Noah wasn't a "preacher." He didn't "preach" to anyone.

[Der Alte]

I've heard a funny saying. Noah was a conspiracy theorist until the rain came down lol.
The size of the ark could of had a impact. Who would of thought that much water would Flood the land for the ark to float.
Interesting that some theories of accounts in scripture can be similar. Here's my own example I read Genesis days as such 1,2,4,3,5,6. I know not many will believe such things hehe.

I went to the "Ark Encounter" in Kentucky last year '22. The size, it must be seen to fully grasp.

 

[ralliann]

Right. . .my point is not that it is untrue, but that the above, and what I presented, are not actually stated in the OT.
The information stated in the NT is from Jewish tradition, not from the OT.

Well, not to open a can of worms here but not all churches have the same Old Testament. I do not know if the bibles of the historic Church, has the books which mention this from the Jewish scripture, which Judaism rejected as Canon.?

 

[Clare73]

Well, not to open a can of worms here but not all churches have the same Old Testament. I do not know if the bibles of the historic Church, has the books which mention this from the Jewish scripture, which Judaism rejected as Canon.?

Good point. . .the historic Church had:

Prophet Baruch,
Judith,
1 & 2 Machabees
Sirach (Ecclesiasticus)
Tobias
Wisdom.

Did Judaism reject them because of inaccuracy?

 

[Der Alte]

Good point. . .the historic Church had:

Prophet Baruch,
Judith,
1 & 2 Machabees
Sirach (Ecclesiasticus)
Tobias
Wisdom.

Did Judaism reject them because of inaccuracy?

Baruch, Judith, 1-4 Maccabees, Wisdom, Sirach, Tobias, Wisdom, were all included in the 225 BC LXX.

 

[ralliann]

Good point. . .the historic Church had:

Prophet Baruch,
Judith,
1 & 2 Machabees
Sirach (Ecclesiasticus)
Tobias
Wisdom.

Did Judaism reject them because of inaccuracy?

From the wicki page the 2 jew's three opinions as always was present. Who know's when each opinion was prevelent at what time with the sages? In other words at the time of those writings were they considered scripture at that time? And only later, much much later considered traditional opinions? That is a sketchy thing with the codification of scripture after the destruction of temple, and only one sect given authority in the Roman empire to establish what was scripture. The same complaint is made about the legality of Christianity under Constantine.

 

[BeyondET]

I'm thinking the flood was the dumping of the (water of the ) entire firmament, maybe from which we got the oceans which cover 2/3 of the planet, which now evaporate and provide rain which did not exist with the firmament.

Or from the transition zone part of the water cycle as well, though mainly separate from surface water puddle.

 

[Grafted In]

I would still be working on it.
Wasn't Shem still living at the time Abraham was called to God's Holy land?
I can still remember when I first learned that God closed the door of the ark.
Noah and his family were "shut up with God in Christ".
The arc was a shadow of the cross, as baby Moses, when placed in the basket, was as well "shut up with God in Christ". He was placed in the reeds in the river where Hebrew baby boys were murdered.
I really love the types and shadows in the Old Testament.

 

[Bob corrigan]

I do think you are right about the suddenness of the flood. In Matthew 24:37-39 Christ gives the warning, "As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away." But I don't think that is relevant to whether Noah had preached or not, but only, perhaps, relevant to WHAT he preached.

2 Peter 2:5's Greek word, κήρυκα, meaning "a herald" or "a preacher", brings to mind the word, "proclaim", as in 1 Corinthians 11:26. καταγγέλλετε as far as I know is unrelated to the 2 Peter 2:5, κήρυκα. But their meanings are pretty obviously very related. In the principle given in 1 Cor 11:26, doing that certain action is said to be "proclaiming" something. We also know that our lives are a witness to the truth of whatever we represent, whether to the righteousness of God or to the slavery of sin.

To my mind, anyway, Noah's life had apparently been a witness, a testimony, a proclaiming, of righteousness. So I tend toward #3, though I'm not so sure I would use the term, 'metaphor', there.

Notice too, though, his tie to the context of 1 Cor. 11:26, "For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes." that we find 1 Corinthians 15: "3For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 that He was buried, that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,…" which brings to mind 1 Peter 3: "[Christ] was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit19 After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built..." I'm not saying those three passages necessarily refer to each other, but I find a remarkable theme there.

Part of the problem is that people want to put a literal meaning on anything they read in an English translation of Scripture. The Jews had a different way of expressing themselves, often using figures of speech. Peter said believers are "living stones," 1Pet 2:5. Does that mean we are stones that are alive?
Do our minds have loins that can be girded up, 1Pet 1:13? We are to offer ourselves as a living sacrifice, Rom 12:1, we are supposed to physically sacrifice ourselves? Jesus said if thy right eye offends thee, pluck it out, Mat 5:29. Was Jesus being literal? Paul said we were living letters (epistles), 2Cor 3:2-3. Is that what we are, animated letters? Was Jesus a literal vine? Was Jesus literal bread? How does one circumcise the heart, Rom 2:29? What about Psalm 58:10 The righteous shall rejoice when he sees the vengeance (of God) He will wash his feet in the blood of the wicked. Psalm 149:5-7 Let the saints be joyful in glory. Let them sing upon their beds. Let the praises of God be in their mouth and a two-edged sword in their hand, to execute vengeance upon the heathen and to punish the people. Lev 26:19 And I will break the pride of your power and I will make your heaven as iron and your earth as brass. Psalm 10:15 Break the arm of the wicked... There are hundreds of verses that I could show. One of the keys to learning Scripture is to find out what the meaning of the words is on paper rather than just reading the words on paper. What is more important, how the words read or the meaning of the words? By the way, the two main nonbiblical sources for the "tradition" that Noah actually "preached" to the people is the book of Jubilees and Josephus.

 

[brodav9@thicket]

One verse does not establish a fact. One phrase within a verse does not establish anything. Other verses always back up anything that we are to accept as a fact! There is only one exception to this rule. Some verses teach about God's sovereignty and can stand alone, 2Chron 20:6, Psalm 115:3, Psalm 135:6, Ecc 3:19, Dan 4:35, Job 13:13, and Is 14:24. But, the doctrine of God's sovereignty is also shown through many other verses, showing that in Scripture, other verses are always used to establish doctrines, or are found as a part of the Jewish culture and history.
English translations are not accurate word-for-word translations of Scripture. No two English translations are exact duplicates of each other. There are English translations that have added verses not found in any original text and other English translations that have removed words and verses from original texts. And others that have changed the original text. Anything found in the New Testament can always be referenced by the same or similar teaching in the Old.

In English translations, 2Pet 2:5 states that Noah was a "preacher of righteousness." You have to ask yourself, "Why is that said?" Why is that part of the verse, and to what Old Testament passage or example is Peter referring? Nowhere in the Old Testament do we see Noah "preaching" to anybody! In all of Scripture, there is only one example of "preaching righteousness," Psalm 40:9. How many hundreds of years between Noah and the Psalms being written? No other person is called a "preacher of righteousness. This phrase is only found once in English translations. I'll say it again, just because something is said in a translation doesn't mean it is true or found in the original Scripture. "Preaching righteousness" is not a theme or practice in Scripture.
There were no "preachers" in Noah's day. The English word "preacher" isn't used until the book of Ecclesiastes, and even there, the word is an incorrect translation of the Hebrew word qoheleth. The practice of "preaching" is not found in Scripture until we reach the Gospels. Preaching is teaching/proclaiming Scripture. There was no Scripture, God's written word, in the days of Noah.

We don't see Jehovah commanding Noah to "preach" anything. Noah wasn't a prophet foretelling the coming disaster. Let's look at what Scripture says.

Gen 6:5-7 "...And the LORD said I will destroy man...from the face of the earth..."

Pretty simple, Jehovah said He was going to destroy man, all of mankind.

Gen 6:8-9 But Noah found Grace in the eyes of the LORD. Noah was a just man, blameless among the people, and he walked with God.

Gen 6:13 And God told Noah, "The end of all flesh is come before me...behold I will destroy them with the earth."

Gen 6:17 "...And I will bring a flood upon the earth to destroy all flesh...everything in the earth shall die."

Gen 6:18 But with you, Noah, I will establish my covenant. And you, your wife, your sons, and their wives will go into the ark.

When Jehovah gave Noah instructions for building the ark, He didn't mention having extra space for anyone on the earth who would repent and go into the ark. Jehovah was specific about the number of people who would enter the ark. He didn't add, "and anybody who repents." We see three times Jehovah where He stated that He was going to destroy all people on the earth.
From the end of chapter 6, until Noah enters the ark, 100-120 years pass. To build the massive ark, using only hand tools, would have taken long days of constant work. As far as we know, Noah only had his three sons to help him. When would Noah have had any time to walk around the people "preaching righteousness?" Righteousness means to live right and do the right things. How would preaching righteousness have helped people Jehovah clearly stated He was going to destroy? Preaching righteousness does not mean preaching repentance. Preaching righteousness would have nothing to do with warning people about the coming flood. Where do you see Noah spending time preaching? Jehovah had told Noah three times He was going to destroy all people. Why would Noah waste any time on a lost cause? If Noah had "preached repentance," doesn't it make sense that Peter would have said that Noah was a "preacher of repentance?" If the Old Testament showed Noah being a "preacher of righteousness," I wouldn't be doing this study. I base what I study and believe on what I find in Scripture, not a tradition of man, not popular Evangelical teaching.
Let me debunk another lie. Where do we see Noah being mocked by people? We don't see Noah having even one conversation with another person while he built the ark. It would have been impossible to keep other people from being aware of the ark being built due to its size and the time frame. How is it that we don't see any interference with the construction? I have no doubt God kept the wicked, violent people from being able to see the ark. Knowing people, there is no doubt that evil people would have burned up the ark if they had seen it or even killed Noah and his family. In Mat 24:37-39, Jesus said the people on the earth were unaware of the coming flood.

Gen 7:1 Jehovah instructs Noah and his house to enter the ark.

Gen 7:4 Jehovah repeats that He is going to destroy all people in the flood.

Gen 7:16 God shuts the door.

Some may think that the flood was some gradual rising of the water. Gen 7:11 describes a great onslaught of water from the ground and the sky. The amount of water was so great that all of the people and animals on the face of the earth were underwater in minutes, instantly drowned, like a tsunami. There wouldn't have been any time for people to try and climb up on anything to escape the "slowly rising water." The flood caught them completely off guard.

This wasn't the only time Jehovah sent sudden destruction upon people without warning. When He drowned Pharoah's army, Sodom and Gomorrah, and when the walls of Jericho came crashing down. We know that Noah was righteous in Jehovah's eyes, Gen 7:1, Eze 14:14, 20. There are three possible reasons why we find the phrase "a preacher of righteousness" in 2Pet 2:5:

1 At some point, a person making a copy of a Greek text added the phrase. Others then copied the altered copy, and it was accepted as a part of the original text over time. This is what I believe happened. Since there is no reference to a "preacher of righteousness" anywhere in Scripture, it would make sense if Peter had written "a righteous man," which would have referenced the Old Testament.

2 There are a number of extrabiblical writings that state that Noah preached to people. Perhaps Peter was aware of this and decided to include it. But, extrabiblical literature was not included in the Canon for a reason.

3 It's possible that Peter used the phrase as a metaphor for describing how Noah was a preacher of righteousness by how he lived his life.

This reminds me of Hagees book, Jesus is not the Messiah. It is all about the technical use of words. Another one is there is no hell---that is because the Greek word is really Hades. The Greek word for preacher is in Rom. 10:14 Kerusso. it is a herald one who cries out. Noah was crying out God is going to destroy the earth so repent and turn to God . We know that we are in the day that is like Noah's and now Jesus gives hope. Noah gave hope yet many were still proud and wouldn't come.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

One verse does not establish a fact. One phrase within a verse does not establish anything. Other verses always back up anything that we are to accept as a fact! There is only one exception to this rule. Some verses teach about God's sovereignty and can stand alone, 2Chron 20:6, Psalm 115:3, Psalm 135:6, Ecc 3:19, Dan 4:35, Job 13:13, and Is 14:24. But, the doctrine of God's sovereignty is also shown through many other verses, showing that in Scripture, other verses are always used to establish doctrines, or are found as a part of the Jewish culture and history.
English translations are not accurate word-for-word translations of Scripture. No two English translations are exact duplicates of each other. There are English translations that have added verses not found in any original text and other English translations that have removed words and verses from original texts. And others that have changed the original text. Anything found in the New Testament can always be referenced by the same or similar teaching in the Old.

In English translations, 2Pet 2:5 states that Noah was a "preacher of righteousness." You have to ask yourself, "Why is that said?" Why is that part of the verse, and to what Old Testament passage or example is Peter referring? Nowhere in the Old Testament do we see Noah "preaching" to anybody! In all of Scripture, there is only one example of "preaching righteousness," Psalm 40:9. How many hundreds of years between Noah and the Psalms being written? No other person is called a "preacher of righteousness. This phrase is only found once in English translations. I'll say it again, just because something is said in a translation doesn't mean it is true or found in the original Scripture. "Preaching righteousness" is not a theme or practice in Scripture.
There were no "preachers" in Noah's day. The English word "preacher" isn't used until the book of Ecclesiastes, and even there, the word is an incorrect translation of the Hebrew word qoheleth. The practice of "preaching" is not found in Scripture until we reach the Gospels. Preaching is teaching/proclaiming Scripture. There was no Scripture, God's written word, in the days of Noah.

We don't see Jehovah commanding Noah to "preach" anything. Noah wasn't a prophet foretelling the coming disaster. Let's look at what Scripture says.

Gen 6:5-7 "...And the LORD said I will destroy man...from the face of the earth..."

Pretty simple, Jehovah said He was going to destroy man, all of mankind.

Gen 6:8-9 But Noah found Grace in the eyes of the LORD. Noah was a just man, blameless among the people, and he walked with God.

Gen 6:13 And God told Noah, "The end of all flesh is come before me...behold I will destroy them with the earth."

Gen 6:17 "...And I will bring a flood upon the earth to destroy all flesh...everything in the earth shall die."

Gen 6:18 But with you, Noah, I will establish my covenant. And you, your wife, your sons, and their wives will go into the ark.

When Jehovah gave Noah instructions for building the ark, He didn't mention having extra space for anyone on the earth who would repent and go into the ark. Jehovah was specific about the number of people who would enter the ark. He didn't add, "and anybody who repents." We see three times Jehovah where He stated that He was going to destroy all people on the earth.
From the end of chapter 6, until Noah enters the ark, 100-120 years pass. To build the massive ark, using only hand tools, would have taken long days of constant work. As far as we know, Noah only had his three sons to help him. When would Noah have had any time to walk around the people "preaching righteousness?" Righteousness means to live right and do the right things. How would preaching righteousness have helped people Jehovah clearly stated He was going to destroy? Preaching righteousness does not mean preaching repentance. Preaching righteousness would have nothing to do with warning people about the coming flood. Where do you see Noah spending time preaching? Jehovah had told Noah three times He was going to destroy all people. Why would Noah waste any time on a lost cause? If Noah had "preached repentance," doesn't it make sense that Peter would have said that Noah was a "preacher of repentance?" If the Old Testament showed Noah being a "preacher of righteousness," I wouldn't be doing this study. I base what I study and believe on what I find in Scripture, not a tradition of man, not popular Evangelical teaching.
Let me debunk another lie. Where do we see Noah being mocked by people? We don't see Noah having even one conversation with another person while he built the ark. It would have been impossible to keep other people from being aware of the ark being built due to its size and the time frame. How is it that we don't see any interference with the construction? I have no doubt God kept the wicked, violent people from being able to see the ark. Knowing people, there is no doubt that evil people would have burned up the ark if they had seen it or even killed Noah and his family. In Mat 24:37-39, Jesus said the people on the earth were unaware of the coming flood.

Gen 7:1 Jehovah instructs Noah and his house to enter the ark.

Gen 7:4 Jehovah repeats that He is going to destroy all people in the flood.

Gen 7:16 God shuts the door.

Some may think that the flood was some gradual rising of the water. Gen 7:11 describes a great onslaught of water from the ground and the sky. The amount of water was so great that all of the people and animals on the face of the earth were underwater in minutes, instantly drowned, like a tsunami. There wouldn't have been any time for people to try and climb up on anything to escape the "slowly rising water." The flood caught them completely off guard.

This wasn't the only time Jehovah sent sudden destruction upon people without warning. When He drowned Pharoah's army, Sodom and Gomorrah, and when the walls of Jericho came crashing down. We know that Noah was righteous in Jehovah's eyes, Gen 7:1, Eze 14:14, 20. There are three possible reasons why we find the phrase "a preacher of righteousness" in 2Pet 2:5:

1 At some point, a person making a copy of a Greek text added the phrase. Others then copied the altered copy, and it was accepted as a part of the original text over time. This is what I believe happened. Since there is no reference to a "preacher of righteousness" anywhere in Scripture, it would make sense if Peter had written "a righteous man," which would have referenced the Old Testament.

2 There are a number of extrabiblical writings that state that Noah preached to people. Perhaps Peter was aware of this and decided to include it. But, extrabiblical literature was not included in the Canon for a reason.

3 It's possible that Peter used the phrase as a metaphor for describing how Noah was a preacher of righteousness by how he lived his life.

No. It means Noah was a preacher of righteousness. While Scripture often has cross-references, this is not always the case. If you applied this rule to other verses, you would also end up chopping other parts of the Bible out. Once you get into the art of slicing and dicing the Bible, it no longer becomes a Holy Bible but a holey bible (full of holes). We shouldn't tamper with the Word of God by telling others that certain words are not in the Bible. Faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). Man shall not live by bread alone but by EVERY Word of God.

Revelation 22:19 warns:
"And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book."

Do you really want to risk taking away words from the Bible by telling others that certain words in God's Word are not really there?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I went to the "Ark Encounter" in Kentucky last year '22. The size, it must be seen to fully grasp.

I saw the "Ark Encounter" back in 2018. It was impressive.

May it lead people to the Lord.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Part of the problem is that people want to put a literal meaning on anything they read in an English translation of Scripture. The Jews had a different way of expressing themselves, often using figures of speech. Peter said believers are "living stones," 1Pet 2:5. Does that mean we are stones that are alive?
Do our minds have loins that can be girded up, 1Pet 1:13? We are to offer ourselves as a living sacrifice, Rom 12:1, we are supposed to physically sacrifice ourselves? Jesus said if thy right eye offends thee, pluck it out, Mat 5:29. Was Jesus being literal? Paul said we were living letters (epistles), 2Cor 3:2-3. Is that what we are, animated letters? Was Jesus a literal vine? Was Jesus literal bread? How does one circumcise the heart, Rom 2:29? What about Psalm 58:10 The righteous shall rejoice when he sees the vengeance (of God) He will wash his feet in the blood of the wicked. Psalm 149:5-7 Let the saints be joyful in glory. Let them sing upon their beds. Let the praises of God be in their mouth and a two-edged sword in their hand, to execute vengeance upon the heathen and to punish the people. Lev 26:19 And I will break the pride of your power and I will make your heaven as iron and your earth as brass. Psalm 10:15 Break the arm of the wicked... There are hundreds of verses that I could show. One of the keys to learning Scripture is to find out what the meaning of the words is on paper rather than just reading the words on paper. What is more important, how the words read or the meaning of the words? By the way, the two main nonbiblical sources for the "tradition" that Noah actually "preached" to the people is the book of Jubilees and Josephus.

Imagine if you took the non-literal approach when you read books in college. What if you did that if you were following a blueprint for building a house or looking at a design manual for building an aircraft? How would these things work out for you if you took such an approach?

2 Corinthians 3:12-13 says:
"Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech: And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:"

 

[Davy]

The following should quell any doubts of what the Old Testament patriarchs and prophets knew about...

Jude 14-15
14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, "Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of His saints,
15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.
KJV

It is certain that God preserved a specific 'seed' back in the Old Testament that Jesus would be born through, and they were given to prophesy of events even way, way future to their day. Such is a working by The Holy Spirit. So doubting that Noah wasn't able to prophesy also of the flood coming is like an attempt to limit who God calls.

 

[AbbaLove]

Noah wasn't a "preacher." He didn't "preach" to anyone​

Genesis 6:8-9 - But Noah found Grace in the eyes of the LORD. Noah was a just man, blameless among the people, and he walked with God.

And God did not spare the ancient world—except for Noah and the seven others in his family. Noah warned the world of God’s righteous judgment. So God protected Noah when he destroyed the world of ungodly people with a vast flood. (NLT)​

​

if he did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a herald of righteousness, with seven others, when he brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; (ESV)​

You have no proof that Noah didn't warn the ungodly in word and action. Noah an unordained "preacher" didn't stop his exhortation.
Your thread as much jest as your literal interpretation of "preach". We need to give the Endlish translation of 2 Peter 2:5 some grace.