyone has offered is abortion, which doesn't make sense to me, since McCain has already said he's not going to try and overturn Roe vs Wade.

I'm a neolibertarian and a dues-paying member of the Libertarian Party. I wouldn't characterize myself as a McCain supporter or a Republican, though at this point I'd probably vote for him over Obama.

I think the same Iraq strategy that McCain favored, and that Bush finally got on board with, is working very well.

I'm pretty much on the same page with him on energy policy and immigration (assuming he's heard the American people, as he says he has, on the need for strong border controls in addition to the other elements of his plan).

I think McCain will try to keep government smaller, taxes lower, and regulations fewer than Obama, and that's the approach I prefer. I don't think McCain is good on any of that, just less bad than Obama. He will grow government, but he'll grow it slower than Obama. What I want is a reversal, a radical down-sizing of government, but no one is offering that.

I prefer strict constructionist, originalist judges, and McCain says that's what he'll appoint. I don't know how much I believe him, but I know Obama will appoint liberal judges. For me, this has nothing to do with abortion... it's not one of my issues. But an individual rights understanding of the 2nd Amendment is, and limiting the scope of government is, and a conservative bench is essential to both. A libertarian activist bench might be even better, but again, no one is offering that.

 

[tulc]

i don't think there is any large group of people that hate America for that reason.

As is your right. But since all we have here is us exchanging opinions, that would fall under "Opinions are like noses, everyone has one, you just pick the one you like best."
tulc(who picks coffee)

 

[SpiritualAntiseptic]

My opinions are based on facts- others are based on what people would like to believe.

 

[Sign Of The Fish Burger]

Yet we've yet to see any hard "facts" in this thread- the facts you have claimed over and over to have.

Care to share them with us, SpiritualAntiseptic?

 

[SpiritualAntiseptic]

I have already explained it through the use of reason and logic.

It seems some people would rather ignore simple logic and common sense- and dismiss reasoning as 'opinions'. Nevertheless, here are some facts:

-We attacked Serbia/Kosovo- the people of Kosovo do not hate the US.
-We attacked Iraq and Afghanistan - the people of those countries do not hate the US.

People of France, Germany and other failing European states hate the US- when we have not attacked them. They hate us for our cold war military bases there. For them, it is a reminder of dependence- a dependence they are resentful for.

When you look at states like Australia, England, Ireland and others, where they are doing well economically, there isn't the same hateful rhetorical widespread among their politicians.

Same goes for the Arab states, like Kuwait, Dubai and other wealthy places. But in places where they are doing poorly- you find increased hatred towards Israel and the United States. These are popular distractions for their leaders and politicians.

When you ask anti-Americans what their problem is- it always has something to do with power. "Bossing around the world"... etc. But they can't dig any deeper than that. It is an indicator of their resentment over the power and wealth of the United States. We have consistently gone along with the world in dealing with problems. We didn't want to go into Kosovo- that was Europe's idea. The same goes with the Gulf War.

Then, after spending the 90s playing appeasement to the Arabs- we finally got attacked on 9/11. The world mosstly went along with going after the terrorists. But when we wanted to do something about actually stopping it- by being aggressive towards Syria, Iran, Libya, Iraq and others- the world (Europe) want no matter in it. They wanted to continue to look the other way. We came to find out later how much certain states like France were involved in Iraq (food for oil scandal). Their national interests were in mind, as the Middle-East was their oil supply (ours is primarily in the Americas).

 

[tulc]

-We attacked Serbia/Kosovo- the people of Kosovo do not hate the US.
-We attacked Iraq and Afghanistan - the people of those countries do not hate the US.

People of France, Germany and other failing European states hate the US- when we have not attacked them. They hate us for our cold war military bases there. For them, it is a reminder of dependence- a dependence they are resentful for.

uhmmm which of the above are facts? Because they sound an awful lot like your opinions.

When you look at states like Australia, England, Ireland and others, where they are doing well economically, there isn't the same hateful rhetorical widespread among their politicians.

I'm assuming you mean rhetoric, and, again where would the facts be? You have proof we are more loved there then other countries? And it's because they are doing better financially? And as proof you offer...opinion?

Same goes for the Arab states, like Kuwait, Dubai and other wealthy places. But in places where they are doing poorly- you find increased hatred towards Israel and the United States. These are popular distractions for their leaders and politicians.

When you ask anti-Americans what their problem is- it always has something to do with power. "Bossing around the world"... etc. But they can't dig any deeper than that. It is an indicator of their resentment over the power and wealth of the United States. We have consistently gone along with the world in dealing with problems. We didn't want to go into Kosovo- that was Europe's idea. The same goes with the Gulf War.

...I'm trying to think of anther way of saying "again all you have here is opinion, not proof." but I can't seem to think of one.

Then, after spending the 90s playing appeasement to the Arabs- we finally got attacked on 9/11. The world mosstly went along with going after the terrorists. But when we wanted to do something about actually stopping it- by being aggressive towards Syria, Iran, Libya, Iraq and others- the world (Europe) want no matter in it. They wanted to continue to look the other way. We came to find out later how much certain states like France were involved in Iraq (food for oil scandal). Their national interests were in mind, as the Middle-East was their oil supply (ours is primarily in the Americas).

uhmmm 9/11, I understand attacking Afghanistan, it gets a little unclear why we're in Iraq. Be that as it may, you are (again) offering your opinion why other countries are doing things and not a shred of proof. You may be right, you could also be completely wrong. But again it is simply your opinions being offered instead of proof. Don't agree? That, like your opinions is your right.
tulc(who's opinion is: strong coffee, it's good just before bed)

 

[FatBurger]

I'm a neolibertarian and a dues-paying member of the Libertarian Party...

Thanks, I appreciate your input

 

[LovebirdsFlying]

My opinions are based on facts- others are based on what people would like to believe.

Ohhhhh. That means you're right and everybody else is wrong. OK, I get it.

 

[tulc]

My opinions are based on facts- others are based on what people would like to believe.

in the end though, they would still just be your opinion
tulc(prefers hot coffee over cold, but isn't really all that fussy)

 

[Rochir]

1. Improving America's image abroad.
2. Ending the War in Iraq.
3. Refocusing on, finishing, and winning the war on terror in Afganistan.
4. Ending abuses of Executive power.
5. Stopping the torture of "enemy combatants" at Gitmo.
6. Appointing progressive judges.
7. Fighting climate change.
8. Rebuking No Child Left Behind.
9. Restraining big Oil and Pharmaceutical Companies.
10. Ending tax cuts for the rich and giving bigger tax cuts to the middle class.

These are just ten reasons that came to the top of my head. Do you want more reasons?

You GO!!!! *high-fives team mate*

 

[Rochir]

What the media isn't reporting was the concert that was going on before Obama's speech, which is what gathered the crowds.

The level of media bias for this guy is astounding.

Yeah, yeah, you're ABSOLUTELY right! ALL these peeps came just for the free music!

DOH!

 

[Rochir]

Why would a foreign citizen want a candidate unless they were going to be detrimental to us? It's simple logic, simple reason.

LOL, you're so cute spewing hate against anyone disagreeing with the "mighty" U.S.A.!

 

[Protinus]

LOL, you're so cute spewing hate against anyone disagreeing with the "mighty" U.S.A.!

 

[Gukkor]

Still at it, I see...

 

[demodocos]

People of France, Germany and other failing European states hate the US- when we have not attacked them. They hate us for our cold war military bases there. For them, it is a reminder of dependence- a dependence they are resentful for.

The USA don't have any bases in France and in Germany, most people lament the USA's decision to close bases and to transfer troops to other countries as a sign of the growing alienation between our countries that has devastated the communities that have grown around those bases in the past 50 years.


I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

 

[Adammi]

I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

That probably describes most Americans.

 

[Rochir]

I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

Ditto!

 

[Sign Of The Fish Burger]

The USA don't have any bases in France and in Germany, most people lament the USA's decision to close bases and to transfer troops to other countries as a sign of the growing alienation between our countries that has devastated the communities that have grown around those bases in the past 50 years.


I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

I think that unfortunately describes most Americans I know.

Heck I'm a Canadian living in the US and I'm surprised at how little people know about where I come from- and we share a [very large] boarder!

 

[tulc]

I don't think you know much about the world outside the US.

...there's a World...OUTSIDE of America?
When did THAT happen?
tulc(really needs to start paying better attention)