No longer believing in GOD.

[drom]

Hi everyone,

Earlier today my Older brother came to the house and i was watching tv and there was something about stem cells, and i said that it is a good idea that the stem cells should be used if it can help someone.  And almost all of my family freaked out I didn't think it was a big deal since it can help save people's lifes.  But my brother started saying that in GOD's mind its a life.  But i told him that i didn't believe in GOD, and he started trying to talk me into going to church and reading the Bible. 

But it's really hard for me to believe in something that I can't see or no one has ever seen.  I am thinking about be coming Physicist.  And my family thinks its really wrong not to believe in GOD there always saying that i will goto hell and alot of stuff of that nature.  But i think that if there is a GOD, and if you live your life as a good human being and do right, and try to get alone with everyone that you would goto heaven. 

I  have to have facts, There is facts that there was a great flood but there isn't any facts that it was GOD that made it.  I think i know how it happened, if you look at a globe of the planet or any picks of the planet from space.  You will see that there is a big split that goes around the world, and alot of Physicist believe that it was what made the flood, there was a lot of water under the surface of the planet and it was building pressure and one day it couldn't hold the water any longer so it exploded, and it would have been like every Bomb ever made on earth going off, and it would have went into space and fall back to earth, and alot of people and my self believe that is what was the great flood, but back then alof of people would have thought it was GOD's work.

Its just really hard for me to believe that in the Universe we are the only life that excites.  If anyone that has looked in to the night sky and seen the stars then you much feel the same way i do, there is just so many stars and planets around those stars that it would be foolish to think that we are the only people in the Universe. 

I feel now days that if you are any different that any other group of people you are not welcome on this planet.  Everyone i know that believes in GOD says that people that do not believe in GOD are not good people and are crazy for being that way.  But i don't care what people like that say its cause they don't want people thinking any different than them.

I think that you don't have to get saved and goto church to goto heaven.  GOD is suppose to love everyone why would he care if you get saved and goto church he you live your life in a good manner.  Is it just me or do people seem to use the "you will goto hell" to much out of context.  I mean where i live people say you will goto hell if you do anything.  

  

 

I do believe in GOD but i have trouble believing everything the bible says.

 

[Wildfire]

Hi, let me see how I can help you.

If you want to learn about the creation of the heavens and earth, there is a book (several books) that are called the handwriting of God, and they were given to a man named Enoch, who lived before Noahs time. (he was his Great/Grandfather)

The book of Genesis speaks of Enoch, as being a man who "walked with God, who was not; for God took him."

The OT prophets highly respected his writings, right up to the twelve disciples with Jesus Christ, who even spoke of him.

Unfortunately, our "church fathers" feared the writings were too strong, too upsetting, especially regarding the fallen angels of Satan, who defiled themselves with the women of the earth, creating giants (Nephilium).

It is also written in the book of Genesis, (ch 6) that there "were giants in th earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God (or satans angels) came in to the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old (in knowledge and power), men of renown.

And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Therefore the world was destroyed; because the angels who came down to earth and corrupted the seed of man, had shed incredible violence; through flesh eating, and drinking of the blood of men.

This was a horrendous time, when the giants consumned the earth.

Enoch greatly explains this among many other things: such as the seasons, the angels, the portals, the heavens, the tribulation which is yet to come, and how every man has a prepared for a place unto him, because we were with him from the beginning. It is an excellent guide.

Here is a link that I hope will encourage you to want to learn and understand, the truth:

For the books of Enoch were kept hidden for thousands of years; burned, destroyed, and rejected, until a copy was found in a cave in Ethiopia. (200 years ago) And it is available for us /via internet, how fortunate are <we>! to be given this knowledge, when so many have sought for it, and it was not found.

Enjoy.

http://www.bible2000.org/lostbooks/enochs2.htm

Wildfire

 

[Wildfire]

I wanted to add, that at the bottom of the page of that link (secrets of Enoch) click the word HOME; it will take you to the contents page.

The explanation of the flood of Noah/ and the fallen angels is in the (book of Enoch).

Wildfire

 

[zeeshan]

Good Morning,
I hope you are well, drom.
I would like to try to give you the Islamic perspective on some of your concerns.
God (i.e. Allah for the Muslims) has established a system of cause and effect in this universe which functions in perfect harmony (that's where the laws of physics come from) so that it makes perfect sense for there to have been a cause for the great flood (a cause that we can discover and perhaps have discovered in the form of that split that you talked about). This cause and effect relationship does explain how a certain event took place but it doesn't explain why it took place or who did it. Science and scientific facts can explain how events happen but not how they happen or why they happen. We (i.e. Muslims) believe that nobody can see God on this Earth...one can only see His signs and those who sincerely search for the truth can be guided to believe in Him only if He so wills. We believe that God has sent us on this life as a trial and to give us a chance to use our intellect (that He has blessed us with) to find the truth and to accept it and we will be rewarded or punished depending on how we fair in this trial. Ofcourse, a trial would make no sense if we already had facts which proved absolutely that God does exist. As an example, consider a person who points to a boat and says that this boat came about by chance and there was nobody behind its construction. If someone asks how it was made, he says, 'Well, the trees got cut down and chopped into the appropriate pieces of wood required to construct the boat and then these pieces of wood were joined together to form the wooden boat'. This person has explained how the boat was constructed but not why it was constructed or who constructed it. Similarly the causes that leas to an event can explain how that event took place but not why or who did it. There is so much harmony in the Universe (so much so that we can predict exactly where a celestial body will be years in advance) and such complicated systems exist in the Universe (eg. our body) that someone who thinks about it should be able to conclude that there has to be a Creator to all of this. The point is, facts explain how events took place but not why they took place or who was behind them. A bomb goes off because of the explosive material present in them but somebody has to have planted the bomb and that person must have a reason for planting the bomb. Perhaps it is for this reason that over the centuries, there have been great Muslim scholars in many areas of science and they haven't had to worry about whether or not working in certain areas of science is unislamic. There have been astromers, mathematicians, scholars of medicine and so on and more recently even physicists. We believe that participating in such sciences gives us a better understanding of the signs of Allah and that participating in such sciences can be beneficial for humanity which is also good.
About certain people not being welcome, Islam is tolerant of all other religions. This can be seen by the treatment given to non-Muslims in the early centuries of Islam. In alot of cases, the situation was such that non-Muslims preferred to live under the rule of the Muslims simply because of the fair treatment they recieved. (unfortunately, this is not the case anymore in alot of Muslim countries but that is inspite of Islam, not because of it). We believe that all human beings have the right to choose their own way and their own beliefs and not to be profiled or harmed just because their beliefs are different from ours.
You are right, God does love everyone. That is why He has given us a chance to be successful in this life. If He wanted, He might not have given us this chance. In Islam, there is no going to church but to the mosque(and I don't know what you mean by being saved). However, Islam is about submitting oneself to God. Before one can do that, one must believe that there is a God (and that there is only one God) and we have been given many signs to understand this (as I have referred to earlier). Once one believes in God and understands that the Universe and everything that is in it is created by God and is owned by God, then it makes sense to worship Him and to obey Him. So the purpose of going to the mosque is to worship Him. Indeed, if someone doesn't believe in God and goes to the mosque pretending to worship Him, his prayers would be of no benefit to him. We believe that God wants us to worship Him because He is the only one worthy of worship and He has given us a set of guidelines we must follow to be successful. There is wisdom behind every guideline we are to follow and there are benefits for following those guidelines both in this world and the Hereafter. We believe that the best manner to live our life is by doing what Allah tells us to do and refraining from what he commands us to refrain from. It is true that God loves us...but our parents love us, too and they do punish us (or did when we were children) if we do not obey them. So God loves us but He can still punish us if He wills and we do not obey Him.
As far as people saying 'you will go to hell' is concerned, we believe that we should not make authorative statements like that about anyone. The reason is that only our Creator (i.e. Allah) has the authority to decide what to do with us and we have no authority to decide where a person will end up. It may well be that a person who is an atheist right now ends up at a better place than me at the end...Allah knows best.
'I do believe in GOD but i have trouble believing everything the bible says.'
Its the same with me. But I have no trouble believing everything the Holy Quran says because it all makes sense to me (after looking at the context of each of the verses).
Thankyou for taking the time to read this message. Take care

Your brother in humanity,
Zeeshan.

 

[Wildfire]

Zeeshan; there is but one God, who is the Father of all creation; who made all things, whose son was Jesus Christ, who walked with us, here on earth.

Who breathed life into you.

The gods of wood, and stone, and silver and gold are dead; there is nothing living in them. >

that includes Allah, whom you speak of.

Please take no offence to this post; I am here only to help guide you and others to the truth, which lies in the words of Abraham, our Father; and through the disciples who lived and walked with Jesus Christ, the true son of God, and messiah.

What do you have to gain, but eternal life?

Please, take the time to seek the truth; there is love in the book of John, of the holy Bible.

Wildfire

 

[Mid]

hey wildfire, I am about to ask you something that may or may not sound strange. Do you rp online?

 

[Mid]

drom, I believe that the bible is meant as a guide. Moral stories fill it. If you learn from the bible (as with any other religious material of ANY religion), you must read between the lines. Things are not outlined in black and white.

 

[Stormy]

drom: No one has the right to judge another and tell them that they will go to hell. Please do not allow the words of people to alienate you from God.

 

[Wildfire]

Mid; I don't know what that means, (rp online?) but if it involves a type of religion, or bible preaching, the answer would be no; I have only voiced myself here in the discussion forums.

Wildfire

 

[panterapat]

There is no conflict between God and science. The problem with many scientific minds is that they leave God out of the picture and thus thwart their search for truth. As science slowly uncovers the mysteries of the universe, science will move closer to God.
~also~
While there is abundant evidence on earth of God's existance, faith gained its merit because absolute facts and proofs are not needed. Is there merit in believing in gravity? No, because we can directly observe its effects.

There is merit in believing in God because we cannot see God. Jesus told Thomas, "You believe because you have seen. Blessed are they who have not seen yet believe."

Keep searching for God and you will find him. And if you look in the right places you will surely see the effects on God's existnce

In Christ: Patrick

 

[Blessed-one]

Originally posted by panterapat
There is no conflict between God and science. The problem with many scientific minds is that they leave God out of the picture and thus thwart their search for truth. As science slowly uncovers the mysteries of the universe, science will move closer to God.

absolutely! science never ever disproves the existence of God.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

But it's really hard for me to believe in something that I can't see or no one has ever seen.

Actually, many people have seen Jesus Christ. Both when He walked the earth, and throughout the 2,000 years since He died and was raised. These witnesses are beyond reproach and have no reason to lie to us. In addition, millions of Christians, myself included, will tell you straight out that Jesus lives because we have a personal relationship with Him through the Holy Spirit.

I am thinking about be coming Physicist.

Great, thats a noble profession. Science is simply God's laws set up to keep the Universe in an orderly fashion. Many former atheists that study science become believers.

The Universe you mentioned is great evidence of the Lord. Feel free to contact me if you want more info or to just talk, etc.

 

[wildernesse]

drom:

Your account of a global flood is a new one to me--why do you think that the flood happened that way? Where did you get your information? If you would like to talk about physics or the flood, there is another board in this section about Science where you could talk about physics. Or extraterrestrial life or space or planets--you get the picture.

--tibac

 

[zeeshan]

Good Morning,

Zeeshan; there is but one God, who is the Father of all creation; who made all things, whose son was Jesus Christ, who walked with us, here on earth.

Who breathed life into you.

The gods of wood, and stone, and silver and gold are dead; there is nothing living in them. &gt;

that includes Allah, whom you speak of.

Please take no offence to this post; I am here only to help guide you and others to the truth, which lies in the words of Abraham, our Father; and through the disciples who lived and walked with Jesus Christ, the true son of God, and messiah.

What do you have to gain, but eternal life?

Please, take the time to seek the truth; there is love in the book of John, of the holy Bible.

Wildfire

I think this is not the place to post a reply to this so I have posted a reply in the thread 'How can God have a son?'.

Zeeshan.

 

[drom]

Originally posted by wildernesse
drom:

Your account of a global flood is a new one to me--why do you think that the flood happened that way? Where did you get your information? If you would like to talk about physics or the flood, there is another board in this section about Science where you could talk about physics. Or extraterrestrial life or space or planets--you get the picture.

--tibac

There is a lot of places you can read about the split of the earth i was talking about. http://www.ghg.net/hollaway/flood.html&nbsp;is just one.&nbsp; If people want to Believe that a GOD that no one has ever seen, but only is real in a BOOK called the bible, made it flood for 40 days and covered the earth, well first off raining 40 days of hard rain wouldn't flood the earth.&nbsp; lol that is one of the funniest things i have ever heard.&nbsp;

 

[drom]

Originally posted by s0uljah
Actually, many people have seen Jesus Christ. Both when He walked the earth, and throughout the 2,000 years since He died and was raised. These witnesses are beyond reproach and have no reason to lie to us. In addition, millions of Christians, myself included, will tell you straight out that Jesus lives because we have a personal relationship with Him through the Holy Spirit.



Great, thats a noble profession. Science is simply God's laws set up to keep the Universe in an orderly fashion. Many former atheists that study science become believers.

The Universe you mentioned is great evidence of the Lord. Feel free to contact me if you want more info or to just talk, etc.

First off&nbsp;Like i said there is no real proof that GOD is real and that Jesus Christ was able to heal people.&nbsp; People just want to believe that cause a BOOK that is called THE BIBLE says that we are all going to die and goto Heaven and Hell that its the truth.&nbsp; But do you know how CRAZY that sounds. I am not saying you can't believe in whatever you want.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Like i said there is no real proof that GOD is real and that Jesus Christ was able to heal people.

Thats not entirely true. There is evidence that God is real and that He heals people.

 

[drom]

Originally posted by s0uljah
Thats not entirely true. There is evidence that God is real and that He heals people.

&nbsp;

&nbsp;

Well your right there is evidence in the bible, but there isn't and real PROOF that it happened.

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

Well your right there is evidence in the bible, but there isn't and real PROOF that it happened.

Hi there-

There is evidence outside the Bible as well, and even in our modern times. Whether that is "proof" or not, is another question, but I believe there is enough evidence to make the question beyond a reasonable doubt.

 

[drom]

Originally posted by s0uljah
Hi there-

There is evidence outside the Bible as well, and even in our modern times. Whether that is "proof" or not, is another question, but I believe there is enough evidence to make the question beyond a reasonable doubt.

&nbsp;

PROOF IT