I just got into a debate with someone today, and she asked "where is your proof?" and i said "My proof is based on the perfect Word of God -- The bible" and she said something about someone who rewrote the Gospels or something, to "Demonize paganism and to make Jesus out to be divine" and that the bible is not true. and is not reckognized by most historians as true. I have never heard this before. is it true? i need help, im getting together with her soon to debate again. i need help. could someone direct me to a thread about proving that the bible is, indeed fact not fiction? that would be awesome, or please feel free to post here about it. thank you all!
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NEED HELP DESPERATLY
- Thread starter proudwitness
- Start date
Why should you defend against her accusations unless she has presented clear and convincing proof that what she claims is so . .
It is like shooting in the dark until you have the 'facts' she is basing this on . .
I would require her to prove her point . . then you have specifics to work with . .
Who rewrote what, when?
What are her sources? What are their qualifications? Then do some research on these sources . . .
It you woud like to come to OBOB (One Bread One Body forum) and ask questions about the history of the bible, etc . . you will find several who are very knowledgable about the Early Church History and can be of great help to you . . .
Peace in Him!
Peace in Him!
It is like shooting in the dark until you have the 'facts' she is basing this on . .
I would require her to prove her point . . then you have specifics to work with . .
Who rewrote what, when?
What are her sources? What are their qualifications? Then do some research on these sources . . .
It you woud like to come to OBOB (One Bread One Body forum) and ask questions about the history of the bible, etc . . you will find several who are very knowledgable about the Early Church History and can be of great help to you . . .
Peace in Him!
Peace in Him!
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ShetlandRose
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"thereselittleflower" has given you an excellent answer.
I'll just add that there is overwhelming proof that the New Testament was written, as its writers claim, by contemporaries of Jesus. There is even proof from the records of Christianity's enemies and in quotations in other writings from the late first to early second century. The fallacious charge that the New Testament is not reliable because it was written centuries after the time of Jesus Christ by people who weren't even alive at Christ's time is laughable. Of course you know in your heart as a Christian, for the Holy Spirit is your witness, that the Bible is the true and inspired Word of God Himself; but to engage in debate takes groundwork and preparation. No one likes to be wrong, so often debate with an unbeliever is futile.
ShetlandRose
I'll just add that there is overwhelming proof that the New Testament was written, as its writers claim, by contemporaries of Jesus. There is even proof from the records of Christianity's enemies and in quotations in other writings from the late first to early second century. The fallacious charge that the New Testament is not reliable because it was written centuries after the time of Jesus Christ by people who weren't even alive at Christ's time is laughable. Of course you know in your heart as a Christian, for the Holy Spirit is your witness, that the Bible is the true and inspired Word of God Himself; but to engage in debate takes groundwork and preparation. No one likes to be wrong, so often debate with an unbeliever is futile.
ShetlandRose
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William Nunn
Babies enjoy living too!
If she can't believe that the Bible is true, how can she believe anything else she's ever read was true? Including wherever she read that the Bible was re-written to deominze pagasnism. Unless of course, she was there to witness in person every event she's ever read about.
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Hi dear friend...
Here is some information for you...I hope it helps you with the debate..
The Bible:
The Bible is not in fact a single book at all, but rather a collection of 66 books. The first three quarters of the Bible was written well before Jesus time, and we call these books the Old Testament. But even within the Old Testament there is huge variety of genre. There are books of history, books of laws, books of prophecies, books about kings, books about ordinary people, books of songs, even an extended love poem. Some of these genres were mentioned by Jesus in our Bible reading. In the New Testament, the books written after the birth of Jesus, we find records of the life and teachings of Jesus, one book recording the activities of the early church, a number of letters, and one book of apocalyptic writings that is, writings about the end of the world. Much of this is probably unfamiliar to many of us, and in fact given that these books were written by very different people in very different styles separated my many years and many miles, it is astonishing that there is any agreement between them at all. Yet the Bible holds together as a unity, and the theme that holds them all together is Jesus. The Bible is all ultimately about him.
The Bible is the most phenomenally powerful book. It has changed the lives of many people. I believe the Bible is the best gift God has ever given to man. The word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
As we read the Bible, God speaks to us about our lives, about his will, about his purpose for us. Most of all he speaks to us about his love for us, and his strong desire that we should know him better than we do.
You may know the Old Testament story of the destruction of the two cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. For many years it has been thought that these cities didnt exist, therefore the stories about them could not be true. However, excavations at the site of Ebla uncovered about 15,000 ancient stone tablets, on which Sodom and Gomorrah are mentioned.
Yet the Bible is a unit. From beginning to end there is just one story, of Gods plan to bring the human race back to himself. This story reaches its climax in the life and death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Jesus himself taught that he was the central theme of the whole Bible.
The final piece of evidence for the Bible is the experience of many people down the ages.
I want you to imagine that you buy a second hand car, quite an old car, now out of production. It comes without the users manual, and although you manage to drive it and do most of the important things you need to do, there are some knobs and switches which continue to mystify you. You cannot work out what they do. One day, rummaging in a junk shop, you are amazed to come across what appears to be a users manual to the very same model of car. You buy it and take it home, very excited. But how do you know this manual is accurate, trustworthy? Thats easy. You look up what it says about all the switches that you cant quite fathom, and you try what it tells you to do. When you see the switches produce the results that the book says they should produce, you know the book is to be trusted.
Many people have become Christians, and perhaps a little warily, begin to trust this book. They have begun to act upon it, as if it were true. And then, to their amazement, they have found that it works. Life does work if we do what it says in this book. If we come to God through Jesus, as this book tells us to, we find that we do indeed encounter God. When we pray as this book teaches us, we find that our prayers come to life, and that they are often answered. It works. You can put it to the test and see for yourself.
***************************************
The Bible is inspired, and inspired is a word that means "God-breathed." The spirit of God was literally breathed into those early writers, and that same spirit can be breathed into us as we read and strive to understand.
"Is the Bible Fact or Fiction?"
What does matter is that it is a collection of stories about faith, and those stories contain truth for us. They tell us the truth about how God loves us and never deserts us. They tell us about how hard it is to live faithfully and lovingly. They give us clues to the secrets that can make our lives worthwhile.
If a belief makes someone act angry, stern, self-righteous, and judgmental, what kind of faith is that? These attitudes prevail among people who refuse to look at the Bible in any critical way.
We don't believe in God because the Bible tells us to; we believe in God because we feel God in our heart. The Bible helps us to understand God; it helps us to learn about ourselves, and it challenges us.
We know the overall message of his ministry is that we need to love God above all other things, and treat each other just as we would want to be treated.
Prayer:
Divine Author, there are so many grounds for skepticism about the Bible; so many who claim that it is merely a flawed, human document. Open our eyes so that we may look beyond the doubt and debate that surrounds the Bible and see your divine presence within its pages. Give us a broader view your Providence, and show us how your hand was at work guiding the centuries-long process of crafting a document through many authors and editors into a single, unified story that tells of your personal relationship with humankind and with every person who turns to you. Amen.
God Bless
Here is some information for you...I hope it helps you with the debate..
The Bible:
The Bible is not in fact a single book at all, but rather a collection of 66 books. The first three quarters of the Bible was written well before Jesus time, and we call these books the Old Testament. But even within the Old Testament there is huge variety of genre. There are books of history, books of laws, books of prophecies, books about kings, books about ordinary people, books of songs, even an extended love poem. Some of these genres were mentioned by Jesus in our Bible reading. In the New Testament, the books written after the birth of Jesus, we find records of the life and teachings of Jesus, one book recording the activities of the early church, a number of letters, and one book of apocalyptic writings that is, writings about the end of the world. Much of this is probably unfamiliar to many of us, and in fact given that these books were written by very different people in very different styles separated my many years and many miles, it is astonishing that there is any agreement between them at all. Yet the Bible holds together as a unity, and the theme that holds them all together is Jesus. The Bible is all ultimately about him.
The Bible is the most phenomenally powerful book. It has changed the lives of many people. I believe the Bible is the best gift God has ever given to man. The word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
As we read the Bible, God speaks to us about our lives, about his will, about his purpose for us. Most of all he speaks to us about his love for us, and his strong desire that we should know him better than we do.
You may know the Old Testament story of the destruction of the two cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. For many years it has been thought that these cities didnt exist, therefore the stories about them could not be true. However, excavations at the site of Ebla uncovered about 15,000 ancient stone tablets, on which Sodom and Gomorrah are mentioned.
Yet the Bible is a unit. From beginning to end there is just one story, of Gods plan to bring the human race back to himself. This story reaches its climax in the life and death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Jesus himself taught that he was the central theme of the whole Bible.
The final piece of evidence for the Bible is the experience of many people down the ages.
I want you to imagine that you buy a second hand car, quite an old car, now out of production. It comes without the users manual, and although you manage to drive it and do most of the important things you need to do, there are some knobs and switches which continue to mystify you. You cannot work out what they do. One day, rummaging in a junk shop, you are amazed to come across what appears to be a users manual to the very same model of car. You buy it and take it home, very excited. But how do you know this manual is accurate, trustworthy? Thats easy. You look up what it says about all the switches that you cant quite fathom, and you try what it tells you to do. When you see the switches produce the results that the book says they should produce, you know the book is to be trusted.
Many people have become Christians, and perhaps a little warily, begin to trust this book. They have begun to act upon it, as if it were true. And then, to their amazement, they have found that it works. Life does work if we do what it says in this book. If we come to God through Jesus, as this book tells us to, we find that we do indeed encounter God. When we pray as this book teaches us, we find that our prayers come to life, and that they are often answered. It works. You can put it to the test and see for yourself.
***************************************
The Bible is inspired, and inspired is a word that means "God-breathed." The spirit of God was literally breathed into those early writers, and that same spirit can be breathed into us as we read and strive to understand.
"Is the Bible Fact or Fiction?"
What does matter is that it is a collection of stories about faith, and those stories contain truth for us. They tell us the truth about how God loves us and never deserts us. They tell us about how hard it is to live faithfully and lovingly. They give us clues to the secrets that can make our lives worthwhile.
If a belief makes someone act angry, stern, self-righteous, and judgmental, what kind of faith is that? These attitudes prevail among people who refuse to look at the Bible in any critical way.
We don't believe in God because the Bible tells us to; we believe in God because we feel God in our heart. The Bible helps us to understand God; it helps us to learn about ourselves, and it challenges us.
We know the overall message of his ministry is that we need to love God above all other things, and treat each other just as we would want to be treated.
Prayer:
Divine Author, there are so many grounds for skepticism about the Bible; so many who claim that it is merely a flawed, human document. Open our eyes so that we may look beyond the doubt and debate that surrounds the Bible and see your divine presence within its pages. Give us a broader view your Providence, and show us how your hand was at work guiding the centuries-long process of crafting a document through many authors and editors into a single, unified story that tells of your personal relationship with humankind and with every person who turns to you. Amen.
God Bless
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Hi proudwitnessproudwitness said:
Yes, it is on this site . .
In the main heading Congregations . . it is the second one down in that heading .
http://www.christianforums.com/f26
Everyone there would be more than happy to help you!
Hope to see you there!
Peace in Him!
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Titus 3:9,10
But avoid foolish disputes, geneoligies, contentions, and strivings about the law: for they are unprofitable and usless. Warn a divisive person once, then a second time, knowing that such a person is warped and sinful, selfcondemned
But avoid foolish disputes, geneoligies, contentions, and strivings about the law: for they are unprofitable and usless. Warn a divisive person once, then a second time, knowing that such a person is warped and sinful, selfcondemned
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HesMyAll
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The Bible says that in the last days people would be deceived and being deceived. I would simply give her the Word of God but I wouldn't get into a senseless debate about it with her. There are honest hearted doubters and dis-honest hearted doubters. If she is honest hearted, she will be willing to listen, if not, she will only try to make you doubt also.
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Mrs. Enigma
Transformers was awesome!!!!
Lee Strobel has 2 books The Case For Faith and the CAse For Christ. They are interesting, and you may want to look for them on ebay. Also check out Answers in Genesis or some other Christian website dealing with the inspiration, canonization, or other Biblical proofs. Just do a search for stuff like that. I am sure there is tons out there. People that do not like certain parts of the Bible like to say stuff like that it is messed up etc. but that is not true.
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Pastor_Benjamin
Anoited & Apointed
"When people are ignorant to you be intelligent when you put them in check because when you are ignorant you get treated that way."
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