I already posted this in the face the board forum. I am not sure if double-posting is allowed, but I wanted to reach some other parents. I apologise if I've done anything wrong.
My family are facing a life-changing decision, and I am in desperate need of completely neutral advice. This is why I am turning to strangers. This isn't a spiritual matter, although I am turning to God for his guidance. It's going to be a very, very long post, but I will be extremely grateful to those who stick it out to the end. Spiritual advice is, of course, extremely welcome, but I am more looking to hear what, from an outsider's perspective, sounds like the best choice. The decision is whether to move my family to the US or not. The long part is the background.
I am from the UK. My husband is from the US. We met when I was on a study abroad programme, and, although to keep things brief I won't go into 'all that', let's just say that so many tiny things had to line up for us to meet that I have no doubt whatsoever that God was involved. My programme was only a year long, and my visa expired accordingly and I had to return to the UK. He proposed, and we began a long and costly (in financial and emotional terms) visa process to get me back to the US. The goal was for me to go back to the US and finish my degree. I would have to wait for a year to be eligible to go back to school without paying out-of-state tuition, but the plan was for me to work during that time. Instead, we found that we came up against loopholes in the visa process that only served to make our lives more difficult. We ran into a HUGE string of bad luck (I can explain each of these in more detail if anyone wishes, but for now I'll keep them brief). Within the space of 18 months:
- I wasn't able to go back to college
- We were mistaken about my being able to work. Filing for my work permit cost $1070, which took us six months just to save up for. By the time a temporary employment authorisation arrived, I was very heavily pregnant and unable to work.
- My husband is military, and was being paid by the Guard to attend school. He was using this money (and his wage) to support us. He was offered the chance to deploy and left school. The deployment fell through, and he was unable to return to school. His income dropped dramatically, to only $300/month BEFORE taxes. Since I couldn't work, that was our only income.
- In addition to this, we were not eligible for food stamps; unemployment benefit; housing; etc, because one of the conditions of my visa made us both ineligible.
- Recently, he has been contacted by his student loans company. He attended college on a scholarship, but because he did not complete his degree because he was supposed to deploy the loans company now wants over $50,000 from him.
- I became pregnant. Of course, this was NOT bad luck - our daughter is the best thing that ever happened to either of us - but what was bad luck was the timing. We had no health insurance, and were not eligible for free military health insurance. It would have cost us $250/month for insurance, and, remember, our TOTAL income was $300. We could not afford to get me healthcare until my husband was able to go active duty when I was 28 weeks pregnant.
- I fell into a depression over not being able to care for my unborn child.
- While I was 8 weeks pregnant, I racked up nearly $12,000 in medical bills for diagnosing stomach cramps that were never resolved, explained, or treated. We have not been able to pay them. So, between us, we have well over $72,000 in debt.
- We are 21 and 22.
- With a baby on the way, we had to replace my husband's ancient truck for something safe for a child. We traded in the truck and bought a used car from a dealership using a significant car loan. Immediately the car had problems, our insurance would not cover them, and the dealership washed their hands of us. We hadn't even had the car three weeks and we had to pay nearly $500 we couldn't afford on repairs.
- We had a car wreck while I was pregnant. Although it was minor and we were all (baby included) unharmed, the cost of a rental car (which we needed for longer than our insurance company would cover) and the additional cost of putting fuel in it (it was VERY inefficient) set us back another $1000, or close to it.
- My husband's active duty orders ended early. He was given notice, but was forced to find an alternative job. This led to...
- My husband took a job with a magazine company. They did not pay him for a few pay checks, and then, a few months later, they stopped publication of the magazine and everyone lost their jobs. My husband included.
- My husband and I have since applied to more than three hundred jobs between us (now that I have employment authorisation), and have been turned down for every single one.
- Since my daughter was born, I have run up against every challenge to breastfeeding her that is medically possible. I mean that literally. This has worsened my depression, consumed me, and put a strain on my marriage. I have now come to accept that I cannot breastfeed, but five months of obsession has already done its damage to my relationship with my husband.
The best way I can describe how dire our financial situation became, is with this: when our baby was born, we did not have $40 to rent a breast pump that I needed. My husband went without food, because we could not afford to feed him (luckily, my meals were covered). My husband could not pay the $5 parking fee we would have to settle when his car left the parking deck, so he was forced to stay in the hospital with me. We had - and please understand that I mean this literally - pennies to our name, and a newborn baby to bring home. Because of all of these things, after my husband lost his job, we had to move in with my father-in-law and brother-in-law in a two-bedroom trailer with holes in the floor. The dust, dirt and general condition of the place was so horrific that it made my daughter sick, but we had no health insurance (again) and no way of taking her to a doctor.
An amazing opportunity seemed to come up for us in the UK. Again I'll keep it brief, but essentially my parents had the ability and the will to buy a local business for us. We would live on the premises and run it. We agreed to return to the UK. Until we could move in to the business, we would live with my parents. I have always had a strained relationship with them, and we knew it would be tough, but it was supposed to be temporary. Now, the business opportunity has fallen through. We are stuck living with my parents, until I can find a job and we can move out. Essentially, our roles are reversed, as now my husband cannot work.
My husband wants to go back to the US. Neither of us are happy in the UK. My relationship with my parents... That could go on for pages. Let's just say that the way I have been treated all my life resulted in counselling for over a year for an eating disorder, self-harm, and suicidal thoughts. Since I have been back in the UK, the constant criticism I face from my mother and my husband has had me... I would not say 'considering' suicide. I know I will not commit suicide because of my daughter. But all the same, I keep thinking "I can't get anything right. I ruin everything. What is the point in me living?"
My relationship with my in-laws is not much better. They do not make me so unhappy that I think of suicide, no; but their disrespect and ill-treatment of me has me certain that if I had known them when I met my husband, we never would have married. My biggest problem with them is the way that they treat our daughter, their only grandchild/niece. They have no interest in her whatsoever. They do not even call her by her name: they have a nickname for her that we have repeatedly asked them not to use, and they do not have enough respect or love for her or for us that to do so. When she was born they visited in the hospital, and left after spending thirty-eight minutes with her. They did not live close by and knew that it would be a long time before they saw us again, but they left after 38 minutes. They did not ask how she was until she was seven weeks old, and worse? During those 7 weeks, they called us several times to talk about everyday things ("we're having a debate here, what's your opinion on this?"; "I think my dog has mange, what do I do?", etc) and even then, never asked how she was or how we were doing. When we lived with my in-laws it was only for a few weeks, but they never held her, fed her, or kissed her. When we told them that we were leaving for the UK for good (so we thought), they said cool. Again, I could go on for pages, but I won't. On the other hand, my family ADORE our daughter. A few days ago, my 78-year-old grandmother made a two-hour trip involving two bus changes just to take my daughter out for a walk. That was it; the only reason she came all that way. My family 'fight' over who gets to hold her next; who gets to cuddle her next; feed her next; etc. In fact, I'd say my husband and I spent the least amount of time with her out of anyone in the house!
My husband says there is more opportunity for us in the US. It is true that in the US, it is much easier for both of us to obtain our degrees. It is near impossible for us to do that in the UK. He says that he "just needs to go active duty again" and everything will be fine - he will have a nice wage, and we will have free healthcare - but he was not able to 'just go active' before, and I have no faith (in the system, not in God) that he will be able to do it again. He points out all the benefits that the army will give him, such as a retirement fund, a guaranteed job for the length of his contract, the safety of living on a military base. Here in the UK, it is very likely that we would work minimum wage jobs for the rest of our lives. Real estate is so expensive that we may never own a home. We may never be able to build a trust fund for our daughter like (my husband says) we can in the US.
To make things more complicated:
- We have two pets in the US. We have been saving to get them over here, but it will cost thousands, and put them through a lot of stress. They are family, and it is not an option to us to rehome them.
- We bought new furniture weeks before my husband lost his job. It is all sitting in a storage unit in the US, and, again, it will cost thousands to ship it over; but it cost us so much to buy that we can't bear to just leave it. So, if we return to the US, we will be returning to our beloved animals and our brand-new furniture.
- If we went back to the US, we would have to live in that trailer while my husband finished his contract with the National Guard. That means at least a year living in those conditions.
- I cannot separate my emotions from this. I see my daughter with my grandmother, who she is named for, and the thought of separating them makes me want to cry. I see how my daugher clearly adores my father, and how he holds her all day long (I have to ask if I can have her back!) and I think of how her other grandfather doesn't even call her by her name, and I want to cry.
- It is not that I don't trust my husband, but I think he is being overly optimistic about what we could have in the US, and how attainable it is.
- With the long string of bad luck we had in the US, I have no faith in living there anymore (I don't mean faith in God, but faith in us doing well in that country). I see how everything we dreamed of went wrong, and I do not believe anything will ever go right for us there. I now believe it is as simple as which country is it better to be broke in?, and the answer to that is resoundingly the UK.
- I hate that money is so important in this world, but my in-laws are not much better off financially than we are. They will never be in a position to help us, if we need it, as well as my parents can.
- I see the string of bad luck we had as a sign we should stay here in the UK. My husband sees the fact that my green card, which cost us so much money and heartache, arrived days after we left the US, as a sign that we should return.
- We do not have the money to make any mistakes. We cannot afford to go back to the US, realise it was the wrong decision, and come back.
- My other grandmother has Alzheimer's. I have been in the UK for several months but have not had to courage to visit her until last week. She has deteriorated terribly in the time that I have been away, to the point that she is now completely removed from who she used to be. I cannot bear to abandon her now that I know how ill she has become; and, tragically, I do not think she has long left in this world. I do not want to run when she needs me most.
- Our marriage is under great strain. By the time we left the US, I was grateful that finally, I had some security. While I was in the US, I had nothing: my phone, money, transportation, food, the roof over my head, everything, was provided by my husband. If he left me, I would have nowhere to go and no way of getting there, and no way of even calling a friend to help me. We are in the process of working on our marriage, but I am scared to return to that.
I am not just 'undecided'. To me, undecided means being uncertain. I am worse than uncertain: one moment, I am completely certain that we should stay in the UK; the next, I am completely certain that we should return to the US.
Thank you all for listening (reading?), especially if you stuck it out to the end. Regardless of what advice I receive, I feel like there is a weight lifted from my shoulders just being able to get it all out in the open. Any advice whatsoever is welcome. This is the hardest decision I have ever had to make.
Thank you again, and God bless.
My family are facing a life-changing decision, and I am in desperate need of completely neutral advice. This is why I am turning to strangers. This isn't a spiritual matter, although I am turning to God for his guidance. It's going to be a very, very long post, but I will be extremely grateful to those who stick it out to the end. Spiritual advice is, of course, extremely welcome, but I am more looking to hear what, from an outsider's perspective, sounds like the best choice. The decision is whether to move my family to the US or not. The long part is the background.
I am from the UK. My husband is from the US. We met when I was on a study abroad programme, and, although to keep things brief I won't go into 'all that', let's just say that so many tiny things had to line up for us to meet that I have no doubt whatsoever that God was involved. My programme was only a year long, and my visa expired accordingly and I had to return to the UK. He proposed, and we began a long and costly (in financial and emotional terms) visa process to get me back to the US. The goal was for me to go back to the US and finish my degree. I would have to wait for a year to be eligible to go back to school without paying out-of-state tuition, but the plan was for me to work during that time. Instead, we found that we came up against loopholes in the visa process that only served to make our lives more difficult. We ran into a HUGE string of bad luck (I can explain each of these in more detail if anyone wishes, but for now I'll keep them brief). Within the space of 18 months:
- I wasn't able to go back to college
- We were mistaken about my being able to work. Filing for my work permit cost $1070, which took us six months just to save up for. By the time a temporary employment authorisation arrived, I was very heavily pregnant and unable to work.
- My husband is military, and was being paid by the Guard to attend school. He was using this money (and his wage) to support us. He was offered the chance to deploy and left school. The deployment fell through, and he was unable to return to school. His income dropped dramatically, to only $300/month BEFORE taxes. Since I couldn't work, that was our only income.
- In addition to this, we were not eligible for food stamps; unemployment benefit; housing; etc, because one of the conditions of my visa made us both ineligible.
- Recently, he has been contacted by his student loans company. He attended college on a scholarship, but because he did not complete his degree because he was supposed to deploy the loans company now wants over $50,000 from him.
- I became pregnant. Of course, this was NOT bad luck - our daughter is the best thing that ever happened to either of us - but what was bad luck was the timing. We had no health insurance, and were not eligible for free military health insurance. It would have cost us $250/month for insurance, and, remember, our TOTAL income was $300. We could not afford to get me healthcare until my husband was able to go active duty when I was 28 weeks pregnant.
- I fell into a depression over not being able to care for my unborn child.
- While I was 8 weeks pregnant, I racked up nearly $12,000 in medical bills for diagnosing stomach cramps that were never resolved, explained, or treated. We have not been able to pay them. So, between us, we have well over $72,000 in debt.
- We are 21 and 22.
- With a baby on the way, we had to replace my husband's ancient truck for something safe for a child. We traded in the truck and bought a used car from a dealership using a significant car loan. Immediately the car had problems, our insurance would not cover them, and the dealership washed their hands of us. We hadn't even had the car three weeks and we had to pay nearly $500 we couldn't afford on repairs.
- We had a car wreck while I was pregnant. Although it was minor and we were all (baby included) unharmed, the cost of a rental car (which we needed for longer than our insurance company would cover) and the additional cost of putting fuel in it (it was VERY inefficient) set us back another $1000, or close to it.
- My husband's active duty orders ended early. He was given notice, but was forced to find an alternative job. This led to...
- My husband took a job with a magazine company. They did not pay him for a few pay checks, and then, a few months later, they stopped publication of the magazine and everyone lost their jobs. My husband included.
- My husband and I have since applied to more than three hundred jobs between us (now that I have employment authorisation), and have been turned down for every single one.
- Since my daughter was born, I have run up against every challenge to breastfeeding her that is medically possible. I mean that literally. This has worsened my depression, consumed me, and put a strain on my marriage. I have now come to accept that I cannot breastfeed, but five months of obsession has already done its damage to my relationship with my husband.
The best way I can describe how dire our financial situation became, is with this: when our baby was born, we did not have $40 to rent a breast pump that I needed. My husband went without food, because we could not afford to feed him (luckily, my meals were covered). My husband could not pay the $5 parking fee we would have to settle when his car left the parking deck, so he was forced to stay in the hospital with me. We had - and please understand that I mean this literally - pennies to our name, and a newborn baby to bring home. Because of all of these things, after my husband lost his job, we had to move in with my father-in-law and brother-in-law in a two-bedroom trailer with holes in the floor. The dust, dirt and general condition of the place was so horrific that it made my daughter sick, but we had no health insurance (again) and no way of taking her to a doctor.
An amazing opportunity seemed to come up for us in the UK. Again I'll keep it brief, but essentially my parents had the ability and the will to buy a local business for us. We would live on the premises and run it. We agreed to return to the UK. Until we could move in to the business, we would live with my parents. I have always had a strained relationship with them, and we knew it would be tough, but it was supposed to be temporary. Now, the business opportunity has fallen through. We are stuck living with my parents, until I can find a job and we can move out. Essentially, our roles are reversed, as now my husband cannot work.
My husband wants to go back to the US. Neither of us are happy in the UK. My relationship with my parents... That could go on for pages. Let's just say that the way I have been treated all my life resulted in counselling for over a year for an eating disorder, self-harm, and suicidal thoughts. Since I have been back in the UK, the constant criticism I face from my mother and my husband has had me... I would not say 'considering' suicide. I know I will not commit suicide because of my daughter. But all the same, I keep thinking "I can't get anything right. I ruin everything. What is the point in me living?"
My relationship with my in-laws is not much better. They do not make me so unhappy that I think of suicide, no; but their disrespect and ill-treatment of me has me certain that if I had known them when I met my husband, we never would have married. My biggest problem with them is the way that they treat our daughter, their only grandchild/niece. They have no interest in her whatsoever. They do not even call her by her name: they have a nickname for her that we have repeatedly asked them not to use, and they do not have enough respect or love for her or for us that to do so. When she was born they visited in the hospital, and left after spending thirty-eight minutes with her. They did not live close by and knew that it would be a long time before they saw us again, but they left after 38 minutes. They did not ask how she was until she was seven weeks old, and worse? During those 7 weeks, they called us several times to talk about everyday things ("we're having a debate here, what's your opinion on this?"; "I think my dog has mange, what do I do?", etc) and even then, never asked how she was or how we were doing. When we lived with my in-laws it was only for a few weeks, but they never held her, fed her, or kissed her. When we told them that we were leaving for the UK for good (so we thought), they said cool. Again, I could go on for pages, but I won't. On the other hand, my family ADORE our daughter. A few days ago, my 78-year-old grandmother made a two-hour trip involving two bus changes just to take my daughter out for a walk. That was it; the only reason she came all that way. My family 'fight' over who gets to hold her next; who gets to cuddle her next; feed her next; etc. In fact, I'd say my husband and I spent the least amount of time with her out of anyone in the house!
My husband says there is more opportunity for us in the US. It is true that in the US, it is much easier for both of us to obtain our degrees. It is near impossible for us to do that in the UK. He says that he "just needs to go active duty again" and everything will be fine - he will have a nice wage, and we will have free healthcare - but he was not able to 'just go active' before, and I have no faith (in the system, not in God) that he will be able to do it again. He points out all the benefits that the army will give him, such as a retirement fund, a guaranteed job for the length of his contract, the safety of living on a military base. Here in the UK, it is very likely that we would work minimum wage jobs for the rest of our lives. Real estate is so expensive that we may never own a home. We may never be able to build a trust fund for our daughter like (my husband says) we can in the US.
To make things more complicated:
- We have two pets in the US. We have been saving to get them over here, but it will cost thousands, and put them through a lot of stress. They are family, and it is not an option to us to rehome them.
- We bought new furniture weeks before my husband lost his job. It is all sitting in a storage unit in the US, and, again, it will cost thousands to ship it over; but it cost us so much to buy that we can't bear to just leave it. So, if we return to the US, we will be returning to our beloved animals and our brand-new furniture.
- If we went back to the US, we would have to live in that trailer while my husband finished his contract with the National Guard. That means at least a year living in those conditions.
- I cannot separate my emotions from this. I see my daughter with my grandmother, who she is named for, and the thought of separating them makes me want to cry. I see how my daugher clearly adores my father, and how he holds her all day long (I have to ask if I can have her back!) and I think of how her other grandfather doesn't even call her by her name, and I want to cry.
- It is not that I don't trust my husband, but I think he is being overly optimistic about what we could have in the US, and how attainable it is.
- With the long string of bad luck we had in the US, I have no faith in living there anymore (I don't mean faith in God, but faith in us doing well in that country). I see how everything we dreamed of went wrong, and I do not believe anything will ever go right for us there. I now believe it is as simple as which country is it better to be broke in?, and the answer to that is resoundingly the UK.
- I hate that money is so important in this world, but my in-laws are not much better off financially than we are. They will never be in a position to help us, if we need it, as well as my parents can.
- I see the string of bad luck we had as a sign we should stay here in the UK. My husband sees the fact that my green card, which cost us so much money and heartache, arrived days after we left the US, as a sign that we should return.
- We do not have the money to make any mistakes. We cannot afford to go back to the US, realise it was the wrong decision, and come back.
- My other grandmother has Alzheimer's. I have been in the UK for several months but have not had to courage to visit her until last week. She has deteriorated terribly in the time that I have been away, to the point that she is now completely removed from who she used to be. I cannot bear to abandon her now that I know how ill she has become; and, tragically, I do not think she has long left in this world. I do not want to run when she needs me most.
- Our marriage is under great strain. By the time we left the US, I was grateful that finally, I had some security. While I was in the US, I had nothing: my phone, money, transportation, food, the roof over my head, everything, was provided by my husband. If he left me, I would have nowhere to go and no way of getting there, and no way of even calling a friend to help me. We are in the process of working on our marriage, but I am scared to return to that.
I am not just 'undecided'. To me, undecided means being uncertain. I am worse than uncertain: one moment, I am completely certain that we should stay in the UK; the next, I am completely certain that we should return to the US.
Thank you all for listening (reading?), especially if you stuck it out to the end. Regardless of what advice I receive, I feel like there is a weight lifted from my shoulders just being able to get it all out in the open. Any advice whatsoever is welcome. This is the hardest decision I have ever had to make.
Thank you again, and God bless.
