My Ignorant Challenge

[Subduction Zone]

I do not think that you understand what I am saying. Either I am not being clear enough or you do not understand the foundation of scientific thought.

Science is a belief system in that a scientist believes that observations in space time will yield truth statements regarding that space time.

I do not hold to that scientific belief system, I do not believe that observations in space time. Will deliver anything but an ever increasing need for ever more observations and more testing. It is a never ending loop that never really answers the simple questions.

Here is a simple question.

How many stars in the sky?

We are at over two trillion stars and still counting. Will we ever know how many stars are in the sky?

Probably not.

A simple scientific question that cannot be answered.

Here is another simple question.

What is in the center of the earth?

Well we don't really know because we cannot observe it and we cannot use equipment to detect it's structure.

Science will get funding for military research in an abundance, and for medical research because that returns an enormous profit.

Where there is no financial gain from a scientific research then the funding will be non existent.

So we are not really talking about science in a strict ideal sense, rather a commercial form of science.

I really see science as a destructive discipline.

Science ultimately will be responsible for the extinction of life, whether it be nuclear, global warming, a population that exceeds the planets ability to sustain it, e.t.c.

See above post.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Honestly, that's like saying a plane is a type of bicycle because it carries people, it has wheels, is powered, and moves forward.

That sounds like an argument evolutionists might make.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Science is a tool that helps us learn how the world works. If people use the results of that to destroy the world, don't blame the scientists. Blame the society that values short term gain more than long term results.

Scientists fully understand that their "science" will be weaponized, either against people or the earth. They are not innocent. They are 'lap dogs' to the industrial complex.

What is sad is that they know how to use science to save both the people and the earth, but have sold their souls to the destroyers of both.

 

[Astrophile]

These new results suggest that our current understanding of physics is inadequate and that something important is missing. One possible explanation might be that the acceleration might be due to an increase in the density of dark energy. An alternative explanation might be that dark matter interacts more strongly with ordinary matter than previously thought. A less exciting explanation could be that there are “unknown unknowns” in the data caused by systematic effects and that a more careful analysis may one day reveal a subtle effect that has been overlooked. (zmescience.com)

All of this is quite plausible. However, if it is true that our current understanding of physics is inadequate, it doesn't mean that the universe is not expanding, or that it didn't begin in a very high-temperature and very high-density state, or that it is not about 14 billion years old. When Newton's theory of gravitation turned out to be inadequate and was replaced by Einstein's general theory of relativity, it didn't change the fact that planets, comets and binary stars move in elliptical orbits, and that apples fall off of trees.

You are willing to accept the scientific evidence that there is a real disparity between the value of the Hubble constant derived from Cepheid variables and the value derived from the cosmic microwave background. So what other scientific evidence are you willing to accept? For example, do you accept the geological time-scale, the validity of radiometric dating, and the distance of the Virgo cluster of galaxies (about 55 million light-years), and, if not, why not?

 

[Astrophile]

Here is a simple question.

How many stars in the sky?

We are at over two trillion stars and still counting. Will we ever know how many stars are in the sky?

Probably not.

A simple scientific question that cannot be answered.

It is estimated that there are 100 to 400 billion, or 0.1 to 0.4 trillion, stars in the Milky Way - Milky Way - Wikipedia.

It is more difficult, although not impossible, to estimate the number of stars in the whole universe. According to How Many Stars Are In The Universe? there may be between 2 and 10 trillion galaxies in the observable universe and 100-200 billion stars per galaxy, yielding a total of between 10^23 and 10^24 stars, or nearly a trillion trillion.

According to Observable universe - Wikipedia , the mass of ordinary matter in the observable universe is about 1.45×10^53 kg. Since the mass of the Sun is 1.99×10^30 kg, this is about 7.3×10^22 solar masses. Since most stars are red dwarfs with M ~ 0.1-0.5 solar masses, this again yields between 10^23 and 10^24 stars.

You see, then, that the question is not unanswerable, although it is only fairly recently that astronomers have obtained the observations that are necessary to enable them to answer the question.

 

[Kylie]

That sounds like an argument evolutionists might make.

So if you think it's such a rubbish argument, why are you using the exact same logic?

 

[Kylie]

Scientists fully understand that their "science" will be weaponized, either against people or the earth. They are not innocent. They are 'lap dogs' to the industrial complex.

What is sad is that they know how to use science to save both the people and the earth, but have sold their souls to the destroyers of both.

Citation needed.

 

[klutedavid]

It is estimated that there are 100 to 400 billion, or 0.1 to 0.4 trillion, stars in the Milky Way - Milky Way - Wikipedia.

It is more difficult, although not impossible, to estimate the number of stars in the whole universe. According to How Many Stars Are In The Universe? there may be between 2 and 10 trillion galaxies in the observable universe and 100-200 billion stars per galaxy, yielding a total of between 10^23 and 10^24 stars, or nearly a trillion trillion.

According to Observable universe - Wikipedia , the mass of ordinary matter in the observable universe is about 1.45×10^53 kg. Since the mass of the Sun is 1.99×10^30 kg, this is about 7.3×10^22 solar masses. Since most stars are red dwarfs with M ~ 0.1-0.5 solar masses, this again yields between 10^23 and 10^24 stars.

You see, then, that the question is not unanswerable, although it is only fairly recently that astronomers have obtained the observations that are necessary to enable them to answer the question.

Are you assuming a finite universe?

 

[Kylie]

Are you assuming a finite universe?

Tantalising evidence hints Universe is finite

 

[klutedavid]

Tantalising evidence hints Universe is finite

The end of the article you linked states.

"Cornish says his team believes it has already ruled out almost half of the possible small-Universe shapes – including football and doughnut shapes – and he suspects the work will probably turn up nothing, meaning that the Universe is either very large or infinite."

 

[Kylie]

The end of the article you linked states.

"Cornish says his team believes it has already ruled out almost half of the possible small-Universe shapes – including football and doughnut shapes – and he suspects the work will probably turn up nothing, meaning that the Universe is either very large or infinite."

Yeah, himn suspecting something is not evidence. In any case, my post was in response to you suggesting that the assumption of a finite universe was unwarranted. With our current knowledge, such an assumption is no more unwarranted than the assumption that it is infinite.

 

[Astrophile]

Are you assuming a finite universe?

The observable universe, which comprises all the matter that can be observed from Earth, is finite, and my estimates were for the number of the stars that it contains. However, the observable universe is only a very small part of the entire universe - Observable universe - Wikipedia ; however, we do not know whether the universe as a whole (beyond the observable horizon) is infinite or finite but unbounded, or, if it is finite, how large it is. In any case, the entire universe contains many more than the 10^23 to 10^24 stars that are estimated to exist in the observable universe.