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You are reading words into the bible that are not there.
((Please provide scriptural support for "free will" or a "choice" other than going to hell.)))
OK:
- Romans 2:6-7 "For He will render to every man according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, He will give eternal life."
- Mark 8 34 Then, calling the crowd to join his disciples, he said, If any of you wants to be my follower, you must turn from your selfish ways, take up your cross, and follow me. 35 If you try to hang on to your life, you will lose it. But if you give up your life for my sake and for the sake of the Good News, you will save it.
- Matthew 6:14 "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father also will forgive you; but if you don not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses."
- Matthew 19:16-17 "'Teacher, what good deed must I do, to have eternal life?'...'If you would enter life, keep the commandments.'"
Typical snipit prooftext religion without regard to the immediate context or the context of the teaching of the Scriptures as a whole. Utter nonsense and man centered BS.I don't think your understanding of scripture is complete.
Here's the truth:
1 Tim 2
1I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone 2for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. 3This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4who wants all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
God wants all men to choose him.
He gives us the chance to follow him or reject him.
These verses are also very intriquing. We shouldn't be too hasty to judge the salvation of others. We must do our best to do what is right with the revelation we have received.
1 Timothy 4:10
10For therefore we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe.
1 Peter 1:17
17 The Father is the One Who judges you by what you do. He does not respect one person more than another. If you call Him Father, be sure you honor Him with love and fear all the days of your life here on earth.
You are reading words into the bible that are not there.
If Paul tells us to strive, then it requires our effort.
If Jesus tells us to forgive others, then this is a task assigned to US.
If we don't bear fruit, is this God's fault?
How can God render according to our works if we have no will?Good Day,
None of these say may has a free will.....You personal interpretation is lacking
Care to try again?
In Him,
Bill
We must strive, and must forgive others if we are to be forgiven.Just to add a question, you have provided statements and verses that state what men ought to do. Can you provide verses that state that the unregenerate man is able to do what he ought to do?
Feel free to put them in context.Typical snipit prooftext religion without regard to the immediate context or the context of the teaching of the Scriptures as a whole. Utter nonsense and man centered BS.
Perhaps later. Right now I have neither the time or inclination to bother with a heritic.Feel free to put them in context.
I note with Calvinists that this usually means quoting sources other than the bible.
Let's see the correct context from your perspective.
Just to add a question, you have provided statements and verses that state what men ought to do. Can you provide verses that state that the unregenerate man is able to do what he ought to do?
How can God render according to our works if we have no will?
God did not create Robots.
I already tried introducing the concept of reading the Bible while keeping the literary devices of imperative versus indicative. He wasn't interested. His is the same argument that Erasmus, and Pelagius before him, made. If God commands it, man can do it.
God bless
You are introducing the ideas of men that contradict the bible.I already tried introducing the concept of reading the Bible while keeping the literary devices of imperative versus indicative. He wasn't interested. His is the same argument that Erasmus, and Pelagius before him, made. If God commands it, man can do it.
God bless
Why would Jesus spend so much time instructing us in the good works we should do if we are incapable?You are introducing the ideas of men that contradict the bible.
If you can't accept the very clear teaching of the bible that men will be judged for their actions, then I can't help you.
I will try to provide some clear scriptures to further the point, however. You can mince them up in any way you choose if will ease your conscience.
You are introducing the ideas of men that contradict the bible.
If you can't accept the very clear teaching of the bible that men will be judged for their actions, then I can't help you.
I will try to provide some clear scriptures to further the point, however. You can mince them up in any way you choose if will ease your conscience.
Why would Jesus spend so much time instructing us in the good works we should do if we are incapable?
He condemns no one.
We have the choice to accept his gifts or reject them.
It's nonsensical when viewed from a Calvinist perspective.What's He supposed to instruct us to do, bad works? What a nonsensical statement. You read verses which tell us what to do and, instead of falling to your knees in recognition of your helplessness and lack of natural inclination to embrace God, you arrogantly presume that you are meeting the conditions set forth by your God. Good one. That's gonna go over well.
What is condemnation but the just judgement of God upon the wicked? If God doesn't condemn anyone, who does?
And why do we choose one way or the other? Notice, I said "WHY" not "how" so please, for the sake of expediency, do not respond with the token Roman answer of "FREE WILL!!!"
God created us.It's nonsensical when viewed from a Calvinist perspective.
To a Calvinist, men are incapable of doing good or seeking God's grace.
All good comes from God, of course, but he created us in his image.
If God wants us all to be saved, then apparently we either are all saved, OR, our actions can prevent our salvation.
It's nonsensical when viewed from a Calvinist perspective.
To a Calvinist, men are incapable of doing good or seeking God's grace.
All good comes from God, of course, but he created us in his image.
If God wants us all to be saved, then apparently we either are all saved, OR, our actions can prevent our salvation.
God created us.
If we are wicked and have no chance of doing good, then it is his fault.
However, if he gives us a choice and we choose to be wicked, then it is our fault.
Do you disagree?
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