new Anti Adventist website

[RC_NewProtestants]

Could someone walk me through what the main differences between progressive SDA and SDA is?

Does progressive (s) accept the Trinity whereas the other does not?

Here is an article which discusses the main areas of difference:
Traditional and Progressive SDA's ...Truth Traditional or Progressive

As for the Trinity there are historic SDA who reject the Trinity in favor of a semi Arian concept. That is not the official church position however. The church holds officially to the trinitarian formula but as you talk to certain Adventists they will often deny the idea central to the Trinity which is that they are all of the same substance. So many will be more in the line of Tri-theists who hold that they are one because of their love for each other. (actually that idea was recently stated to my daughter in her youth class by the teacher). Though admittedly the Trinity is a difficult concept and they likely don't think of themselves as tri-theists.

As for Mary as the Mother of God it is likely the Roman Catholic's way of stressing the importance of Christ as God. But they have a history of Maryology which is rejected by Protestants because it has no Biblical authority.

 

[Pythons]

Not in the sense that you and other Catholics make her out to be. Maternally, from the human standpoint, Mary certainly was Jesus' mother. Yet Jesus existed and lived with the Father long before Mary was born. Mary is not the mother of Christ's nature within the Godhead. That nature existed before Mary.

In much the same way that King David knew Jesus was His Lord and Israels future King, even though Jesus was a "son of David," Mary knew that she was subordinate to Jesus in every aspect, even though she was 'maternally' His mother.

Mary was neither sinless nor without 'original' sin. Mary was used by God because of her great faith and obedience to the Word of God and His instruction and commandment. Just as other sinful mortals have been used by God to fulfill His great plan of redemption to end the great controversy Mary was used by God as well.

Mary has not ascended to Heaven to take part in the co-redemption of man nor is Mary a mediator with her Son between God pleading for the lost souls in purgatory. Mary is asleep in the Lord, awaiting His soon arival to this sin sick world and her resurrection into the newness of everlasting life.

Somehow I thought you were going to say that. If debate were allowed here (I'm under the impression it isn't) I would be honored to sharpen the sword of the Christian faith on some of your statements.

 

[RND]

Somehow I thought you were going to say that. If debate were allowed here (I'm under the impression it isn't) I would be honored to sharpen the sword of the Christian faith on some of your statements.

I have no problem with debate here and being that this is the "progressive" forum I doubt they do either. As for sharpening the sword of the Christian faith regarding some of my statements all I can say is make sure you bring a rather large sharpener!

 

[Pythons]

I'm new here and don't want to step on any toes so if you are certain this is something that will not result in a Mod freaking out then my Citations will be from the R.S.V. Catholic Edition and authorized Catholic materials.

I will start my sword sharpening tomorrow.

 

[RND]

I'm new here and don't want to step on any toes so if you are certain this is something that will not result in a Mod freaking out then my Citations will be from the R.S.V. Catholic Edition and authorized Catholic materials.

Post at your own risk. I never suggested you wouldn't get in trouble. I said I wouldn't have a problem with you posting and that because this is the "progressive" wing of the board I doubted they would either. I'm not the final judge nor arbiter in this matter.

I will start my sword sharpening tomorrow.

Just try keeping your fingers and toes out of the way. Also, don't hold the blade too close to your neck.

 

[Sophia7]

I'm new here and don't want to step on any toes so if you are certain this is something that will not result in a Mod freaking out then my Citations will be from the R.S.V. Catholic Edition and authorized Catholic materials.

I will start my sword sharpening tomorrow.

You are welcome to debate here in the Progressive SDA sub-forum. Everyone is, according to the forum-specific guidelines:

Welcome to the Progressive Seventh-day Adventist Sub-forum. This sub-forum is open to everyone–all Seventh-day Adventists, other Christians, and non-Christians. We invite fellowship, questions, discussion, and respectful debate from anyone on any topic, as long as posters comply with Christian Forums Rules. A Progressive Adventist is defined for CF purposes as an Adventist who does NOT accept the traditional views of all 28 Fundamental Beliefs.

 

[Sophia7]

I thought regular SDA's rejected the Trinity? Several years ago I asked that question to one and based from his (and his wife's answer) I was certain at least they did.

I asked if Mary was the mother of God. They both said "no". They could have been progressive I guess.

This is the official Seventh-day Adventist statement of belief on the Trinity:

2. Trinity:
There is one God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, a unity of three co-eternal Persons. God is immortal, all-powerful, all-knowing, above all, and ever present. He is infinite and beyond human comprehension, yet known through His self-revelation. He is forever worthy of worship, adoration, and service by the whole creation. (Deut. 6:4; Matt. 28:19; 2 Cor. 13:14; Eph. 4:4-6; 1 Peter 1:2; 1 Tim. 1:17; Rev. 14:7.) (http://www.adventist.org/beliefs/fundamental/index.html)
​

However, there are some Adventists who do not believe in the Trinity. I know some extremely traditional Adventists who reject the idea that the Holy Spirit is part of the Godhead. That is not the official SDA position, though.

 

[reddogs]

I personally have yet to come across a Adventist that doesnt believe in the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. Most like to call it the Godhead rather than the Trinity, but other than that, the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are accepted by the mainstream. But as in all church's and movements you will always have the fringes with extreme or personal interpretations......

 

[sentipente]

Mary was neither sinless nor without 'original' sin.

And you know that because?

 

[juneil]

hey, ice. what is EVANGELICAL SDA? Do u recognize the General Conference of SDA?

 

[RND]

And you know that because?

The Bible.

Rom 3:23
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Rom 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Dan 9:11
Yea, all Israel have transgressed thy law, even by departing, that they might not obey thy voice; therefore the curse is poured upon us, and the oath that [is] written in the law of Moses the servant of God, because we have sinned against him.

1 Cor 15:56
The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.

 

[sentipente]

So your argument is based on the reasonable assumption that Mary is a human being and is subject to whatever ALL humans are subject to. That makes sense. Why do you conclude that the writers of the Bible could not have made mistakes in writing as ALL men do? Why do you not accept the Biblical declaration that as ALL men sinned through Adam so ALL men were saved through Christ?

 

[RND]

So your argument is based on the reasonable assumption that Mary is a human being and is subject to whatever ALL humans are subject to. That makes sense.

Why thanks senti.

Why do you conclude that the writers of the Bible could not have made mistakes in writing as ALL men do?

I'm sure they did in some fashion.

Why do you not accept the Biblical declaration that as ALL men sinned through Adam so ALL men were saved through Christ?

Oh, I certainly accept that declaration senti, I can't see where I denied anything as such from my post. But I also realize that there are some men (seemingly most in fact from what the Bible tells me) that DO NOT want to be saved. They do not wish to accept the free gift given to them in the person of Jesus Christ.

 

[sentipente]

Oh, I certainly accept that declaration senti, I can't see where I denied anything as such from my post. But I also realize that there are some men (seemingly most in fact from what the Bible tells me) that DO NOT want to be saved. They do not wish to accept the free gift given to them in the person of Jesus Christ.

Whoa! The gift of God is eternal life. Salvation is not the gift of God. Salvation is the obligation of God. God had no choice but to rescue His people.

 

[RND]

Whoa! The gift of God is eternal life. Salvation is not the gift of God. Salvation is the obligation of God. God had no choice but to rescue His people.

Sure. But some won't accept His gift of salvation. That is obvious in scripture.

Hsa 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

 

[sentipente]

Even though you did not highlight the next phrase it is still a part of the text. They were not rejected as His people. It was their role in the kingdom that changed. No one can take from the Creator what is His.

 

[RND]

Even though you did not highlight the next phrase it is still a part of the text. They were not rejected as His people. It was their role in the kingdom that changed. No one can take from the Creator what is His.

I was merely quoting the verse senti that we, as humans, are the one's to reject God and His word, not the other way around.

I have never suggested that God "rejects" us in anyway. We reject the free gift of salvation offered, thus we "reject knowledge" or as the scripture says that I highlighted, "....because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee..." Romans 1 suggests the same thing.

 

[sentipente]

I have never suggested that God "rejects" us in anyway..

Then you are denying the very text that you quoted. Make up your mind.

 

[RND]

Then you are denying the very text that you quoted. Make up your mind.

Oy vey.

I never suggested that God rejects us first. Happy?

 

[sentipente]

Oy vey.

I never suggested that God rejects us first. Happy?

Sequence was never an issue for me. Leave the tangents alone.