Nakedness is "uncovered"

[windjammer]

There was Simon the Zealiot who would have been a Judaen of a sect that was anti-Roman/anti-taxcollector (which would have been material for many disputes between him and Matthew )
The canaanite quote is from endtime prophesies

Zech 14:21Yes, every pot in all the houses of Jerusalem and in Judah shall be dedicated and holy to the Lord of hosts, and all who sacrifice may come and take of them and boil their sacrifices in them [and traders in such wares will no longer be seen at the temple]. And in that day there shall be no more a Canaanite [that is, any godless or unclean person, whether Jew or Gentile] in the house of the Lord of hosts.

Well Maid ,

Have you ever considered that whole chapter in Zech 14

meaning that Cannan being a servant to his brothers
there will be no more servants but sons in Gods house ?

John 8 35Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Well Maid ,

Have you ever considered that whole chapter in Zech 14

meaning that Cannan being a servant to his brothers
there will be no more servants but sons in Gods house ?

John 8 35Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

Kool That would go perfectly with not knowing anyone after the flesh, afterall we are not to know even Christ himself after the flesh.

 

[windjammer]

Those are some very insightful things coming out wirlwind1

I find it also interesting that Cannan was a slave to his brothers

how can he be a brother and uncles to them at the same time ?

Genesis 9: 24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him,[Ham]

25 he said,
"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."

Just some food for thought

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Well Maid ,

Have you ever considered that whole chapter in Zech 14

meaning that Cannan being a servant to his brothers
there will be no more servants but sons in Gods house ?

John 8 35Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

Ezek 16: 16 " 'This is what the Lord God says: If the ruler gives a gift from his land to any of his sons, that land will belong to the son and then to the son's children. It is their property passed down from their family.17 But if the ruler gives a gift from his land to any of his servants, that land will belong to the servant only until the year of freedom. Then the land will go back to the ruler. Only the ruler's sons may keep a gift of land from the ruler.18 The ruler must not take any of the people's land, forcing them out of their land. He must give his sons some of his own land so my people will not be scattered out of their own land.' "

It's a prophesy of the earthly inheritance in the Jubilee not being ripped off. Abraham thought the inheritance would go to his servant but God intended it for Isaac.


Gal 4:23His son by the slave woman was born in the ordinary way; but his son by the free woman was born as the result of a promise.


John 8:34Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave to sin.

 

[windjammer]

Ezek 16: 16 " 'This is what the Lord God says: If the ruler gives a gift from his land to any of his sons, that land will belong to the son and then to the son's children. It is their property passed down from their family.17 But if the ruler gives a gift from his land to any of his servants, that land will belong to the servant only until the year of freedom. Then the land will go back to the ruler. Only the ruler's sons may keep a gift of land from the ruler.18 The ruler must not take any of the people's land, forcing them out of their land. He must give his sons some of his own land so my people will not be scattered out of their own land.' "

It's a prophesy of the earthly inheritance in the Jubilee not being ripped off. Abraham thought the inheritance would go to his servant but God intended it for Isaac.


Gal 4:23His son by the slave woman was born in the ordinary way; but his son by the free woman was born as the result of a promise.


John 8:34Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave to sin.

Well Maid ,

I still wonder have you read Zech 14?
And have you seen that it was for those
born of flesh being slaves to sin as Cannan was , and all for that matter ,including you and I also born into sin and slavery

to become sons of God though the promise of Jesus Christ


Gal 4 1What I am saying is that as long as the heir is a child,


he is no different from a slave,

although he owns the whole estate.

2He is subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father.

3So also, when we were children, we were in slavery under the basic principles of the world.

4But when the time had fully come,

God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under law,

5to redeem those under law, that we might receive

the full rights of sons.

6Because you are sons,

God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts,

the Spirit who calls out, "Abba, Father."

7So you are no longer a slave,

but a son; and since you are a son,

God has made you also an heir.

Why do you think Noah cursed his Son's son anyways ?
and why did Noah call them His brothers ?

well we cannot have murmmers and complainers now can we ?
better ?

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

?

The curse would seem to be along the same lines as Jacob prophesying over the tribes.

Not sure why you would capitalise His...brothers...or the point you are trying to make. The dialog was directed at Ham so would indicate Ham's brothers.
I read Zech 14 where it talks about canaanites but fail to see the correlation beyond Ham's descendents being the forefathers of the Tower of Babel. That was the point that I was making about the uncovering of Noah's nakedness.
No need to post whole chapters.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The curse would seem to be along the same lines as Jacob prophesying over the tribes.

Not sure why you would capitalise His...brothers...or the point you are trying to make. The dialog was directed at Ham so would indicate Ham's brothers.
I read Zech 14 where it talks about canaanites but fail to see the correlation beyond Ham's descendents being the forefathers of the Tower of Babel. That was the point that I was making about the uncovering of Noah's nakedness.
No need to post whole chapters.

No need to quote them either
Took me forever to scroll down the post you quoted and your post to get to the next one. Then to scroll past his quote and post to get to the next one.

Wore my poor ole mouse wheel down ehehe

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

No need to quote them either
Took me forever to scroll down the post you quoted and your post to get to the next one. Then to scroll past his quote and post to get to the next one.

Wore my poor ole mouse wheel down ehehe

Hey that's a lot of work just to go off topic ;P

 

[windjammer]

I see its pointless to even try to speak to some people

Have a nice Day
off topic Indeed ,
but its all
relative , this Book the Bible all points to Jesus Christ and Him being revealed

 

[Fireinfolding]

I see its pointless to even try to speak to some people

Have a nice Day
off topic Indeed ,
but its all
relative , this Book the Bible all points to Jesus Christ and Him being revealed

I for one appreciate your contribution here windjammer

Amen, the scriptures testify of him

 

[1whirlwind]

Those are some very insightful things coming out wirlwind1

I find it also interesting that Cannan was a slave to his brothers

how can he be a brother and uncles to them at the same time ?

Genesis 9: 24 When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him,[Ham]

25 he said,
"Cursed be Canaan!
The lowest of slaves
will he be to his brothers."

Just some food for thought

Hi Windjammer.

I'm not certain what you're hinting at but...you're making me look deeper. The three sons are listed in the order of "Shem, Ham, and Japeth: and unto them were sons born AFTER THE FLOOD." [10:1] "And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan." [10:6] If Ham was the youngest of Noah's sons...why was he listed in that order?

Bullinger wrote that "Japeth was the eldest," Ham was the middle son...and believes Ham was termed "younger son" (in the following passage) as he was younger than Japeth, and "Shem was the youngest."

That doesn't make any sense to me. Would it be written that Noah knew "what his younger son had done unto him" if it meant he knew what his son that was younger than Japeth the eldest had done?

Genesis 9:22, 24-25 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. (24-25) And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him? And he said, "Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren."
​

Why mention "Ham, "the father of Canaan" and not Ham the father of....Cush, Mizraim and Phut...as well as Canaan? Why curse Canaan and not Ham's other sons...why not curse Ham himself? I can only think of two reasons. Either Canaan was the result of what Ham did or....Canaan was the "younger son."

Someone taught me that there is no term for biblical grandfathers, etc. Perhaps saying someone was your "son" could also mean your grandson in that time. But then, we have to contend with...."Ham...saw the nakedness...and told his two brethren."

Leviticus 18:3,6,8 After the doings of the land of Egypt, wherein ye dwelt, shall ye not do: and after the doings of the land of Canaan, whither I bring you, shall ye not do: neither shall ye walk in their ordinances. (6) None of you shall approach to any that is near of kin to him, to uncover their nakedness: I am the LORD. (8) The nakedness of thy father's wife shalt thou not uncover: it is thy father's nakedness.
​

Did Ham see what happened ("saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren") and report it to his two brothers or did Ham commit the act?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

I see its pointless to even try to speak to some people

Have a nice Day
off topic Indeed ,
but its all
relative , this Book the Bible all points to Jesus Christ and Him being revealed

Who would those be

 

[Fireinfolding]

Who would those be

You and windjammer know each other!

 

[windjammer]

Hi Windjammer.

I'm not certain what you're hinting at but...you're making me look deeper. The three sons are listed in the order of "Shem, Ham, and Japeth: and unto them were sons born AFTER THE FLOOD." [10:1] "And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan." [10:6] If Ham was the youngest of Noah's sons...why was he listed in that order?

Bullinger wrote that "Japeth was the eldest," Ham was the middle son...and believes Ham was termed "younger son" (in the following passage) as he was younger than Japeth, and "Shem was the youngest."

That doesn't make any sense to me. Would it be written that Noah knew "what his younger son had done unto him" if it meant he knew what his son that was younger than Japeth the eldest had done?

Genesis 9:22, 24-25 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. (24-25) And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him? And he said, "Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren."
​

Why mention "Ham, "the father of Canaan" and not Ham the father of....Cush, Mizraim and Phut...as well as Canaan? Why curse Canaan and not Ham's other sons...why not curse Ham himself? I can only think of two reasons. Either Canaan was the result of what Ham did or....Canaan was the "younger son."

Someone taught me that there is no term for biblical grandfathers, etc. Perhaps saying someone was your "son" could also mean your grandson in that time. But then, we have to contend with...."Ham...saw the nakedness...and told his two brethren."

Leviticus 18:3,6,8 After the doings of the land of Egypt, wherein ye dwelt, shall ye not do: and after the doings of the land of Canaan, whither I bring you, shall ye not do: neither shall ye walk in their ordinances. (6) None of you shall approach to any that is near of kin to him, to uncover their nakedness: I am the LORD. (8) The nakedness of thy father's wife shalt thou not uncover: it is thy father's nakedness.
​

Did Ham see what happened ("saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren") and report it to his two brothers or did Ham commit the act?

Thanks for your most thought out reply 1whirlwind ,

I would look at Ham in Eastons Dictonary it gives little on the subject but may help a bit .
It seems to me Canaan is the result of Hams curse being in part of Hams descendents , not as the whole of those tribes of Canaan become enemies of the Hebrews and ''exposing the nakeness of thy father ''

Would it mean in the Spiritual sense , exposing their shame or sins and causing them to be wrathful in Noahs case , provoked to curse .
They do not detail the cause , just the result.

Ham
(From Easton's Bible Dictionary) warm, hot, and hence the south; also an Egyptian word meaning "black", the youngest son of Noah Gen 5 :32 comp 9 22;24
The curse pronounced by Noah against Ham, properly against Canaan his fourth son, was accomplished when the Jews subsequently exterminated the Canaanites.​

(From International Standard Bible Encyclopedia)
ham (cham; Cham):
1. The Youngest Son of Noah: The youngest son of Noah , from whom sprang the western and southwestern nations known to the Hebrews.

His name first occurs in Gen 5 ;32, where, as in Gen 6;18 and elsewhere, it occupies the second place.
In Gen 9 ;18 Ham is described as "the father of Canaan," to prepare the reader for Gen 9 25 ,27, where Noah, cursing Ham for having told Shem and Japheth of his nakedness,

refers to him as Canaan.

On account of this, it has been suggested that "Canaan" stood originally in all the passages where the three brothers are spoken of,

and that this was later changed to "Ham," except in the verses containing the curse.

It seems more likely, however, that the name "Canaan" is inserted prophetically, as Noah would not desire to curse his son, but only one branch of that son's descendants, who were later the principal adversaries of the Hebrews.



​

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

The covering of man over woman/the covering of the Husband over the Bride.
I think all has been laid naked and there is nothing left to uncover.
YouTube - peter and gordon lady godiva.wmv
haha God bless ya'll