Noahide laws

[visionary]

Can we make it LazyBoy?

I can never get the lever on the side to stay in its proper position, I keep coming back up with a thump.

 

[Yahudim]

Can we make it LazyBoy?

Already beat you to it!

 

[visionary]

Can we make it LazyBoy?

One with the lever on the side.. I like to recline.

 

[yedida]

One with the lever on the side.. I like to recline.

Yeppers.

 

[Lulav]

I can never get the lever on the side to stay in its proper position, I keep coming back up with a thump.

You in Alabammy right? it must be the kinds they sell, I saw one that did that in Sweet Home Alabama movie where Melanie's father has one just like that and sends poor Kate (Candace Bergen) practically into orbit!

 

[ContraMundum]

Only one thing missing that I see. The 7 Noahide laws are not spelled out in Torah. They are interpretations of the laws found in the talmud.

Of course the Laws are in the Torah. You just have to know where and how to find them.

Of course there is no list of the seven Noachide Laws, but then again, the Torah doesn't list out which laws are for who etc...you have to dig and find and sort.

What I do like is that the laws are now being codified and defined. I used to argue that the 7 Laws were too easy, but I have decided that while they are not as tough as the NT laws they are not too easy either.

This is a Jewish invention back in 1200 AD to handle the interested Gentiles in Judaism.

Actually, there are records of the Noachide Laws being referred to much much earlier.

 

[pat34lee]

Of course the Laws are in the Torah. You just have to know where and how to find them.

Of course there is no list of the seven Noachide Laws, but then again, the Torah doesn't list out which laws are for who etc...you have to dig and find and sort.

What I do like is that the laws are now being codified and defined. I used to argue that the 7 Laws were too easy, but I have decided that while they are not as tough as the NT laws they are not too easy either.

Actually, there are records of the Noachide Laws being referred to much much earlier.

There are many laws in the Torah, not just the ten commandments and the so-called Noahide laws. Neither of the above apply only to gentiles, or to Jews. Those given in Genesis apply to all believers just as those in Leviticus and Deuteronomy (not counting those for specific sub-groups). The only time that laws are specifically mentioned not to apply refer to those in Israel who are not believers; the strangers. They were only to follow such laws as to not cause problems for those who follow the law.

 

[visionary]

You in Alabammy right? it must be the kinds they sell, I saw one that did that in Sweet Home Alabama movie where Melanie's father has one just like that and sends poor Kate (Candace Bergen) practically into orbit!

Yep.. how did you ever guess... we must have bought from the same store...

 

[Qnts2]

Of course the Laws are in the Torah. You just have to know where and how to find them.

Of course there is no list of the seven Noachide Laws, but then again, the Torah doesn't list out which laws are for who etc...you have to dig and find and sort.

What I do like is that the laws are now being codified and defined. I used to argue that the 7 Laws were too easy, but I have decided that while they are not as tough as the NT laws they are not too easy either.



Actually, there are records of the Noachide Laws being referred to much much earlier.

Yup, I agree.

This may have already been said, but just to add to this.

All people are descended from Noah, so all people are essentially 'Noachides'. The laws which apply to all people are the same laws that Noah was required to do. So the laws required by Noah and all of his descendents would start with Adam, after the fall, on forward to Noahs lifetime.

 

[visionary]

Of course the Laws are in the Torah. You just have to know where and how to find them.

Of course there is no list of the seven Noachide Laws, but then again, the Torah doesn't list out which laws are for who etc...you have to dig and find and sort.

What I do like is that the laws are now being codified and defined. I used to argue that the 7 Laws were too easy, but I have decided that while they are not as tough as the NT laws they are not too easy either.

Actually, there are records of the Noachide Laws being referred to much much earlier.

Nochide and 7 Nochide the laws have absolutely no scriptural foundation. Particularly non-scriptural is the punishment for breaking any of these "laws", which is beheading. Nowhere is that form of capital punishment proscribed in either the Tanakh, or B'rit Chadashah.

 

[Qnts2]

Nochide and 7 Nochide the laws have absolutely no scriptural foundation. Particularly non-scriptural is the punishment for breaking any of these "laws", which is beheading. Nowhere is that form of capital punishment proscribed in either the Tanakh, or B'rit Chadashah.

I agree on the beheading. That is not in scripture and not scriptural. All I can say is we are talking about the Talmud, which is Rabbinical opinion. There are a lot of opinions, some opposing each other, and usually with no firm decision. The main section on the Noachide laws is very lengthy. In otherwords, I have never seen a teaching in Judaism which accepts the beheading as the punishment for violating the Noachide laws.

I agree with you that beheading is not scriptural.

 

[Yahudim]

Nochide and 7 Nochide the laws have absolutely no scriptural foundation. Particularly non-scriptural is the punishment for breaking any of these "laws", which is beheading. Nowhere is that form of capital punishment proscribed in either the Tanakh, or B'rit Chadashah.

Y'know, this discussion about the Naugahyde Laws occasionally crops up in this forum like a bad patch of weeds that just won't go away. However, I don't know of any in Messianic Judaism that allows that they apply to themselves. It seems the rubes are the only ones that voluntarily submit to this farce. I notice that the Ten Commandments don't have to be 'teased' out of scripture. You don't have to 'know where to look' to find them, y'know? You would think that the commandments purposed for all mankind wouldn't be buried in the text but the commandments intended as a cultural marker for the Jews would be so easy to find. Whoda thunk?

 

[visionary]

Those gentiles who follow this notion are called.. "Hasidic Gentiles"

 

[visionary]

I have always been curious as to where this arouse from... LIMB OF A LIVING CREATURE against eating a limb severed from a living animal, beast, or fowl against eating the flesh of any animal which was torn by a wild beast ... which, in part, prohibits the eating of such flesh as was torn off an animal while it was still alive

 

[Qnts2]

Y'know, this discussion about the Naugahyde Laws occasionally crops up in this forum like a bad patch of weeds that just won't go away. However, I don't know of any in Messianic Judaism that allows that they apply to themselves. It seems the rubes are the only ones that voluntarily submit to this farce. I notice that the Ten Commandments don't have to be 'teased' out of scripture. You don't have to 'know where to look' to find them, y'know? You would think that the commandments purposed for all mankind wouldn't be buried in the text but the commandments intended as a cultural marker for the Jews would be so easy to find. Whoda thunk?

In all fairness, some of the commands which are included in the 613 are also not clearly listed like the 10. Some are implied.

To me, the Noachide commands are reasonably clear, even if not all together.

Noah was not told not to blaspheme, but it is clear from scripture leading up to Noah that blaspheming is wrong. It is also clear that one should not engage in idol worship from scripture leading up to the time of Noah, even though Noah was not told by God directly to him, he shouldn't worship idols.

I once did some calculations on who could have actually met who at that time, given the length people lived. I think that Noah and Adam were alive at the same time, although Adam was very very old and died when Noah was very young. My point is, Noah could have talked to Adam. Scripture doesn't say so we will never know, and since scripture doesn't say, God did not consider that information important.

But overall, I am sometimes rather surprised that people fight against the Noachide laws as if they are wrong and not scriptural. Who would try to argue that theft was ok or the sexual immorality is ok. Or that God permitted these things during Noah's time. They really are all there but not in a simple list like the 10 commandments.

1. Prohibition of Idolatry
2. Prohibition of Murder
3. Prohibition of Theft
4. Prohibition of Sexual immorality
5. Prohibition of Blasphemy
6. Prohibition of eating flesh taken from an animal while it is still alive
7. Establishment of courts of law

 

[visionary]

In all fairness, some of the commands which are included in the 613 are also not clearly listed like the 10. Some are implied.

To me, the Noachide commands are reasonably clear, even if not all together.

Noah was not told not to blaspheme, but it is clear from scripture leading up to Noah that blaspheming is wrong. It is also clear that one should not engage in idol worship from scripture leading up to the time of Noah, even though Noah was not told by God directly to him, he shouldn't worship idols.

I once did some calculations on who could have actually met who at that time, given the length people lived. I think that Noah and Adam were alive at the same time, although Adam was very very old and died when Noah was very young. My point is, Noah could have talked to Adam. Scripture doesn't say so we will never know, and since scripture doesn't say, God did not consider that information important.

But overall, I am sometimes rather surprised that people fight against the Noachide laws as if they are wrong and not scriptural. Who would try to argue that theft was ok or the sexual immorality is ok. Or that God permitted these things during Noah's time. They really are all there but not in a simple list like the 10 commandments.

1. Prohibition of Idolatry
2. Prohibition of Murder
3. Prohibition of Theft
4. Prohibition of Sexual immorality
5. Prohibition of Blasphemy
6. Prohibition of eating flesh taken from an animal while it is still alive
7. Establishment of courts of law

The Laws of Noahide prohibit us from acknowledging Yeshua as our Lord under the penalty of death... what is our first clue there is something wrong with it? All Gentiles found keeping the 7th day Sabbath shall be found guilty of breaking the Noahide Law and must be punished to the fullest… Decapitation. So wouldn't that be our second clue?? Just because the poison was placed in a glass of kool-aid, doesn't make it good or right to drink.

 

[Yahudim]

No one is fighting against the principles of honesty or morality dear one. Only against the preposterous tray on which these are packaged and served. There is no doubt that YHVH has always wanted all mankind to love Him and to love each other.

Those principles of behavior are uniform throughout scripture. There is also no doubt that, even though He finally had to select one people to embody these principles so that they could demonstrate them to the rest of the world, there is no indication that He wanted one group of people to operate under one set of rules and another to operate under another.

Even in the 'Jewish' scriptures, it is prophesied that gentiles would receive an inheritance in the land with their brothers, the children of Israel - just as the mixed multitude that survived the exodus from Egypt did. So no, I do not accept this contrivance of the rabbis.

In all fairness, some of the commands which are included in the 613 are also not clearly listed like the 10. Some are implied.

To me, the Noachide commands are reasonably clear, even if not all together.

Noah was not told not to blaspheme, but it is clear from scripture leading up to Noah that blaspheming is wrong. It is also clear that one should not engage in idol worship from scripture leading up to the time of Noah, even though Noah was not told by God directly to him, he shouldn't worship idols.

I once did some calculations on who could have actually met who at that time, given the length people lived. I think that Noah and Adam were alive at the same time, although Adam was very very old and died when Noah was very young. My point is, Noah could have talked to Adam. Scripture doesn't say so we will never know, and since scripture doesn't say, God did not consider that information important.

But overall, I am sometimes rather surprised that people fight against the Noachide laws as if they are wrong and not scriptural. Who would try to argue that theft was ok or the sexual immorality is ok. Or that God permitted these things during Noah's time. They really are all there but not in a simple list like the 10 commandments.

1. Prohibition of Idolatry
2. Prohibition of Murder
3. Prohibition of Theft
4. Prohibition of Sexual immorality
5. Prohibition of Blasphemy
6. Prohibition of eating flesh taken from an animal while it is still alive
7. Establishment of courts of law

 

[yedida]

No one is fighting against the principles of honesty or morality dear one. Only against the preposterous tray on which these are packaged and served. There is no doubt that YHVH has always wanted all mankind to love Him and to love each other.

Those principles of behavior are uniform throughout scripture. There is also no doubt that, even though He finally had to select one people to embody these principles so that they could demonstrate them to the rest of the world, there is no indication that He wanted one group of people to operate under one set of rules and another to operate under another.

Even in the 'Jewish' scriptures, it is prophesied that gentiles would receive an inheritance in the land with their brothers, the children of Israel - just as the mixed multitude that survived the exodus from Egypt did. So no, I do not accept this contrivance of the rabbis.

I dunt 'cept 'em neither

 

[visionary]

Unlike the Torah teaching found in Deuteronomy 17:6, that requires the testimony of two or three witnesses before one can be executed, according to the Noahide Law it only takes one witness! Whoever is to be found breaking one of these laws, is subject to capital punishment by decapitation. Is this the type of world we want to live in?

 

[Yahudim]

Unlike the Torah teaching found in Deuteronomy 17:6, that requires the testimony of two or three witnesses before one can be executed, according to the Noahide Law it only takes one witness! Whoever is to be found breaking one of these laws, is subject to capital punishment by decapitation. Is this the type of world we want to live in?

Sounds like sharia law to me... Maybe this is a prophecy?