My New Moon Challenge

[AirPo]

You are necro posting again, AV. The user you quoted hasn't been online for 3 years...

Narcissistic necromancy.

 

[Sanoy]

Because none exists? and wouldn't exist even if another one did pop unto existence ex nihilo?

Yeah I think you could only use inference to say God was the one who did it.

 

[AV1611VET]

You are necro posting again, AV. The user you quoted hasn't been online for 3 years...

How do you know?

Here's a riddle:

"Nathan Poe" hasn't posted here for almost four years; yet he just posted here yesterday.

Can you figure it out?

 

[AV1611VET]

Narcissistic necromancy.

Assumes facts not in evidence.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yeah I think you could only use inference to say God was the one who did it.

Yup.

And He didn't leave any physical evidence behind (as far as I know).

No ion trails, no plasma clouds; no time crystals; no nothing.

 

[Skreeper]

How do you know?

Here's a riddle:

"Nathan Poe" hasn't posted here for almost four years; yet he just posted here yesterday.

Can you figure it out?

 

[AirPo]

Assumes facts not in evidence.

Hello -->

 

[Sanoy]

Yup.

And He didn't leave any physical evidence behind (as far as I know).

No ion trails, no plasma clouds; no time crystals; no nothing.

Even if He announed His presence and made a big show of it for everyone to witness it would only be good for a single generation. After that historical criticism would kick in and we'd all be reduced to primitive bumpkins.

 

[AV1611VET]

Even if He announed His presence and made a big show of it for everyone to witness it would only be good for a single generation. After that historical criticism would kick in and we'd all be reduced to primitive bumpkins.

That's where faith comes in.

To prevent that.

 

[PsychoSarah]

God creates another moon -- ex nihilo -- orbiting the earth.

What evidence would you present that He did this?

The night sky is always under observation, so it would be witnessed to pop into existence suddenly. Quantum physics, as I understand it, would not be able to account for an object of such mass. One would not be able to demonstrate a specific deity did it if they made an effort to avoid detection, but that the event wasn't natural would be measurable.

 

[AV1611VET]

One would not be able to demonstrate a specific deity did it if they made an effort to avoid detection, but that the event wasn't natural would be measurable.

What specific evidence would scientists expect to find surrounding this new moon?

A plasma cloud? an ion cloud? time crystals? residue radiation?

What exactly?

 

[PsychoSarah]

What specific evidence would scientists expect to find surrounding this new moon?

If it were natural we'd expect to be able to detect its approach long before it fell into orbit around the planet. If it shared the same orbit as the actual moon and never collided with it or disrupted it, it would most definitely have to be artificial in origin. If it consisted of non-natural materials, such as refined stainless steel, it'd have to be artificial as well. Even if it was a duplicate of the moon currently orbiting our planet, the low probability of such an identical object existing and suddenly being found near the planet would be a strong indicator of design.

It'd be trivial to make this an obviously created object. It could not simply appear in place and pass as a natural one, even if it otherwise had the traits of a natural object.

A plasma cloud? an ion cloud? time crystals? residue radiation?

What exactly?

By virtue of its sudden appearance it would almost guaranteed have to be artificial. It'd have to drift towards our planet from outside the solar system with a clear, easily observable path to have a hope of passing as a naturally occurring object.

 

[AV1611VET]

If it were natural we'd expect to be able to detect its approach long before it fell into orbit around the planet.

Okay … I stopped right here.

Do you know what "creatio ex nihilo" is?

 

[PsychoSarah]

Okay … I stopped right here.

Do you know what "creatio ex nihilo" is?

Yes, which is why I assert that a new moon suddenly appearing in Earth's orbit with no clear origin would be obviously artificial.

We wouldn't be able to rule out a method of travel unknown to us, so it'd be impossible to tell that the mass itself wasn't a collection of pre-existing mass. That doesn't make it any less obviously artificial, though.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yes, which is why I assert that a new moon suddenly appearing in Earth's orbit with no clear origin would be obviously artificial.

Okay … which is it?

Did it suddenly show up (as I stipulated in my OP)?

Or did it travel here (as you're trying to make it look)?

We wouldn't be able to rule out a method of travel unknown to us,

… so it'd be impossible to tell that the mass itself wasn't a collection of pre-existing mass.

That would be creatio ex materia, not creatio ex nihilo as I stipulated in my OP.

That doesn't make it any less obviously artificial, though.

Just out of curiosity, did you go to college?

 

[PsychoSarah]

Okay … which is it?

Did it suddenly show up (as I stipulated in my OP)?

Yes, in your hypothetical scenario, it suddenly appeared, making it obviously artificial in some regard (the method by which it was transported, at a bare minimum).

Or did it travel here (as you're trying to make it look)?

I'm not trying to make it look that way, only stating that for a created item the size of a moon to maintain the illusion of being natural, it couldn't just suddenly appear in Earth's orbit. Thus, by virtue of the fact that your hypothetical moon does suddenly appear, any conclusion that suggests it could have arrived naturally would only be held by wingnuts at most.

Just out of curiosity, did you go to college?

I recently graduated; Biomedical sciences major with a chemistry minor. I've been a college student for nearly my entire presence on Christian forums, with only a brief month or two at the beginning as a high school graduate awaiting my first semester of college.

 

[AV1611VET]

I'm not trying to make it look that way, only stating that for a created item the size of a moon to maintain the illusion of being natural, it couldn't just suddenly appear in Earth's orbit. Thus, by virtue of the fact that your hypothetical moon does suddenly appear, any conclusion that suggests it could have arrived naturally would only be held by wingnuts at most.

Okay, Sarah … fair enough.

If you don't want to respect the OP, that's your prerogative.

I recently graduated; Biomedical sciences major with a chemistry minor. I've been a college student for nearly my entire presence on Christian forums, with only a brief month or two at the beginning as a high school graduate awaiting my first semester of college.

Lucky guess on my part, eh?

 

[PsychoSarah]

Okay, Sarah … fair enough.

If you don't want to respect the OP, that's your prerogative.

I was respecting the OP; in order to show why such a thing would obviously not be a natural phenomenon, I had to compare it to a version that would fall in line with natural phenomena to most clearly depict how your hypothetical scenario deviated. You did, after all, ask how we'd be able to tell that it wasn't natural.

Lucky guess on my part, eh?

I've mentioned that I am a college student many a time, including in threads you were participating in and direct conversation with you. I guess you forgot.

 

[HitchSlap]

How do you know?

Here's a riddle:

"Nathan Poe" hasn't posted here for almost four years; yet he just posted here yesterday.

Can you figure it out?

Here's a challenge for you: If god decided to uncreate himself, would there be any evidence that he was ever here?

 

[Kylie]

God creates another moon -- ex nihilo -- orbiting the earth.

What evidence would you present that He did this?

Sounds like your apple challenge reworded.

God creates a thing out of nothing. How do you show that he made it out of nothing instead of out of pre-existing material?

My answer is that I would weigh the universe. Assuming I could do it accurately enough, I could show that the universe had increased in weight with the creation of an entire moon from nothing.