My main issue *PLEASE READ*

[Soverinth]

Okay so here is somewhat of a story of my life so far. Left out most of the minimal unneeded details.

I ask that you please please please do not just ignore this because it is very long. I don't see me getting any help without giving out the back-story.

This is where I’m stumped. I'm 17 years old. I'm Still at home with my family. Have not finished School either.

I've been trying to learn the most out of what True Christianity is. This research started only a few weeks ago because before then i thought i was saved.

Sadly my whole life hasn't really consisted of any religious matter. There was only a few times where I tried to learn more but just couldn’t get into it. I've been growing up most of my life up to a point thinking I was a Christian because that's what my dad said we were. During the very early years of my life from what my parents told me we were going to Church. This only lasted so long I’m guessing cause apparently we stopped when we moved to a certain area and I was only 3 years old at this time. Most of what I had learned about in Church I don't remember because it was just too long ago. So from that point on I was living my life as you could say normally like everyone else. For the longest time I did what everyone else did, went to school and hung out with friends. A lot of my life before my teen years I was outside more than I am now and hung out with friends from school from time to time. A trait to all of this is I was growing up a video-gamer. Absolutely loved video games with all my heart. That's mostly what I did when I wasn't hanging with my friends. Around high school things started to change. I've never been a straight A student so I've had a fair share of F's and D's. I failed 9th grade and had to take it over again. Up until the last few weeks of my repeating 9th grade I was kind of just dragging along and still wasn't doing all that great grade wise. It came to the point where I couldn't stand that school anymore and I wanted to just get out of there. For a small time I was looking up Homeschooling. I eventually found one called ECOT and switched to that. Passed my repeating year of 9th grade which was only like 4 weeks. Then passed 10th grade. At this point I’ve been a junior. The thing about all this homeschooling is that it changed me again. I got this notion inside my head that well because I don't have to go anywhere for school I don't see the need to go outside unless necessary.
From the time I switched to homeschooling I only had about two outside friends left. With my constant crazy feeling of not wanting to go anywhere I ended up losing any friends I had left. There was an event that my last friend invited me to at a Church that was on my street. The event was a guest speaker. I don’t know why but I really didn’t want to go, but my friend finally got me to go by bugging my over and over. This small conference was the speaker talking about his life and how he came to know Jesus Christ. So we listen to all of it, there was singing and some funny jokes in it. At the end of it the guy talked about being saved. He said to raise your hand if you don't think your saved. During this I didn't really know anything about this, all I thought I knew was that I was a supposed Christian. So I raised my hand along with a bunch of other kids that did the same. We ended up saying the Sinners Prayer. After that conference I thought I was saved. Sadly I went back to living the same way as before because I had no idea what I did yesterday. It didn't dawn on me until many months later I started to think about that event again. Started to search it up on the internet. Learned a little bit about it but didn’t really get into it. I later got to know some really good online friends that I played video-games with. From then until now that is mostly what I've been doing. Waking up, doing my online schoolwork, signing on to Skype to get a hold of my online friends and just playing the day away while chatting to them. Now some of these friends like to cuss a lot. I stopped my cussing earlier in life because I knew it was wrong so I just ignored what they said. There was a day about two weeks back from now as I am writing this, that was a normal day for me. The same old routine of school then gaming with friends. I don’t know what it is that caught my mind but it just started to bug me that I learned a tiny bit before all this about Christians living a good life. I started to examine my life a little bit and realized that I've been sinning just as much as I did before and had no idea. On that day I just started to do research upon research. Searching for what true Christianity is. It's because of this research that I am now living day by day in fear and sorrow. When it first hit me that I wasn't saved it scared me. So I’ve been watching these Sermons on a website called realtruthmattersdotcom. Trying to learn how to be really saved. From learning what this guy and other pastors around the world are teaching, I've come to learn that people who are truly saved are living with Christ. Living a day by day walk with the Lord. As you can imagine I haven’t been. Neither has my family so now I'm just scared every day. From these teachings I've learned that man can't do anything to save themselves. I understood that. The pastor said just to give yourself to the Lord. Abandon the life you have now and put your trust in Jesus. I have trying to do that but I haven’t really progressed any. I actually haven’t done my schoolwork because when he said to abandon the life I thought of all worldly activities. So I just stopped all my video-games, haven’t talked to my online friends since. My schoolwork hasn't really been touched either. At this point I didn’t care about losing it all cause I was focused on being saved. I have a tad bit different mindset then I did about a week ago. Before I was just so worried about going to Hell that I just tried to change. Realizing that because of my worry of Hell I wasn't focused on living a life with God. I've cried multiple times, which by the way I never used to cry about anything. I've gone from a happy joking around person to completely depressed and my family has noticed that as-well. Never once have I been depressed in this degree.

I've thought of a few problems since then:

I don't go anywhere so I'm sure that's not helping anything.

I've only read a tiny tiny bit of the Bible so my lack of Biblical knowledge isn't helping anything.

My current stand point in life (Still at home, Not finished with school, don’t have license or any job experience) Basically not able to live on my own yet is crippling any chance I have of changing. I know that your supposed to abandon your old life in turn for the new one but I’m just so confused as to how im supposed to do that. If my Education and Job and House and other necessities don't matter how in the world do I just stop this current life. Now I could see this being possible if I was out on my own because then I would have to worry about the things holding me back I could just live my new life in Christ if I can eve receive it.

On top of all of these problems, I'm extremely worried that that rapture could happen soon because were supposedly living in end times. I worry I don’t have enough time to just fix everything or to just do something about all this.

When I think about just relying on Christ to change my life I see some potential but because I don’t know how it would work it just confuses me.

ANOTHER thing that scares me beyond belief is that I don't think any of my family is saved either. If they were actually saved my dad wouldn't be a factory worker, chances are he'd be a pastor of sorts or just something drastically different. And my life wouldn't be in this mess as it is. Not to mention my parents think that just by believing the facts about Jesus and making that their belief system they think they are going to heaven. My own dad thinks that truly believing the gospel and just trying to live a good live with attempts of repentance is going to save him and now that I know of this knowledge of true Christianity, it just makes me scared even more.

As you can see I am in serious need of help. I have no idea what to do. Can you guys please give me the best response that you can think of, not some small stuff. I don’t want to live day by day in sorrow and fear of just not knowing what to do anymore.

Last Note: I am sorry if this post is ridiculously long it's just that I feel I can't get any help unless you know the back story that led me up to this point.

Thank you for your time.


Edit: Most of my issues concerning this have already been answered below and on other pages of this thread, so i am content now. If you still wish answer this first post, go right ahead.

 

[drjean]

My thoughts are that you don't need to concern yourself with anything but whether or not you wish to accept God's love.

Do you? Do you want eternal life?

If you do, then dispense with whether or not you prayed the prayer before and or meant it.... do it now. You don't have to read it or say it exactly, all you need to do is admit to Him that you need Him and ask Him for forgiveness.

We can't be better than we are before we come to God because we need Him to become better.

So accept Jesus Christ, God's Love Gift (gift meaning it's free!) And then you can work on whatever comes after that...

 

[Soverinth]

My thoughts are that you don't need to concern yourself with anything but whether or not you wish to accept God's love.

Do you? Do you want eternal life?

If you do, then dispense with whether or not you prayed the prayer before and or meant it.... do it now. You don't have to read it or say it exactly, all you need to do is admit to Him that you need Him and ask Him for forgiveness.

We can't be better than we are before we come to God because we need Him to become better.

That is exactly it though...

I have multiple times prayed to God that i need him, and asked him to forgive me. My guess as to why i haven't changed any in mind and heart is because i just don't realize it all yet. Did you know that a person who is truly saved is one that had an experience when they were saved. At that moment in time when it happened they had an overwhelming feeling of God's presence. And there mind and heart were radically changed.

I haven't had this experience yet so I'm trying to find out why it is that i haven't been converted yet. I know well enough that there is plenty wrong with me which is why i cant seem to see why I'm not changing at all. There is also a verse in the bible that says that you can KNOW like literally KNOW that you are saved and since i don't think i am saved it's just getting worse.

 

[joey_downunder]

Okay so here is somewhat of a story of my life so far. Left out most of the minimal unneeded details.

G'day there, don't worry too much about the length of your post/s; one suggestion I have though is to separate your paragraphs so it makes it easier for us oldies to read.

I've been trying to learn the most out of what True Christianity is.

Very good to read, that's a fine start.

Sadly my whole life hasn't really consisted of any religious matter.

That seems to be fairly normal these days. Even church-going people often don't seem to know that much about Christianity these days.

A trait to all of this is I was growing up a video-gamer. Absolutely loved video games with all my heart.

My sons are just like you. It seems to be a real boy thing.

Around high school things started to change.

Same happens with girls too, it seems to be part of puberty/adolescence overall.

The thing about all this homeschooling is that it changed me again. I got this notion inside my head that well because I don't have to go anywhere for school I don't see the need to go outside unless necessary.

That's sort of understandable that you've gone that way, there's no real "need" to do all the standard socialising that comes with going to schools/higher educational institutions. Losing friends as a result is very unfortunate and sounds like a negative side of homeschooling overall.

There was an event that my last friend invited me to at a Church that was on my street. The event was a guest speaker..... At the end of it the guy talked about being saved. He said to raise your hand if you don't think your saved. .....We ended up saying the Sinners Prayer. After that conference I thought I was saved.

Well without a good understanding of the Gospel and their need of the Saviour a person might be saved BUT that's treading on veeerrrrry thin ice. God is very merciful and knows when would-be converts' hearts are genuine or not.

Sadly I went back to living the same way as before because I had no idea what I did yesterday.

Did you go to Church/have other mature Christians to help you grow in your faith? If you had none of that support to help you mature in your faith what happened to you is not at all surprising. By that I mean is returning to old patterns of behaviour and copying friends etc.

I don’t know what it is that caught my mind but it just started to bug me that I learned a tiny bit before all this about Christians living a good life. I started to examine my life a little bit and realized that I've been sinning just as much as I did before and had no idea.

I think that sounds God may have been working on you and you didn't realise it at the time.

On that day I just started to do research upon research.... It's because of this research that I am now living day by day in fear and sorrow. When it first hit me that I wasn't saved it scared me.

Are you looking at your feelings (as your way to assess whether your faith is real or not), OR are you looking at what you believe right now?

because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” (Romans 10:9-11)

So I’ve been watching these Sermons on a website called realtruthmattersdotcom.... From learning what this guy and other pastors around the world are teaching, I've come to learn that people who are truly saved are living with Christ..... As you can imagine I haven’t been. Neither has my family so now I'm just scared every day.

No-one lives up to God's standards.
as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.” (Romans 3:10-12)
That is why we need faith in JESUS Himself.

From these teachings I've learned that man can't do anything to save ....Abandon the life you have now and put your trust in Jesus..... I actually haven’t done my schoolwork because when he said to abandon the life I thought of all worldly activities.....

You're taking that way too far. You are a student, that is your job right now.
Did you know that the apostles expected the Christians to work, not beg, and directed the early church/es to make sure people were corrected if they were trying to sponge off other people? 2 Thessalonians 3:6-13

I've gone from a happy joking around person to completely depressed and my family has noticed that as-well. Never once have I been depressed in this degree......I've only read a tiny tiny bit of the Bible so my lack of Biblical knowledge isn't helping anything.

You definitely need support and teachings from mature Christians to help you set your priorities straight, help you learn from the bible and help you easen up on yourself. Your anxiety is not from God.

My current stand point in life (Still at home, Not finished with school, don’t have license or any job experience) Basically not able to live on my own yet is crippling any chance I have of changing......

That is a normal part of life for your age-group all around the world - God has made that to be so.

On top of all of these problems, I'm extremely worried that that rapture could happen soon because were supposedly living in end times.

God is in control of all that, whenever it happens it will happen. Matthew 6:25-34 Meanwhile we are to do what God has arranged for us.

ANOTHER thing that scares me beyond belief is that I don't think any of my family is saved either. If they were actually saved my dad wouldn't be a factory worker, chances are he'd be a pastor of sorts or just something drastically different.

If every saved person was a pastor or missionary who would be there to spread Christian influence in schools, hospitals, police, shops - society would stop functioning!!!!!

My own dad thinks that truly believing the gospel and just trying to live a good live with attempts of repentance is going to save him and now that I know of this knowledge of true Christianity, it just makes me scared even more.

To me it sounds like your Dad is on the right track.... does his life show other signs of being saved? That does not automatically mean an obvious Christian ministry career!!!!

As you can see I am in serious need of help. I have no idea what to do. Can you guys please give me the best response that you can think of, not some small stuff.

Yes it sounds like you need to be assured of your salvation which will come through good Christian support and trusting in God's promises that are spread all throughout the bible.

P.S. Personally I think you should be typing in the "young Christians" section. I cannot see one word that sounds like you do not already believe in Jesus.

 

[joey_downunder]

That is exactly it though...

Did you know that a person who is truly saved is one that had an experience when they were saved.

I think that is a major part of your problem. You are looking at your feelings not God's promises.

At that moment in time when it happened they had an overwhelming feeling of God's presence. And there mind and heart were radically changed.

Again the bible says that FAITH IN JESUS is what saves us, not feelings, not experiences, not miracles, not signs and wonders.... [fill in the gaps].

I know well enough that there is plenty wrong with me which is why i cant seem to see why I'm not changing at all.

Faith in Jesus saves us, not faith in our faith.

Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. (Hebrews 12:1-2)

Lay down the weight of your worries and insecurities and fears that you don't measure up, lift your eyes up to Jesus.

Don't worry about feelings, feelings may come later, feelings may not. That is up to God.

There is one thing you should look at when examining your faith:
has your thinking about God changed from when you didn't believe in God?

Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.(Romans 12:2)

Is your thought life changing, your priorities changing, your wanting to please God changing? That is what matters. Feelings come and go, they are not always reliable.

Change in Thinking NOT Feelings -> real permanent change.

 

[Soverinth]

G'day there, don't worry too much about the length of your post/s; one suggestion I have though is to separate your paragraphs so it makes it easier for us oldies to read.

Sorry about that, I thought of spacing them just never did it.

My sons are just like you. It seems to be a real boy thing.

They are really addicting But i needed to stop as they are no help to this situation.

That's sort of understandable that you've gone that way, there's no real "need" to do all the standard socializing that comes with going to schools/higher educational institutions. Losing friends as a result is very unfortunate and sounds like a negative side of homeschooling overall.

It was very hard considering they were really good friends but at that time i needed to get my education down otherwise it would have just gotten worse.

Did you go to Church/have other mature Christians to help you grow in your faith? If you had none of that support to help you mature in your faith what happened to you is not at all surprising. By that I mean is returning to old patterns of behaviour and copying friends etc.

Basically what you said, after that event i didn't join a church or anything i just went back to the same way i lived before.

I think that sounds God may have been working on you and you didn't realise it at the time.

At times i do think that. Whether or not he is, i think the reason i'm am trying to seek all this is because God is working on me. Very possible.

Are you looking at your feelings (as your way to assess whether your faith is real or not), OR are you looking at what you believe right now?

I think a little bit of both. Feelings and Faith and What i already know. I know that at first when i found out that there is a big possibility that i'm not saved i got really scared. And i think it's because of that fear i was more worried about just being saved from going to Hell and i should be more focused on enjoying the life Jesus has to offer. I'm trying to get past that fear(Not completely cause i'm well aware it) and trying to seek a life with Christ.

because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” (Romans 10:9-11)

I have confessed a few times i guess that i didn't mean it in my heart well enough because i said it just fine but nothing has changed. Nor have i had an experience of his presence, which in turn would change my heart and mind.

No-one lives up to God's standards.
as it is written:
“None is righteous, no, not one;
no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.” (Romans 3:10-12)
That is why we need faith in JESUS Himself.

Heard this many times, one of the thoughts that goes through my mind every now and then that reminds me that there really isn't anything man can do to save ourselves.

You're taking that way too far. You are a student, that is your job right now.
Did you know that the apostles expected the Christians to work, not beg, and directed the early church/es to make sure people were corrected if they were trying to sponge off other people?[/URL]

Are you absolutely sure that is what i should do? It seems like i should but it's just when i think of abandoning my past life that my current education shouldn't matter.

God is in control of all that, whenever it happens it will happen. Meanwhile we are to do what God has arranged for us.

That is reassuring sort of its just something that pops into my thought process every now and then and it worries me at times.

If every saved person was a pastor or missionary who would be there to spread Christian influence in schools, hospitals, police, shops - society would stop functioning!!!!!

No i understand i just think that if my dad was truly save from what i think he is then i think that this would all be different because my dad doesn't really talk about it at all. No one ever brings it up.

To me it sounds like your Dad is on the right track.... does his life show other signs of being saved? That does not automatically mean an obvious Christian ministry career!!!!

That's just it though, from me paying attention to him, his lifestyle is basically work all day and then come home and just do whatever for an hour or two and then sleep. From that observation, i'm worried that he's not living a life that is guided by Christ himself. Since our religion rarely ever comes up in a conversation, i just worry that they might not be saved.
My dad has told me that he truly believes that "just trying to live a good life believing who and what Jesus is and asking for forgiveness when he sins" will get him to heaven. The problem thought is that just trying to live a good life and asking for be forgiven is not going to grant you heaven. Especially since Repentance does not mean to just ask for forgiveness.

Repentance is: A change in mind. It's to truly be sorry for your sins. Not just feeling bad about it. And the thing is were sinning all the time. Most of the time we don't even know it. Simple evil thoughts are sin. And the only way to true repentance is complete change in heart and the fact that only God can give you the true thought on how bad sin is, i worry that he isn't saved because his life doesn't consist of daily repentance.

P.S. Personally I think you should be typing in the "young Christians" section. I cannot see one word that sounds like you do not already believe in Jesus.

You think so? But I'm not a true Christian so how would that work? Wouldn't i get in trouble writing in a "Christian Only" Thread?


Out of all of that, thank you very much. Your help has eased my worry a little bit. I'm still just trying to understand all of this though.

 

[Soverinth]

I think that is a major part of your problem. You are looking at your feelings not God's promises.

Again the bible says that FAITH IN JESUS is what saves us, not feelings, not experiences, not miracles, not signs and wonders.... [fill in the gaps].

Faith in Jesus saves us, not faith in our faith.

Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. (Hebrews 12:1-2)

Lay down the weight of your worries and insecurities and fears that you don't measure up, lift your eyes up to Jesus.

Don't worry about feelings, feelings may come later, feelings may not. That is up to God.

Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.(Romans 12:2)

Is your thought life changing, your priorities changing, your wanting to please God changing? That is what matters. Feelings come and go, they are not always reliable.

Change in Thinking NOT Feelings -> real permanent change.

^^^That is really making me think...
Almost don't know what to say.

I guess feelings have been a lot of my problem, but surely you can understand why i see feelings as a permit-able thought process. When i watch testimonies of people who experience the presence of God, that is where i get the idea of what is needed. Since i haven't actually felt the presence of God it at times makes me think i am doing something wrong. And then finding out what is wrong is another one of my problems.

There is one thing you should look at when examining your faith:
has your thinking about God changed from when you didn't believe in God?

I can honestly say i don't think there has ever been a time in my life where i consciously didn't believe in God. I've always been taught to believe in him and that he exists so it just kind of stuck this whole time. Before now it was just a thought in the back of my mind. But now that I'm more in depth of all this my thoughts of the way I've been living have changed a lot.

 

[jehoiakim]

clearly you want to accept God. it is a common thing that after people accept him they "backslide" or progress very slowly. Your doubting of your own salvation is common for young believers, I was there, but it took me a while to realize what it really was. it was a spiritual attack from the enemy. Demonic forces are real and they are trying to get you to doubt that you have a relationship with God, they are trying to separate your from God wit ha wedge of guilt.You don't transform into a new person over night and I can tell even by your words and your attempt to control your tongue that you are sincerely wanting to move forward and putting forth effort. I really do believe you are savied if you placed your faith in Christ, acknowledge who he is and as sincerely want him to change your live to reflect him then you are saved. You may want to google verses on assurance they are good to learn when you are being attacked like this. You are also right that it doesn't help wehn you are not around beleivers. Finding a church is hard but if you can even find a few friends, even if they are onlne it is better then nothing. Things of this world like music and movies are not necessarily bad, but they are of the world and a diet of too much of those things can distract your from Gods' truth. I encourage you to find someone whose faith you really respect and ask them to mentor you, to disciple you. It takes time brother and I am going to pray for you right now.... and as for the rapture, honestly until a few hundred years ago almost no one in the church believed the rapture was a separate event from the 2nd coming and it was post-trib so I am pretty sure you won't miss it, I think we will all be here for that, but i do really believe god will seal us and protect us in those days

Peace and blessings to you

 

[hedrick]

New life doesn't mean that you give up all your friends and the activities that mean something to you. It just means that you've got a new boss, Jesus instead of yourself. Things will change, but not overnight.

I worry about not having contact with people. I'm not terribly impressed by a Church that would get a kid to say the sinner's prayer and leave it at that. The sinner's prayer isn't magic. It's one way (and not necessarily the best) to express the fact that you want to follow Jesus. But it's only the start.

I really, really hate churches that give you the impression that you "get saved" and suddenly you get a new life, and that's it. Being a Christian is a way of life. It involves worship, prayer, serving others, and having fun with other Christians. A good youth program will get you started on all of those things.

By the way, Jesus' teachings about judgement don't emphasize whether you sin or not (particularly not the sorts of things that most churches call "sin") so much as whether you bear fruit. By that he meant doing things to show love, i.e. helping people. Of course those actions should be based on the love of God. So prayer and worship are important. But you should spend more of your attention asking what God wants you to do than what he wants you to not do, unless you're doing something fairly dangerous or damaging. It sounds to me like you're being scared by the fact that you haven't become perfect, but that's not the point of being Christian.

Again, new life doesn't mean you stop everything you were doing, just that you have new motivations based on love of God. It doesn't mean dropping your friends, and if games were the way you were making and interacting with friends, you don't want to drop that. At least not without finding better activities and new friends. And it *certainly* doesn't mean stopping your schoolwork. Either you've misunderstood what you're reading and hearing, or you've reading and listening to absolutely the wrong people. Jesus should make your life better, not turn it into a nightmare. And he doesn't want you to drop out of life.

Do you have any idea what you want to do after high school? Home schooling is fine academically, but if you don't take precautions, it can cut you off from other kids. Also, during junior and senior year you start thinking about what comes next, and schools generally have counsellors that help with that. There are ways to deal with these things for home schooling, but I get the impression that you're not. I'd really rather see you move back to a normal school, preferably for Spring.

There are plenty of saved factory workers. One of the basic principles of the Reformation is the priesthood of all believers, whether ministers or janitors. A world with all ministers and missionaries wouldn't work very well.

"If a man is called to be a street sweeper, he should sweep streets even as Michelangelo painted, or Beethoven composed music, or Shakespeare wrote poetry. He should sweep streets so well that all the host of heaven and earth will pause to say, here lived a great street sweeper who did his job well." – Martin Luther King

You might want to pay a bit more attention to your dad, and in fact ask his advice about your situation. Of course no one will save you or your dad other than Jesus. But believing the Gospel, trying to live the way Jesus taught, and repenting when you blow it is a pretty good start at being a Christian. You may find your dad is a better Christian than you think. I admit I'd feel better if your family was at least going to Church. But when you have a job and you're a parent, it's a lot harder to get out and do specifically "Christian" activities. Treating other people at your job right and being a good husband and parent is a large part of what it means for someone like your father to be a Christian. You may be more convinced than your father, and may end up doing more Christian things. But I still think it's worth talking to your dad a bit more and paying more attention to him.

I'm quite concerned about what's happening to you. I'd say you need guidance from Christian adults, but I believe you've been getting advice that is worse than nothing. Please don't listen to people that tell you to drop your friends and stop doing schoolwork. Unfortunately the world is full of legalistic Christians. It sounds to me like that's what you've run into. But I wonder if you're misunderstood. It's better to talk with someone in person than to try and get basic guidance on life from sermons on a web site. It's just too easy to misunderstand what the preacher meant. But ask your parents' guidance on this.

 

[joey_downunder]

I guess feelings have been a lot of my problem, but surely you can understand why i see feelings as a permit-able thought process. When i watch testimonies of people who experience the presence of God, that is where i get the idea of what is needed.

I want you to read this: Saul's (later renamed Paul) conversion Acts 9:1-22, Paul's testimony Acts 26. I can't remember reading any other testimony of conversion like the apostle Paul'sin the New Testament. (If any readers can point to another person's conversion experience then please do).

Q:Where are the apostle Paul's conversion feelings described at all in these passages? If feelings to prove a Christians is truly saved are as important as you seem to think wouldn't Paul have described his feelings in great detail?

Since i haven't actually felt the presence of God it at times makes me think i am doing something wrong. And then finding out what is wrong is another one of my problems.

God ministers to Christians in different ways. Some people are touched mightily by God because they have hit rock-bottom and He truly drags them up out of the pit.

Behold, it was for my welfare
that I had great bitterness;
but in love you have delivered my life
from the pit of destruction,
for you have cast all my sins
behind your back. (Isaiah 38:17)

For others it may be a process and only looking back at their history will show the change/s God has made in their life. God knows how each one of us is "programmed" and what "needs fixing" and will alter circumstances and so on as He wants to do so.

P.S. When you hear or read people's testimony of "sensing the presence of God" - don't jump to conclusions it is always God. Christians need to compare what people say with what the Bible actually says a lot more.

Some people are very impressionable, some people experience these feelings during prolonged worship because of altered consciousness developing via strong hypnotic beat etc. Ectstatic feelings like that can happen for non-believers during music concerts and their favourite sports team winning after all.

 

[Soverinth]

I want to thank you guys so much. You wonderful Wisdom has helped me.

Some points:

So I myself don't think i am saved. I have prayed to God a few times before but i don't know if it was genuine.


I was searching things about salvation and came across a comment someone made to this guy's web post. I truly believe that what this guy is saying is the reason me and many other people who are and are not Christians are not saved.

Here's the comment:

Christians, YOU ARE NOT SAVED.

It is self evident, because God who is the Savior, is not present in your heart. Did He save you and then not introduce Himself? Did He save you but wants to keep you in darkness? He is the light, and darkness cannot be in His presence. Yet it is self evident that you still desire the things of this world (sand) while Jesus offered that which is from a different world (God, who is water).

No. He is not present, and therefore you are not saved. You have misunderstood scripture, due to selfishness.

You apply the message that "salvation is by grace alone" to mean that you don't need to apply the teaching of Jesus Christ "Repent, Forgive" to be saved.

You hypocrites, is it not your works by which you claim to be saved? "I believe, I opened my heart, I brought God into my life, He saved me, He is doing things in my life, I opened my heart o Jesus" Who are you?

Can the weak move the strong? Can the imperfect be more cunning than the perfect? Only God decides if you have followed the scripture, that you confess with your mouth Jesus, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead. You don't even understand these scriptures because you don't apply the teaching of Jesus Christ. You look through the lens of selfishness when you study the Bible.

In selfishness you disobey what God commands even when He showed that He is forgiving. You are still only concerned that you will not receive His wrath. And you think that your confession of Jesus Christ with your mouth is anything but mockery? Jesus came to show us that God is forgiving and you need not be afraid of wrath. Yet still you do not want to know Him. Still you do not want to please Him. Still you want to sin without repentance.

God saves you. So please Him. Do that by trying to follow the teaching "Repent. Forgive". Your fault is that you are trying to enjoy God's property as if it belongs to you, and His servants (your brothers) as if they are your servants.

See it in your actions, be sorry, and you will receive Grace. He is pleased when you do what He said to do. It's not that you are saved by works (your own, which is selfishness), but by Grace, which is His works (which is unselfishness) If master says "servant, do this" should the servant claim the action as his own?

Do not pretend to be a Christian, be a Christian. And certainly do not fool yourself, out of self righteousness, into believing that mile marker 1 on the narrow road is the destination. God will reveal Himself as the Savior when He saves you. Lest you think your Savior is to afraid to show His face. Make your own reason, and fool yourself the more.

God wants you to know Him, be with Him, see Him, but it is your own selfishness which you need saving from, and He does not force you. If you want to be saved, apply the teaching, and you will please Him. This shows Him that you are doing these things because you want to know Him, not because you have to.

And please do not mock Jesus Christ, for He did not die for your sins that you remain dead. He lived and taught that you may have life, and you have chosen death because you are so selfish, and only wish to be saved from sin, rather than know the taste of water.

In Jesus Christ name, and by the power of the holy spirit.
Amen.
Jason Lundy

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd have to say that from reading this it's pretty convincing that i'm not saved. What do you guys think about this comment?

 

[joey_downunder]

I was searching things about salvation and came across a comment someone made to this guy's web post.

No wonder you are feeling worried. That type of post is why you need to learn the bible well. Apparently this person thinks he knows better than the writers of the New Testament and they got it all wrong.
BTW So did the prophet Muhammad (Islam), Joesph Smith (Mormons) and many other false teachers/prophets out there.
I will answer some of these claims via bible verses because....
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work. (2 Timothy 3:16-17)

It is self evident, because God who is the Savior, is not present in your heart.

Create in me a clean heart, O God,
and renew a right spirit within me. (Psalm 51:10)
King David (guilty of adultery) would not have said that if God is not willing to do so.

He is the light, and darkness cannot be in His presence.

because of the tender mercy of our God,
whereby the sunrise shall visit us from on high
to give light to those who sit in darkness and in the shadow of death,
to guide our feet into the way of peace.”(Luke 1:78-79 )

Yet it is self evident that you still desire the things of this world (sand) while Jesus offered that which is from a different world (God, who is water).

1. Listen, my beloved brothers, has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom, which he has promised to those who love him? (James 2:5 ESV)

2. Wrong wrong wrong. This immediately disqualifies someone who sounds like he imagines he is receiving a message from God. Too bad if he calls it a metaphor etc to make excuses for this major blooper. It is misleading.
[Jesus said]" God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” (John 4:24)

No. He is not present, and therefore you are not saved. You have misunderstood scripture, due to selfishness.

Directly contradicts apostle Paul- writer of many books in New Testament. Proves he has not heard from God.
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. (Romans 8:1)

You apply the message that "salvation is by grace alone" to mean that you don't need to apply the teaching of Jesus Christ "Repent, Forgive" to be saved.

Contradicts Jesus now.
"For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” (John 6:40)

I'd have to say that from reading this it's pretty convincing that i'm not saved. What do you guys think about this comment?

Do you get the general picture? He is contradicting all the doctrines of grace.
He is right in that genuine faith should create a change in people's lives though.

Faith in Christ -> changed heart/ good works.

Read your bible, get good beginner's Christian books/websites and make sure you avoid opinion pieces like this condemning writer's like the plague.

 

[hedrick]

I agree with joey_downunder. It's easy to see what has gotten you into the state you're in.

It's very hard to understand the posting that you quote. He says he believes in salvation by grace, but then makes it look like no one has done what they need to do to be saved.

Jesus' teachings about judgement are all based on our actions. The actions are almost entirely things we do for others, helping them, forgiving them, etc. However he seems to see them as a sign of our love. Good trees bear good fruit, and the most important commandment is to love God and our neighbor.

But what are his standards? Even someone giving a cup of cold water to someone will be rewarded. (Mat 10:42) And those who realize that they don't merit salvation and ask God will be forgiven. (Luk 18:10) Jesus says his yoke is light. (Mat 11:29-30) His model of faith is a child.

To me all of this says that salvation isn't something that's impossibly hard. It's supposed to be visible in your life. But God doesn't demand heroic actions. What is wants is people who are honest about their faults and who turn to him. If you do that, he'll accept what you manage to do, just the way parents accept childish efforts from their children as great masterpieces.

Nobody can assess someone else's salvation. Only God can do that. But I think you've already turned to God for help, and I'm sure he'll accept what you manage to do. I'm also confident that over time your life will justify his confidence in you, even if you don't quite believe it. (Remember, in the parable of the sheep and the goats, the sheep are surprised that they've done anything worthwhile.)

 

[Harry3142]

armizer-

Scripture tells us that we are assured of salvation if we accept the sacrifice which God himself accomplished on our behalf:

Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin.

But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished - he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. (Romans 3:19-26,NIV)

The righteousness we need for salvation is a righteousness which we cannot earn through our own actions, and that includes our emotions. Instead, it's a righteousness which we ask God to give us as a gift in exchange for our putting our trust for salvation in what God himself has already done through his Son, Jesus Christ. It is through our accepting what God himself has already accomplished that we have assurance of salvation, rather than its being through our doing the right things, or feeling the right emotions.

Faith itself does not begin as an emotion; it begins as a decision. We make a decision to accept the sacrifice which Jesus Christ performed on our behalf under the direction of God the Father as the source of our salvation. Following our making that decision, there may be no overt emotionalism at all, but that does not negate the decision. And it is that decision to put our trust in what God has done which enables us to obtain the righteousness necessary for eternal life.

 

[oi_antz]

I want to thank you guys so much. You wonderful Wisdom has helped me.

Some points:

So I myself don't think i am saved. I have prayed to God a few times before but i don't know if it was genuine.


I was searching things about salvation and came across a comment someone made to this guy's web post. I truly believe that what this guy is saying is the reason me and many other people who are and are not Christians are not saved.

Here's the comment:

Christians, YOU ARE NOT SAVED.

It is self evident, because God who is the Savior, is not present in your heart. Did He save you and then not introduce Himself? Did He save you but wants to keep you in darkness? He is the light, and darkness cannot be in His presence. Yet it is self evident that you still desire the things of this world (sand) while Jesus offered that which is from a different world (God, who is water).

No. He is not present, and therefore you are not saved. You have misunderstood scripture, due to selfishness.

You apply the message that "salvation is by grace alone" to mean that you don't need to apply the teaching of Jesus Christ "Repent, Forgive" to be saved.

You hypocrites, is it not your works by which you claim to be saved? "I believe, I opened my heart, I brought God into my life, He saved me, He is doing things in my life, I opened my heart o Jesus" Who are you?

Can the weak move the strong? Can the imperfect be more cunning than the perfect? Only God decides if you have followed the scripture, that you confess with your mouth Jesus, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead. You don't even understand these scriptures because you don't apply the teaching of Jesus Christ. You look through the lens of selfishness when you study the Bible.

In selfishness you disobey what God commands even when He showed that He is forgiving. You are still only concerned that you will not receive His wrath. And you think that your confession of Jesus Christ with your mouth is anything but mockery? Jesus came to show us that God is forgiving and you need not be afraid of wrath. Yet still you do not want to know Him. Still you do not want to please Him. Still you want to sin without repentance.

God saves you. So please Him. Do that by trying to follow the teaching "Repent. Forgive". Your fault is that you are trying to enjoy God's property as if it belongs to you, and His servants (your brothers) as if they are your servants.

See it in your actions, be sorry, and you will receive Grace. He is pleased when you do what He said to do. It's not that you are saved by works (your own, which is selfishness), but by Grace, which is His works (which is unselfishness) If master says "servant, do this" should the servant claim the action as his own?

Do not pretend to be a Christian, be a Christian. And certainly do not fool yourself, out of self righteousness, into believing that mile marker 1 on the narrow road is the destination. God will reveal Himself as the Savior when He saves you. Lest you think your Savior is to afraid to show His face. Make your own reason, and fool yourself the more.

God wants you to know Him, be with Him, see Him, but it is your own selfishness which you need saving from, and He does not force you. If you want to be saved, apply the teaching, and you will please Him. This shows Him that you are doing these things because you want to know Him, not because you have to.

And please do not mock Jesus Christ, for He did not die for your sins that you remain dead. He lived and taught that you may have life, and you have chosen death because you are so selfish, and only wish to be saved from sin, rather than know the taste of water.

In Jesus Christ name, and by the power of the holy spirit.
Amen.
Jason Lundy

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd have to say that from reading this it's pretty convincing that i'm not saved. What do you guys think about this comment?

I think this guy is transgressing this commandment:

Matthew 7
“Do not judge others, and you will not be judged. 2 For you will be treated as you treat others.[a] The standard you use in judging is the standard by which you will be judged.

Who is Jason addressing? Everyone who believes in Christ! Hopefully you can see hypocrisy even in your young stage of faith. I also think you need to concentrate on identifying Christ's likeness and begin looking for that represented to you in the people you listen to. In post #8 you were warned that the enemy wants to destroy your life. The enemy hates us bitterly, and nothing makes him more furious than someone who has rejected him and decided to follow Christ. He has a reason to feel this way, so we need to remember caution when making our judgments. But Satan is scriptural, read this:

Revelation 12:12
12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and the sea! For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has a short time.”

This passage declares that Satan has no place in heaven and his time on earth is short. In his short time, he plans to make as many people into God's enemy as he can.

So my message to you is to look for the qualities of peace, love and positive building in the people you learn from. Read the wisdom of Jesus concerning light and dark:

Matthew 6
22 “Your eye is a lamp that provides light for your body. When your eye is good, your whole body is filled with light. 23 But when your eye is bad, your whole body is filled with darkness. And if the light you think you have is actually darkness, how deep that darkness is!

Be wise and ask God for wisdom. Ask Him to speak to you and take His throne upon your heart. Understand what that means, and when you really are prepared to do that, then He will come into your life and make His home with you. That is a promise from Jesus Himself:

Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me.

Read at least one of these books: Matthew, Mark, Luke and John from cover to cover, and then read the book of Acts. That is all you will need to have the armor of God, and before you read, have a silent prayer to the effect: "Dear God, please teach me and guide me as I read. I understand that all wisdom comes from you, and I trust you completely as my mentor and teacher". If you agree with that prayer then He will teach you and you will learn as you read. God speaks through the bible.

Finally, don't give up your whole life to follow what some fellow man has told you. That is how cults work. Instead, concentrate on your relationship with God, and follow what He tells you. He favors wisdom, and He can use your talents. Give your best shot at making the most of your life, because we only get this life once. The more impact you can make for God the better, and this doesn't necessarily mean becoming a pastor, because as others have said, the scope of that vector is very thin. Instead we need to take the message of God to all corners of the earth.

Now, on a more personal topic, you are coming of the age where you will specialize in your career. Have you ever thought of studying video game development? I know that a basic tester will get good pay, but you may even enjoy making games. There is a lot of money in that industry, and it isn't going to die in our generation. Have a think about it, game making takes architects, designers, animators, programmers, testers, producers.. I think if you got a vision for your life you could pull yourself out of that depression pretty quickly without medical assistance. I would recommend you try that first, because medicine can have very negative side effects, and become a wicked dependency.

Anyway, nice to meet you, I hope this has helped you to think of God as a more merciful and loving person than what you have been told by the darkness.

 

[food4thought]

Hello Armizer;

It seems to me that you believe in your heart that Jesus died for your sins and was raised from the dead, and evidently have confessed with your mouth that Jesus is your Lord. Based upon that, I believe you have taken the first steps as a Christian and are now saved by God's grace and mercy.

Now is the time that you will begin to see all the shortcomings in your life, as God convicts you of your sinful lifestyle. Understand that God will work in you to change your lifestyle as you accept what He says, repent, and seek to follow after Him. This change is unlikely to occur all at once, as very few people have the radical instant transformation that the testimonials you have read or watched speak of. Most of us accept Him as our Lord and Savior and then begin a long process of sanctification (becoming more like Christ). Understand that as of right now, if you truly believe, that God sees in you the righteousness of Christ and "there is therefore now no condemnation for those that are in Christ Jesus" (Romans 8:1 NIV) The key for you now is to seek out Godly brothers and sisters to spend your time with, who will help you on your path. I strongly suggest you get in contact with that "last friend" who invited you to that church down the street and start going with him to that church every Sunday... get to know some of the people there.

Finally, you must understand that not everybody who is saved immediately has the same experience of God's pressence that you are speaking of. I was saved for over 6 months before the first time I experienced God's pressence in my heart, and that was when I first entered the church that would become my home church for a long time. Feelings are not meaningless, but they are not EVERYTHING either. You trust in God, trust Him enough to let Him work in you and through you as He sees fit, not as some fundamentalist preacher on the internet thinks. Understand that you are now on a lifelong path/mission to grow in your faith and become more like Christ.

One last thing... as others have stated, your main objective in life right now is to become prepared for the life God has for you. Your schooling is an important part of that, and you should work hard at it so you can support yourself in the life God has for you. Trust Him.

 

[oi_antz]

Dear God, maker of Heaven and Earth, the one who can calm a storm with a word, and the one who brings the dead to life. We are humbled by your majesty and we rejoice in your love, for though we are small and lowly beings, you desire to lift us up and rescue us from death, and you welcome our prayers as we are your very family. We thank you for that.

We come to ask of you that you would invoke upon armizer a sense of thirst for your teaching. We know that you said "I am the true vine", and we know that armizer desires to belong to that vine, yet there are so many who seek to confuse him. We know the struggles he has and we know that you know of them too, so we ask you to break any stronghold that his enemy has against him and stir up in him a desire to learn the truth about what has happened, what you have done, and what is still to happen, that he will be able to know exactly what it means to be Christian.

We know that armizer desires for something, a thirst that has not yet been quenched. We ask for your Holy Spirit to minister to him, and teach him the difference between spirit and emotion. We ask that when he opens your scripture and begins reading the accounts of your people, that your spirit will come to light in his heart, that he will recognize you and fall in love with you, wanting more and more to draw near to you and hear what you want to tell him.

We pray for his peace of mind, because he has been troubled by accusations that he is not saved. Please grant him the knowledge and experience necessary to know that when you make a promise, you will keep it.

So we lift these requests up before you, and ask that you take armizer's destiny under your wing, to come into his life and make yourself known to him, and instruct him for how he can make the most of his time on your precious Earth.

We pray these things through the power offered in the name of Jesus the Christ. Amen.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

Hi,

I read your post. You mentioned you had given up on study to follow the christian life. I would suggest that you go back to study. Jesus wants us to have a full and complete life, he does not want us to give up on life to become a Christian. Very few people are called to the ministry, to be just Christian. Most just have regular jobs, I once had a prophet in the church I attend say God was calling me into the workplace. I have since just worked and provided money from my job for the poor. But my life has experienced many miracles, you can read about them at Know God Personally

 

[salida]

Start reading the bible on your own-there are good online bible studies.

Some sources;

gotquestions.com
CRI | Christian Research Institute, The Bible Answer Man
Sound Bible Doctrine | Christian Apologetics | Bible Doctrine | Sound Bible teach is needed to defend the faith with Spiritual Discernment.
soundreason.com
CrossExamined.org - Frank Turek | Christian Youth are Leaving the Church
CARM - Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry
Always Be Ready (ABR) - Christian Apologetics: Defending Your Faith
The Evidence Bible
Tektonics Design Group - Architecture, Industrial Design, & Custom Fabrication
(bible difficulties)

Feel free to email me-I will help you find a good online bible study source and help you with any questions. Plus, I would try to find a friend to drive to a good christian church until your on your own.

 

[everbecoming2007]

There is a lot of good advice on this thread.

First off, you *may* be clinically depressed and could benefit from professional counseling.

Next, I would challenge this belief in a one time salvation moment. God is beyond time. Conversion is a constant process. We are saved again and again.

Salvation is a gift of grace. There is nothing you can do to earn it. Salvation is not to do but to be. Do not vex yourself. You are already loved and accepted by God.

Change does not happen over night. It is gradual. To change and to realize for yourself that God is love itself you must pray. This is how you can see for yourself that God is already in your life. You do not necessarily need to start off praying hours a day. It takes practice.

Start off praying ten or even five minutes once or twice a day. A great prayer is the Jesus Prayer:

Lord, Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.

Set a timer. Repeat it slowly for five or ten minutes. Pray it throughout the day - while walking, washing dishes, or showering. Let it calm your thoughts. When you have a thought, return to the soothing words of the prayer. Just be with God. God will do the rest. God loves you NOW. God is with you NOW. This prayer will help you know this.

PM me or write a message to my inbox if you need more help. Prayer will not change God - it will change you. God already loves you more than you can love yourself or ever comprehend.