Name above every Name - in Heaven and on earth...

[Carl Emerson]

What sort of danger?

The Scripture is a gift to mankind and is the most essential means of weighing truth that His Spirit uses. Sure the words have no truth in themselves but He has chosen to use them to bring inspiration, conviction and even judgement.

 

[Carl Emerson]

My post was on "the name above every name" part.

Yeshua, aka Jesus, is just an Aramaic version of Joshua. Yes his name has significance as his role Messiah, but not as much as what your giving it. He was not the first person with this name in Israel!

Yes... But He was the only person that the Father gave His own Name.

The significance I am giving it is backed by Scripture.

 

[Jonaitis]

The Scripture is a gift to mankind and is the most essential means of weighing truth that His Spirit uses. Sure the words have no truth in themselves but He has chosen to use them to bring inspiration, conviction and even judgement.

You mean the current canon that Protestants accept? Or would you go far enough to accept many books over the course of history that was considered divinely inspired, such as Shepherd of Hermas? What convinces you that there is only sixty-six books that are Scripture, and not more or less?

 

[Carl Emerson]

You mean the current canon that Protestants accept? Or would you go far enough to accept many books over the course of history that was considered divinely inspired, such as Shepherd of Hermas? What convinces you that there is only sixty-six books that are Scripture, and not more or less?

This thread is not about the Canon.

No quotes I have made are in question by mainstream church.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

@Carl Emerson yeah your going too far with this point Carl, and I side with the Messianics in the OP. The other so called Divine names of God are not names like human names, they are titles or descriptions of God acting in some way. While the Jesus name, relates to him as Messiah, Mediator etc. In context of the actual chapter it is talking about how Jesus is about everyone else, "to the glory of God the Father".

This passage is about the King of the realm thematically speaking, honoring the hero of the realm that did something important to save the day, like Saul honoring David for slaying Goliath, the Pharaoh of Egypt honoring Joseph, Mordecai honored by the King of the Persians and Medes for saving the kings life years ago etc.


Imitating Christ’s Humility
2 Therefore if you have any encouragement from being united with Christ, if any comfort from his love, if any common sharing in the Spirit, if any tenderness and compassion, 2 then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and of one mind. 3 Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit. Rather, in humility value others above yourselves, 4 not looking to your own interests but each of you to the interests of the others.

5 In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:

6 Who, being in very nature God,
did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;
7 rather, he made himself nothing
by taking the very nature of a servant,
being made in human likeness.
8 And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to death—
even death on a cross!

9 Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name,
10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

 

[Neogaia777]

God knows what is in your mind and heart when you are just only thinking about Him/Them (the Trinity) so He most definitely knows what is on your mind and heart when you are calling upon Him with words, or out loud...

One could be saying YHWH, another one Jesus, another one just simply God maybe, and none of it matters except what is understood in your mind and heart when you are thinking about Him, etc...

Are you thinking savior, deliverer, redeemer, the object of all of your reverence and awe and love and affection? Of Your very deep respect and great honor, but at the same time love also, etc, etc, etc? Because God already knows all of these things, etc, and that is what I think matters the most to Him, etc...

You could even be saying the right name, but not have your thoughts correct about Him in your heart, whereas someone else is maybe not using the exact right and correct technical name, but have their thoughts 100% accurate about Him in their heart, and you don't think God still hears both, etc...?

Take a look at this thread to see what I and others had to say about prayer, and how you should pray or who you should pray to, and maybe it will make things a little bit more clear, etc...

Pay attention to the first few posts of mine, and the very last one from me...

Pray to the Father or to Jesus? Both?

God Bless!

 

[Strong in Him]

Hi folks.

Here goes - lower you heresy shields...

I have been pondering this issue for a while and invite comment.

In John 17 we have clear statements concerning the Father giving Jesus His Name ("I have kept them in Your Name, the Name You gave me.")

Further to this the 'Name above every name' is JESUS. Not just on earth but on heaven as well.

Jesus simply means God Saves.

So this will ruffle a few feathers but I can only conclude that God Himself has raised the Name of Jesus higher than any other name He has.

Our messianic brothers in particularly want the claim YHWH is eternally the highest name.

So what is the Name above every Name - this is important as we need to be confident that we are appealing to the highest authority.

God revealed himself to Moses as "I am", Exodus 3:14.
When Jesus said "I am", people understood that he was using the name of God, which is why the leaders tried to stone him and accused him of blasphemy.

To me, "I am" encompasses everything else - God is love, God is Saviour, God is all knowing; that's who he is.
Jesus was the human name given to the Word when he became flesh. Jesus is the one who has reconciled man and God, who was raised from the dead, who will return one day and before whom every knee will bow.
Jesus is God; there is no higher authority.

 

[tturt]

In response to "He was not the first person with this name in Israel!"
Yes However, He was/is distinguished from the others because He was the prophesied One.

Hundreds of prophecies that covered hundreds of years such as -" Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel." Isa 7
"And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins." Matt 1:21 Fulfilled Luk 2
"Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass." Zech 9:9 Fulfilled in Matt 21

Still considering the name above all names.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Thanks for the responses.

I hear no refutation of the scriptures I have raised that impact on this issue.

It is all very well to hold to a theology but one must account for the whole of scripture.

The Name that is above every Name is a very strong statement and should not be ignored for some other perspective.

 

[Saint Steven]

Yeshua, Jesus, Joshua all mean 'Yah saves' and are essentially the same name.

I agree.
I suppose God knows when we are talking to, or about him,
regardless of what name we use.

 

[Saint Steven]

Yeshua, Jesus, Joshua all mean 'Yah saves' and are essentially the same name.

Acts 4:12
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Also reminds me of this:

Philippians 2:10-11
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

Note on "acknowledge" in Philippians 2:11 from Strong's Concordance
S1843 eksomologéō (from 1537 /ek, "wholly out from," intensifying 3670 /homologéō, "say the same thing about") – properly, fully agree and to acknowledge that agreement openly (whole-heartedly); hence, to confess ("openly declare"), without reservation (no holding back).

 

[Jonaitis]

This thread is not about the Canon.

No quotes I have made are in question by mainstream church.

You brought up the importance of Scripture, but that needs to be defined.

 

[Neogaia777]

God revealed himself to Moses as "I am", Exodus 3:14.
When Jesus said "I am", people understood that he was using the name of God, which is why the leaders tried to stone him and accused him of blasphemy.

To me, "I am" encompasses everything else - God is love, God is Saviour, God is all knowing; that's who he is.
Jesus was the human name given to the Word when he became flesh. Jesus is the one who has reconciled man and God, who was raised from the dead, who will return one day and before whom every knee will bow.
Jesus is God; there is no higher authority.

And if you all go back to what I was saying in post #2, "YHWH" is essentially "I am", and that was probably the best way that we have of knowing God's true name and what it really means, etc, but with nothing else added to it, or before or after it, etc, because once you do that, and once you fill in that blank, etc, it automatically comes with limits, and automatically limits the creature or being, which goes back to what I was saying in post #2 and what I was saying about it and how we will carry the name one day, just like the angels do, because with them, and how it will be in the future with us, there will always be something in that blank, as to where that is not so with God, they will be names like "I am", "peace", or "I am" "hope", or "I am" "joy", or "laughter", etc, and that being is the embodiment of that thing, and it is also their proper dwelling place, etc, but, there are also other angels or beings, like the angels of disease or destruction or death (passover, etc), and they are those things, etc, but each is only a servant and are only a part of the great "I am" that has nothing else added to it, or before or after it, etc, because that would automatically limit it to being only a part and not the whole, etc...

It is important to note that both YHWH in the OT, and Jesus in the NT, both claimed to be the great "I am", etc...

The only possible thing or word I could ever even think of putting in that blank when it comes to God, is just only "Love" maybe, and "Agape Love" maybe, since that is known to also be chief of and encompass all, etc, but other than that, just "I am" only, is probably one of the best ways to put it to us right now where we are currently at, etc...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

And if you all go back to what I was saying in post #2, "YHWH" is essentially "I am", and that was probably the best way that we have of knowing God's true name and what it really means, etc, but with nothing else added to it, or before or after it, etc, because once you do that, and once you fill in that blank, etc, it automatically comes with limits, and automatically limits the creature or being, which goes back to what I was saying in post #2 and what I was saying about it and how we will carry the name one day, just like the angels do, because with them, and how it will be in the future with us, there will always be something in that blank, as to where that is not so with God, they will be names like "I am", "peace", or "I am" "hope", or "I am" "joy", or "laughter", etc, and that being is the embodiment of that thing, and it is also their proper dwelling place, etc, but, there are also other angels or beings, like the angels of disease or destruction or death (passover, etc), and they are those things, etc, but each is only a servant and are only a part of the great "I am" that has nothing else added to it, or before or after it, etc, because that would automatically limit it to being only a part and not the whole, etc...

It is important to note that both YHWH in the OT, and Jesus in the NT, both claimed to be the great "I am", etc...

The only possible thing or word I could ever even think of putting in that blank when it comes to God, is just only "Love" maybe, and "Agape Love" maybe, since that is known to also be chief of and encompass all, etc, but other than that, just "I am" only, is probably one of the best ways to put it to us right now where we are currently at, etc...

God Bless!

I am very glad that it is an "I" and not "we" even in an angels case, etc, because that means we will still be individuals even though we are a part of God's body, and that we still get to have some trace of our each own unique individuality still, etc...

Glad for that, etc...

God Bless!

 

[Pavel Mosko]

Thanks for the responses.

I hear no refutation of the scriptures I have raised that impact on this issue.

It is all very well to hold to a theology but one must account for the whole of scripture.

The Name that is above every Name is a very strong statement and should not be ignored for some other perspective.

OK hopefully this is my last post here....


Judges 13
New International Version

The Birth of Samson
13 Again the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord, so the Lord delivered them into the hands of the Philistines for forty years.

2 A certain man of Zorah, named Manoah, from the clan of the Danites, had a wife who was childless, unable to give birth. 3 The angel of the Lord appeared to her and said, “You are barren and childless, but you are going to become pregnant and give birth to a son. 4 Now see to it that you drink no wine or other fermented drink and that you do not eat anything unclean. 5 You will become pregnant and have a son whose head is never to be touched by a razor because the boy is to be a Nazirite, dedicated to God from the womb. He will take the lead in delivering Israel from the hands of the Philistines.”

6 Then the woman went to her husband and told him, “A man of God came to me. He looked like an angel of God, very awesome. I didn’t ask him where he came from, and he didn’t tell me his name. 7 But he said to me, ‘You will become pregnant and have a son. Now then, drink no wine or other fermented drink and do not eat anything unclean, because the boy will be a Nazirite of God from the womb until the day of his death.’”

8 Then Manoah prayed to the Lord: “Pardon your servant, Lord. I beg you to let the man of God you sent to us come again to teach us how to bring up the boy who is to be born.”

9 God heard Manoah, and the angel of God came again to the woman while she was out in the field; but her husband Manoah was not with her. 10 The woman hurried to tell her husband, “He’s here! The man who appeared to me the other day!”

11 Manoah got up and followed his wife. When he came to the man, he said, “Are you the man who talked to my wife?”

“I am,” he said.

12 So Manoah asked him, “When your words are fulfilled, what is to be the rule that governs the boy’s life and work?”

13 The angel of the Lord answered, “Your wife must do all that I have told her. 14 She must not eat anything that comes from the grapevine, nor drink any wine or other fermented drink nor eat anything unclean. She must do everything I have commanded her.”

15 Manoah said to the angel of the Lord, “We would like you to stay until we prepare a young goat for you.”

16 The angel of the Lord replied, “Even though you detain me, I will not eat any of your food. But if you prepare a burnt offering, offer it to the Lord.” (Manoah did not realize that it was the angel of the Lord.)

17 Then Manoah inquired of the angel of the Lord, “What is your name, so that we may honor you when your word comes true?”

18 He replied, “Why do you ask my name? It is beyond understanding.” 19 Then Manoah took a young goat, together with the grain offering, and sacrificed it on a rock to the Lord. And the Lord did an amazing thing while Manoah and his wife watched: 20 As the flame blazed up from the altar toward heaven, the angel of the Lord ascended in the flame. Seeing this, Manoah and his wife fell with their faces to the ground. 21 When the angel of the Lord did not show himself again to Manoah and his wife, Manoah realized that it was the angel of the Lord.

22 “We are doomed to die!” he said to his wife. “We have seen God!”

23 But his wife answered, “If the Lord had meant to kill us, he would not have accepted a burnt offering and grain offering from our hands, nor shown us all these things or now told us this.”

24 The woman gave birth to a boy and named him Samson. He grew and the Lord blessed him, 25 and the Spirit of the Lord began to stir him while he was in Mahaneh Dan, between Zorah and Eshtaol.

Footnotes

1. Judges 13:18 Or is wonderful

 

[Carl Emerson]

OK... so what do we do with these scriptures that reveal what the highest name is ???

My take is that 'The Name' was not revealed until Jesus came but kept from understanding until that time.

Either that or snip out these scriptures...


Eph 1
20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church...

Phil 2
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

John 17
11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

Acts 4:12
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

You better have a big rubbish bin for all those pages...

 

[Neogaia777]

OK... so what do we do with these scriptures that reveal what the highest name is ???

My take is that 'The Name' was not revealed until Jesus came but kept from understanding until that time.

Either that or snip out these scriptures...


Eph 1
20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church...

Phil 2
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

John 17
11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

Acts 4:12
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

You better have a big rubbish bin for all those pages...

Do you think the name of Jesus is greater than the name of God, Yahweh?

Jesus name is great, and mighty, and wonderful, and powerful, and we're even supposed to be able to do the supernatural in that name, which is why also when we pray either to the Father or God the Spirit, we are supposed to always do it in Jesus name, but it is not greater than the Father or the Spirit's name, and Jesus is given a new name (scripture says) also, so what do you suppose that new name is other than the very same name that the Father and the Spirit already go by, and by whom all the rest of His angels, or servants, also carry that name, and go by, but just in a more limited form or fashion, etc...?

I would also like to say yet again that I think you are getting to hung up on specific language also, and specifically the English language, etc, for if one says His name in another language, they are using different sounds and slyabbles, but they still mean God, or the Son of God, and whatever that means to them, and that is what is most important, is what the name means to them when they are saying it, or are thinking about it, etc...

God Bless!

 

[Pavel Mosko]

OK... so what do we do with these scriptures that reveal what the highest name is ???

They are real but you got to realize at the time they were written they were not scriptures! All those passages were 3 Centuries away or more from being officially canonized. All the "scripture" spoken of in the NT is the OT! The Apostles never called their writings scripture during this time. They instead explicitly referred to their preaching and their letters. All the Scripture that they refer to is the OT which should not be a surprise if you follow who their original target audience was, aka the Jews, how can you evangelize them when you are penning your own authoritative texts!? That basically is like circular reasoning.


My point is not to go "above the line" as far as what the Apostles intended. From what I can tell you are not just trying to make the point that Jesus is the greatest name we can know, comprehend, use in our everyday prayers etc. but trying to suggest something beyond that.


By the way passages like Philippians exist for other reasons too. Like the early Angel worship and occult practice in Judaism that would eventually become Cabbalism, and other kinds of sorcery where people desire to have the secret names of angels, deities etc. to obtain some form of occult power etc. This passage basically puts those kinds of notions to rest that you don't need some obscure hidden name, but the name that everybody learns in the Gospels and the preaching of the time.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Do you think the name of Jesus is greater than the name of God, Yahweh?

I prefer to simply quote what scripture says.

You are welcome to argue with the specific scriptures listed above.

They are real but you got to realize at the time they were written they were not scriptures!

Are you suggesting the scriptures I quoted are not inspired by the Holy Spirit ?

 

[Carl Emerson]

I am not surprised that the status of the name of Jesus is is being contested given that He promised the following...

Matthew 18:20
For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”

Mark 16
16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

John 14:13
Whatever you ask in my name, this I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.

John 14:14
If you ask me anything in my name, I will do it.

John 15:16
You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit and that your fruit should abide, so that whatever you ask the Father in my name, he may give it to you.

John 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.

John 16:23
In that day you will ask nothing of me. Truly, truly, I say to you, whatever you ask of the Father in my name, he will give it to you.

Could it be that failure to appreciate the importance of the Name of Jesus limits the degree to which He works in our midst.