• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
  • We hope the site problems here are now solved, however, if you still have any issues, please start a ticket in Contact Us

My Scientific Method Challenge

AV1611VET

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2006
3,856,435
52,722
Guam
✟5,182,747.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Like Dynamo?
Not even close.

Matthew 14:24 But the ship was now in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves: for the wind was contrary.
25 And in the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea.


What's missing in your picture?
 
Upvote 0

FrumiousBandersnatch

Well-Known Member
Mar 20, 2009
15,407
8,144
✟358,196.00
Faith
Atheist
Not even close.

Matthew 14:24 But the ship was now in the midst of the sea, tossed with waves: for the wind was contrary.
25 And in the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea.


What's missing in your picture?
Let me guess, historical fiction?
 
Upvote 0

Oaktree125

Active Member
Aug 28, 2020
30
3
55
frederick
✟29,186.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
Kinda like looking for Jesus' footprints on the Sea of Galilee?
Im reposting but the idea is to create an explanatory structure that is consistent with Scripture and is obviously part of the message of salvation. Not that supernatural will be revealed and therefore faith unnecessary by this set of ideas. Good explanations have value and if it doesnt do certain things very well ok - give me the neutrino masses and explain how they got it outside the Higgs mechanism if that is problematic to you. Using the technique to create a 'model' does yield good fruit i think though I suppose Im about to find out about all the heresay Im implying. The point is to unify for study and create testable hypotheses from it- or perhaps in this case more reasonable expectations- not an expert at the method but Im going thru the gist or motions.
What is missing is the miracle mechanism, the supernature from the Scriptural support. When God floods the world in Noah's day He drags creation backwards in time to the Days of Creation to recreate the moments of Gen 1:1. This is the process, the latent power of miracle in the world to be definitive and expected. When a miracle is called it is not some anything goes magic. (I dont recognize anything other than Gods power as existing in the world -nothing ever shows up to challenge God) Only the real actual past is involved. A miracle is natural by being composed of real , temporally separated events that can re-interact over any amount of time (formal def.) - that is why the Flood reminds us of the details of Gen1:1 because they are the same (or recurring) reality that God Himself brings together. Anachronisms answer our doubt. "Did this really happen 2000 yrs ago?" Yes it did because only reality is used during a miracle. Let's look at some examples: What did Jesus walk on in the Sea of Galilee? Was it levitation or was He merely interacting with real ground before the land subsided below sea level (leaving your footprints)? "Which is easier?" What about the axehead? Does Scripture say it floated and displayed buoyancy properties in the current or did it merely interact with the bottom of the river from a previous era at Elisha 's urging before some other flood gouged it out? Did a snake live inside Moses' staff or was it sunning itself one day on the side of the mountain and formed a entangled bond to the stick in time? Do wildfire fires burn on the sides of mountains? If we observe a being clearly outside of the bounds of time couldnt a bush from some previous wildfire be there to see as a temporal anomaly? Did you know that the Red Sea did dry up? Did you know that scientists think a lava dam may have catastrophically broken and reflooded the basin killing the Egyptians chasing the Hebrews?. Do you see history that happened in those miracles? And what about the baskets that feed thousands? Arent they taken to market again and again and again and wouldnt the clay pots have wine one time and then oil and then water another moment? Real, real, and more reality! This type of activity preserves as much as possible what is know to be the physics of our world (conservation) yet admits that same special supernature. That ALL miracles follow this prescription goes to repeatability inside Scripture. So Im "naturalizing" a miracle by using ONLY real past events and making that one consistent definition of God's miraculous activity. Miracles are historically accurate and therefore occurred- see how great God is???This process is what salvation to heaven in the future is...God bringing us up out of the past to the heavenly moments described in Revelations, by mastering time God is proving His ability to deliver eternity thus the message of salvation is a miracle. We are required to believe miracles in a natural world.
Having a formal definition internal to Scripture means that we can analyze all reports for consistency in nature from all cultures and at all times. Listening for signs of this model of supernature means that not just Scriptural accounts but hundreds of thousands of reports count towards our belief in real. Efforts to measure the presence of the past hides literally under our nose the potential for miracles, since the information it contained always influences the very molecules of the world around us. In short we move to a quantum/informational standpoint regarding the pasts ability to recur which isnt too awful a notion given wave like properties and harmonics(again my best guess as Im not an expert) and the scientific assertion that particles arent classic cannonballs.
Of course this idea is bound at both ends and potentially riddled with innumerable heresies but it does bring naturalness to miracles and is consistency with the message of salvation and more in keeping with the laws of conservation and physics since only reality was used.. Isnt time the miracle Joshua asks for?
Whats funny is that the TV movie "The Ten Commandments" has the idol worshipping Hebrews fall into cracks in the earth after Moses comes down with the first set of Ten. That isnt Scripturally accurate but it is historically accurate to the geology of the spreading fault zone there where it happened. Technically the basin of the Red Sea has always been "parting" and it is what made me realize that this model of miracles was consistent- I only found out after some fact checking that it wasnt Scripturally true....Those cracks are also what formed the Sea of Galilee. There's a lot more to it but let's see where you are so far...
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0