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Need Advice...Visitation ??? What Do I Do?

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catlover

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My children age and 11 and 14 went for their weekend visit with their dad two weeks in a row. He terrorized them....told my daughter 11 he wanted to go in the other room load his gun, put it in his mouth, and pull the trigger.

My divorce is written up where my children reside with me, and "reasonable" visitation will be granted if agreed upon by both parents.

The crux is, should I completely put him their dad out of their lives?He's been horrid and abusive...what do I do?
 

hanaya

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If he can't act appropriately with them, then he can't be with them. It's that simple. Children should not have to suffer any sort of trauma just because that person is their parent.
If and when he is able to come to terms with his own issues and act appropriately, then he can have contact with the children.
That's my opinion, anyway.
 
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FaithfulWife

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Whenever one parent decides to just "put the other parent out of the kids' lives" that's often more the parent's thinking than the kids' thinking. No matter what he does or how he's been, never EVER forget that he is your children's FATHER and they are partly him. When you degrade HIM, you degrade THEM.

That being said, there are times when, for safety and protection, it is reasonable to delay visitation or seek to end it for a while. I mean, even if he is their father you don't want your children to be where there are loaded weapons or a mentally unstable person. And catlover, we are talking about COURT here. Court is not about "what's right and wrong" but what you can prove. Please try to remove from your head "it's not right that he should threaten the kids with suicide" because IT"S NOT RIGHT but no court will stop visitation because the other parent is "doing wrong." So start to look at it from the "evidence" point of view and what you can prove.

Along those lines--the EVIDENCE--I would suggest that you speak to your attorney and get legal advice, speak to a counselor who specializes in abuse and get their advice (like someone who works with abused women?), speak to a law enforcement person and get their advice, and get all this advice in writing. In their professional opinion how serious is this threat and what damage might it do to the children? What are some "danger signs" to look for and symptoms of trauma? How many of those do your children already show? See how you're building a case with EVIDENCE? The goal would be to have a way of saying to a judge or even to your attorney, "I spoke with Sgt. A and he says having loaded weapons in the home of a depressed person presents XXX danger. I spoke with the DA and she said XXX. I spoke with Ms. B, MSW who specializes in verbal abuse, and she said the danger could be XXX. And I spoke with the kids' counselor and he said, XXX" This shows EVIDENCE that it's not just you being a vindictive ex-spouse.

Next, on your own keep a calendar like a binder, and every time he mentions suicide write it on your calendar. Every time he does something you consider scary to the kids write it on the calendar. Do this for a bit and you'll start to see a) documentation and b) a fairly scary/predictable pattern. A calendar is admissible evidence because it's not "Well your honor he said stuff that scared our kids all the time"--it's "On Oct. 4th he loaded a gun, locked the door, and told the kids he was killing himself. They could not get in, freaked out, called me, and I called the police. We can get the police report" "On Oct. 5th he acted like nothing happened the day before and yelled at the kids all day until they came home hysterical" "On Oct. 8th the kids returned home from their visit with no shoes, no socks and no coats."

Finally and in conclusion, I do once again request that you REALLY consider whether you are doing this for your own reasons or to actually protect your children. It is NOT a small thing to consider disallowing visitation and the best example I can think of is this: what if he did the same thing to you? He is a parent. He has the same biological right to the children as you do. I go to that drastic point so that I can really get you to think of the seriousness of what you're suggesting. If you can say, in good conscience, "If I were doing to the kids what he's doing to the kids now, I would hope that he WOULD take them away from me for their protection" then I would say it may be warranted. If you can not, then please do not take away visitation because of what is between you and their dad. Okay?

And I would like to point out something REALLY clearly. In your instance it sounds like you are the more responsible parent and he is the more abusive parent, but that is not always the case. Sometimes the hubby/guy is the responsible parent and the wife/lady is the one who's abusive and irresponsible and freaking every out!

:hug: Hope this helps ya!


~Faithful
 
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catlover

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I doubt he will acknowledge his behavior...hanaya...


Faithfulwife, my kids left last weekend happy children, they came back to me unhappy, depressed, and extremely anxious children.

I think it is probablly in their best interest to cease contact with him`thankfully my attorney knew exactlfy how to write up the papers...reasonable visitation if agreed upon by the two parents.



He won't act appropriately and the contact he has with them is nothing but mental and physical abuse.

They are 11 and 14 and can decide if they want to see their father. My daughter does not care if she sees him again. my son is disgusted with him as well.
 
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DZoolander

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Like the above posters - I'm all for being respectful of your past mate and acknowledging their desire to be a part of the children's lives (and helping facilitate that).

But - I'm sorry - if the parent is threatening suicide in front of the child out of depression (or some sick attempt at manipulation) - then that crosses all boundaries. Children should not be exposed to that type of nonsense - and it's the reasonable parent's job to shelter them from that type of psychological abuse.

I would definitely speak to your divorce attorney and law enforcement to see what can be done to get sole custody while psychological treatment is given to the father.

A friend of mine's ex-wife attempted suicide once while she had custody of their son. He immediately got full custody while she was sent to a halfway house to get worked on. I think that was perfectly reasonable.
 
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dayknee

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Oh Wow, I would not send my kids back until he recieved some sort of help for his emotions. The kids are going thru enough, they certainly do not need this added onto their plate.
I hope your attorney can change the divorce papers or at least allow for supervised visits..This way there is someone who has to be there with him while he is with the children and you might feel a bit better about that..and the kids wont be taken away from him entirely. I would also stipulate the he HAS to do some type of counseling for his issues and the in order to regain any type of one on one custody he would have to show proof of that he has been in counseling for a certain period of itme.
Im sorry you are going through this.
I'll be praying for you and your children
 
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C

catlover

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Like the above posters - I'm all for being respectful of your past mate and acknowledging their desire to be a part of the children's lives (and helping facilitate that).

But - I'm sorry - if the parent is threatening suicide in front of the child out of depression (or some sick attempt at manipulation) - then that crosses all boundaries. Children should not be exposed to that type of nonsense - and it's the reasonable parent's job to shelter them from that type of psychological abuse.

I would definitely speak to your divorce attorney and law enforcement to see what can be done to get sole custody while psychological treatment is given to the father.

A friend of mine's ex-wife attempted suicide once while she had custody of their son. He immediately got full custody while she was sent to a halfway house to get worked on. I think that was perfectly reasonable.

He said it to manipulate and terrorize the children...he's too much of a Narcissist to do such an action...

In the past I made elaborate excuses for him, now it's simple, he's a bullying abuser...
 
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C

catlover

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Oh Wow, I would not send my kids back until he recieved some sort of help for his emotions. The kids are going thru enough, they certainly do not need this added onto their plate.
I hope your attorney can change the divorce papers or at least allow for supervised visits..This way there is someone who has to be there with him while he is with the children and you might feel a bit better about that..and the kids wont be taken away from him entirely. I would also stipulate the he HAS to do some type of counseling for his issues and the in order to regain any type of one on one custody he would have to show proof of that he has been in counseling for a certain period of itme.
Im sorry you are going through this.
I'll be praying for you and your children

Thank you for the prayers...the attorney is getting a call on Tuesday. The wait was to ensure nothing is done out of anger...
 
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