Nude Evolution: the right progression of selection pressures, will evolve "Evolution"?

[Gottservant]

Please address these pressures:

first there could be pressure to be understood, then pressure to be re-used, then pressure to be foretelling

I am not just hanging on because I want you to change the word or the meaning of the word or the place the word is used, I am trying to understand it?

People all have a different approach to theory, in general, you should start to recognise that (if you want your theory to be embraced, for what the Teacher teaches by it?)

 

[Shemjaza]

Yes it is! Darwin wrote about species interacting with other species in a symbiotic way, before he found evidence of it. If you don't think that was relevant to his theory, you are missing the point?

The concept of symbiosis was known long before Darwin.

It is also irrelevant to methods of judgement and to the theory and process of evolution.

Evolutionists are saying "there is no more individual," they say "only Evolution"!

Again, no, they are not saying that.

 

[Shemjaza]

Please address these pressures:


I am not just hanging on because I want you to change the word or the meaning of the word or the place the word is used, I am trying to understand it?

People all have a different approach to theory, in general, you should start to recognise that (if you want your theory to be embraced, for what the Teacher teaches by it?)

If you start changing meanings you are changing the topic of discussion.

A different approach to theory, in general means you are no longer talking about scientific theories and so you are no longer talking about the theory of evolution.

 

[Gottservant]

If you start changing meanings you are changing the topic of discussion.

I don't want to change the meaning. I don't.

If you don't start defining what it is the motivates you, in keeping the theory of Evolution, you will be tempted to change the meaning (in ways that do not strengthen it).

A different approach to theory, in general means you are no longer talking about scientific theories and so you are no longer talking about the theory of evolution.

Words are quantifiable, there is nothing to suggest that science cannot be performed on words and their meanings.

Or are you afraid I will find there is nothing to it? That you have been beating a dead horse all along?

 

[Shemjaza]

I don't want to change the meaning. I don't.

If you don't start defining what it is the motivates you, in keeping the theory of Evolution, you will be tempted to change the meaning (in ways that do not strengthen it).

That is a change in topics. "defining what it is the motivates you, in keeping the theory of Evolution" is not a discussion of the theory of evolution.

The theory of evolution is a scientific theory that is supported by facts found in studying the physical world. In particular geology and biology.

Words are quantifiable, there is nothing to suggest that science cannot be performed on words and their meanings.

Or are you afraid I will find there is nothing to it? That you have been beating a dead horse all along?

Some kind of scientific study of words and language is fine... but that is a completely different topic to a scientific study of how populations of life develops and changes over generations.

This is an example of what I was talking about, you changed the meaning and so you have changed the topic.

If you want to talk about the study of motivations or words... then you are not talking about the study of the theory of evolution.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

All to quickly do you assume that if you don't understand it: no one does.

From time to time God sends people to me, that understand and rejoice that I make the sense that I do.

I am not saying I hope for people like you, to be people like them, just that as the Spirit urges so I speak.

If you were smart you would be trying to refine my urges?

No, Gottservant, you simply just do not understand anything that you are talking about. You understand nothing about evolution or science and whenever it is explained to you, you just ignore it and go off on random nonsense all over again.

 

[Gottservant]

No, Gottservant, you simply just do not understand anything that you are talking about. You understand nothing about evolution or science and whenever it is explained to you, you just ignore it and go off on random nonsense all over again.

It's what I call toe-fu: the art of using the theory of perpetual change, to make wild conjectures.

 

[Gottservant]

The interesting thing, is that the promise Evolution makes, is "with the right selection pressures, you can be anything you want" - not any kind of thing you want, but any thing. I don't trust this promise. I don't trust this promise, because I have never seen evidence of one kind becoming another kind. You have never shown evidence of one kind becoming another kind - and when you see a butterfly come from a caterpillar, you say "metamorphosis".

If change of kind was so important, why would not every creature be capable of metamorphosis!

 

[Gene2memE]

The interesting thing, is that the promise Evolution makes, is "with the right selection pressures, you can be anything you want"

No, it doesn't.

Evolution is a process (actually, a combination of processes).

Given that there are inherently random elements in these processes, you can't guarantee what the impact of any particular set of selection pressures is going to be on populations of organisms.

- not any kind of thing you want, but any thing. I don't trust this promise. I don't trust this promise, because I have never seen evidence of one kind becoming another kind.

I have never seen a sapling become a tree. Does this mean that the process of growing is non-existent?
I have never seen Pluto complete an orbit of the sun. Does this mean that it doesn't?

Or could it be that I don't need to personally witness something occurring to be rationally justified in accepting that it does actually occur?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

It's what I call toe-fu: the art of using the theory of perpetual change, to make wild conjectures.

No, it's called being stupid and willfully ignorant.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

The interesting thing, is that the promise Evolution makes, is "with the right selection pressures, you can be anything you want" - not any kind of thing you want, but any thing. I don't trust this promise. I don't trust this promise, because I have never seen evidence of one kind becoming another kind. You have never shown evidence of one kind becoming another kind - and when you see a butterfly come from a caterpillar, you say "metamorphosis".

If change of kind was so important, why would not every creature be capable of metamorphosis!

Evolution doesn't promise anything. It is not a religion or a philosophy or an ideology. It is simply a fact of biological science.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Evolution doesn't promise anything. It is not a religion or a philosophy or an ideology. It is simply a fact of biological science.

Indeed -- it's descriptive, not prescriptive.

It's like gravity -- if you jump out of a 40th-floor window, I can, with 100% accuracy, predict that you will end up as a red stain on the pavement below.
That's descriptive -- in no way am I saying that you should or deserve to become street pizza; that would be prescriptive.

The only promise that evolution or any other physical science makes is that physical actions have physical reactions. What you want, need, or deserve are irrelevant... so stay away from that window; I assure you that you will not grow wings halfway down.