My heart is like a stone

[TenthAveN]

...wisdom is not gained by reading proverbs, but by fearing God.

Without the fear of God, the very gospel itself is without meaning...

This fear of punishment, is not the fear of God.

I must ask you directly, did you ever fear God?

I think the fear of punishment brings on a fear of God. I experienced peace for a while after rededicating my life, but then the joy left, and I became anxious. Perhaps in that time of joy I revered and loved Him, but if I did, it was short lived. I fear God now by human definition.

 

[Religiot]

I think the fear of punishment brings on a fear of God. I experienced peace for a while after rededicating my life, but then the joy left, and I became anxious. Perhaps in that time of joy I revered and loved Him, but if I did, it was short lived. I fear God now by human definition.

I really don't know what you mean by that.
Please elaborate.

 

[TenthAveN]

I really don't know what you mean by that.
Please elaborate.

The human definition of fear is “an unpleasant emotion caused by the belief that someone or something is dangerous, likely to cause pain, or a threat.” Thats the fear of God I experience. About 2 years ago, I rededicated my life because I felt called. After that, I felt joy and peace, and maybe then I feared God as in reverence and love. However, when the joy went away, the fear of the Lord went away. It was replaced by the fear described above.

 

[aiki]

I do fear God, but not in the way Solomon talks about. It’s a fear of punishment, which is a result of the self-seeking nature. I’ve asked God for the proper fear of the Lord that leads to wisdom. I’ve asked for true godly sorrow and repentance for many months. I can’t help but feel that God was disciplining me, and I couldn’t handle it. I even fell into willful sin for a while, only broken up by fear that I would be left behind. I constantly wonder if I’ve fallen away from the faith, and that I can’t be brought back to repentance.

Lots of looking at yourself. You can't become more like Christ, by this means.

2 Corinthians 3:17-18
17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as from the Lord, the Spirit.

 

[Religiot]

The human definition of fear is “an unpleasant emotion caused by the belief that someone or something is dangerous, likely to cause pain, or a threat.” Thats the fear of God I experience. About 2 years ago, I rededicated my life because I felt called. After that, I felt joy and peace, and maybe then I feared God as in reverence and love. However, when the joy went away, the fear of the Lord went away. It was replaced by the fear described above.

You have confused several worldly (including theological) definitions with what God plainly says:

THE LORD KEEPS IT SIMPLE

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." --Matthew 10:28

He says nothing of a threat--that would be absurd--for only people or animals are reduced to making threats: God speaks reality into being, so when He says I'm gonna destroy you, and in a horrible way, then that's just what's gonna happen, period. Moreover, God is not dangerous, people and animals are, but God is not: He is sovereign, the only true sovereign in existence, thus, He is dreadful. And lastly, if pain is the concern, then you've greatly misunderstood, for God is not talking about hurting those who hate Him, but destroying them, shamefully, and utterly--the horrible pain ought to be the least of your concerns, for it is the destruction that remains, not the pain.

The case of the Jewish young men, who obeyed the Lord not to fear man, but God, is a great example that quickly illustrates the point:

SHADRACH, MESHACH, AND ABED-NEGO

"Then Nebuchadnezzar in his rage and fury commanded to bring Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed–nego. Then they brought these men before the king. Nebuchadnezzar spake and said unto them, Is it true, O Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed–nego, do not ye serve my gods, nor worship the golden image which I have set up? Now if ye be ready that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the image which I have made; well: but if ye worship not, ye shall be cast the same hour into the midst of a burning fiery furnace; and who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands? Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed–nego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter. If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king. But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up." --Daniel 3:13-18

Fear God, therefore, in the way He commands; only then will you begin to understand.

 

[TenthAveN]

You have confused several worldly (including theological) definitions with what God plainly says:

THE LORD KEEPS IT SIMPLE

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." --Matthew 10:28

He says nothing of a threat--that would be absurd--for only people or animals are reduced to making threats: God speaks reality into being, so when He says I'm gonna destroy you, and in a horrible way, then that's just what's gonna happen, period. Moreover, God is not dangerous, people and animals are, but God is not: He is sovereign, the only true sovereign in existence, thus, He is dreadful. And lastly, if pain is the concern, then you've greatly misunderstood, for God is not talking about hurting those who hate Him, but destroying them, shamefully, and utterly--the horrible pain ought to be the least of your concerns, for it is the destruction that remains, not the pain.

The case of the Jewish young men, who obeyed the Lord not to fear man, but God, is a great example that quickly illustrates the point:

SHADRACH, MESHACH, AND ABED-NEGO

"Then Nebuchadnezzar in his rage and fury commanded to bring Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed–nego. Then they brought these men before the king. Nebuchadnezzar spake and said unto them, Is it true, O Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed–nego, do not ye serve my gods, nor worship the golden image which I have set up? Now if ye be ready that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the image which I have made; well: but if ye worship not, ye shall be cast the same hour into the midst of a burning fiery furnace; and who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands? Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed–nego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter. If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king. But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up." --Daniel 3:13-18

Fear God, therefore, in the way He commands; only then will you begin to understand.

I understand that I have a distorted view of God and fear. I’ve heard that He loves the sinner and hates the sin, and that he hates the sinner and hates the sin. I’ve heard that you can’t truly repent without godly sorrow, and I’ve heard that you only have to confess and turn from your sins, and believe in Christ. I’ve heard that God chooses us, we choose God, or that it’s both at the same time. Does God love me or does He hate me? Do I really have the choice to follow Him, or do I have to be chosen first? There’s so many interpretations of what the Bible says, so much false doctrine nowadays, no wonder there’s so much anxiety and depression, and so much fear of hell.

I’m not saying fear of hell is a bad thing, but it’s certainly not what should motivate us, and it is ultimately our fault if we don’t believe the truth. How do we fear the Lord in the right way?

 

[Kenneth Moore]

Why, when I think about following Jesus, do I get this churning feeling in my chest that feels like my very heart is saying no? I hate it, and it scares me. I don’t want to be opposed to Jesus, and yet it feels like I don’t even care. I’ve asked God to help me to want to follow Jesus, and to want to do good instead of evil. I feel so evil inside.

Hey TenthAveN,
What you are feeling is totally normal. Naturally we are born against God and want nothing to do with Him. The bible says "the carnal mind is enmity (Hatred) against God" - Romans 8:7. The carnal mind is your natural mind. It will never be in harmony with God. What you need is a new mind. This is what David prayed for when he said "Create in me a clean heart (mind), O God; and renew a right spirit within me." - Psalms 51:10

Now how does God create a new heart in us that will cause us to want to serve Him? The same way He creates everything - Through His WORD -

"The Word was with God, and the Word was God....All things were made by him" - John 1:1,3

It is by spending quality time in His written Word every day that a new heart will be created in you. This will give you a desire to follow God and do what is right.

God Bless,
Kenneth

 

[aiki]

I understand that I have a distorted view of God and fear. I’ve heard that He loves the sinner and hates the sin, and that he hates the sinner and hates the sin. I’ve heard that you can’t truly repent without godly sorrow, and I’ve heard that you only have to confess and turn from your sins, and believe in Christ. I’ve heard that God chooses us, we choose God, or that it’s both at the same time. Does God love me or does He hate me? Do I really have the choice to follow Him, or do I have to be chosen first? There’s so many interpretations of what the Bible says, so much false doctrine nowadays, no wonder there’s so much anxiety and depression, and so much fear of hell.

What does the Bible say? It is actually very clear, despite the clouding contortions of some:

1 John 4:16-19
16 We have come to know and have believed the love which God has for us. God is love, and the one who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.
17 By this, love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment; because as He is, so also are we in this world.
18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.
19 We love, because He first loved us.

John 3:16-17
16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

2 Peter 3:9
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Repentance is, at its core, a change of mind (which, if its real, results in a change of course, of living). We see God repenting more than anyone else in the OT. But He isn't mourning over His sin; He's merely changing His mind about something. When you change your mind, your thinking about yourself, and God, and your relationship to Him, the result may be tears, it may be sorrow over your sin, but most importantly, it will result in a change of course, a change in your conduct. That's the real test of the reality of your repentance. Tears are relatively easy to shed, but a changed mind and life are another thing entirely.

It isn't really that the myriad interpretations of Scripture have produce depression and anxiety but that so many are not studying the Bible for themselves in a reasoned, careful way and knowing for themselves what it says. It is ignorance of the truth that is leading so many to depression and anxiety, not the proliferation of interpretations of Scripture. Paul had to deal with such interpretations in the very first stages of the life of the Church but he was clear that there was an essential, fundamental and single core of doctrines upon which the Christian faith rests. These you can know and be sure of. But only as you make yourself a careful, well-reasoning student of God's word. So long as you get all your "truth" about Christianity "pre-chewed," you'll find yourself "at sea" about what it says.

I’m not saying fear of hell is a bad thing, but it’s certainly not what should motivate us, and it is ultimately our fault if we don’t believe the truth. How do we fear the Lord in the right way?

By respecting who He is, which rests upon properly knowing who He is which, in turn, relies upon you knowing the special revelation of Him in Scripture (and secondarily in Creation and in the "law of God written on your heart.")

 

[Religiot]

I understand that I have a distorted view of God and fear. I’ve heard that He loves the sinner and hates the sin, and that he hates the sinner and hates the sin. I’ve heard that you can’t truly repent without godly sorrow, and I’ve heard that you only have to confess and turn from your sins, and believe in Christ. I’ve heard that God chooses us, we choose God, or that it’s both at the same time. Does God love me or does He hate me? Do I really have the choice to follow Him, or do I have to be chosen first? There’s so many interpretations of what the Bible says, so much false doctrine nowadays, no wonder there’s so much anxiety and depression, and so much fear of hell.

I’m not saying fear of hell is a bad thing, but it’s certainly not what should motivate us, and it is ultimately our fault if we don’t believe the truth. How do we fear the Lord in the right way?

Fear of God is intuitive, which results solely from the realization of who He is.

Fear of Hell is not the motivation, for hell is just destruction--tho many false doctrines of what hell is prevail, it is manifest, that God only gives immortality to His children; thus the idea that everyone is immortal, apart from God's say so, is immediately absurd when compared to what God actually says.

No, it is the love of God that motivates those who are His: this is only possible after being born again, which is only attainable by repentance, which can only come from fear.

Many did love God, prior to Christ, but now that the Spirit is poured out to all, one must be born again: that is the new covenant.

Salvation remains the same, from the beginning, obey God, in all that He says--when you mess up, go to the priest, and pay for your sins: none of that is new, but it is, now, concentrated in Christ, and imparted to those born of His Spirit. --Now, I am a priest, and the temple, and Christ Himself dwells in me, and the life that I now live is simply to glorify Him in all that I do; and when I mess up, there is grace, for Christ already paid.

By His grace I live, and by the same others are given opportunity to learn to fear.

You have been given opportunity to learn to fear, by His grace.

God is well aware that Satan has sent a flood after His Church, so He has provided reprieve, by His grace, for all to learn to fear, rightly: this is done by rejecting man-made theologies, and simply obeying all that God has already said.

Obedience to Him first requires belief in Him, belief in Him, first requires realization that He is; that realization requires understanding, that understanding can only come from fear; and thus the circle is complete.

Mix pride into it, and the circuit breaks: pride prevents the fear of God, but allows for the fear of man. Pride is the deepest of delusions.

 

[SANTOSO]

Santoso, I honestly don’t know if I’ve ever loved Jesus at all. Probably a year ago or less I asked God to make me poor, because I am rich, compared to other people who have it so much worse than I do. So yes, I asked to be made poor, but I didn’t expect it in this form. I’m not blaming God for my condition, rather, I can blame myself. Legalism resulted in depression, among other mental illnesses. If only I had just trusted.

Then come brother to trust in the love of Jesus Christ that the same He had offered Mary Magdalena ; He is offering to you.

Yes, just trust in the steadfast love of Christ.

When Mary Magdalena trusted in the love of Christ despite that she was ridiculed and shamed because she was known to many as sinner — it didn’t bother her why. Because she knew that she found acceptance and grace in His sight despite her weaknesses, guilt, shame and condemnation. To her, she has not found such love ! such grace ! ever before. Her heart are just filled with gratitude toward the mercy that our Lord have shown her. That is why Mary Magdalena take hold of His love and never let it go.

And she gained a worthy testimony of Christ our King that she loved much.

I must tell you brother that we should follow in her footsteps to love our Lord much.

 

[kvolm]

He says to trust in Jesus rather than what I can do, but there’s still things I’m unsure about doing. I hope it’s a solution provided by God, otherwise I’ve just been sinning against my conscience this whole time.

What I meant to ask was whether you are considering doing the prescribed therapy?

 

[kvolm]

What I meant to ask was if you are considering doing the prescribed therapy?

 

[TenthAveN]

What I meant to ask was if you are considering doing the prescribed therapy?

I’ve tried doing it. My restrictions on food are down a lot. I’m still restricting other entertainment things like professional sports, video games, and the like. I cut down on video games because in addicted easily. I don’t drink because I don’t want to run the risk of getting drunk. Etc.

 

[TenthAveN]

Yesterday, for my daily reading, I read Deuteronomy 30, in which God told the Israelites to choose life. Deuteronomy 30:17-18. It feels like God was giving me one final choice. I thought it would be different, and that I would tell my coworkers about Jesus, but I was a coward again.

I remember toward the end of my quarantine I started to feel sick, and I feel like I possibly made a vow (I don’t know if I did, but I had thoughts like “if God spares me from COVID, I will do His will”. Again, I was too cowardly, and now I feel more cut off from Him than ever before.

 

[tturt]

Sorry that you're struggling. Wondering if you had a chance to look at post #41?

 

[SANTOSO]

Yesterday, for my daily reading, I read Deuteronomy 30, in which God told the Israelites to choose life. Deuteronomy 30:17-18. It feels like God was giving me one final choice. I thought it would be different, and that I would tell my coworkers about Jesus, but I was a coward again.

I remember toward the end of my quarantine I started to feel sick, and I feel like I possibly made a vow (I don’t know if I did, but I had thoughts like “if God spares me from COVID, I will do His will”. Again, I was too cowardly, and now I feel more cut off from Him than ever before.

Dear brother,
You must consider where cowardly attitude comes from. Yes, no other than fear.
A coward is lower rank demon than fear.

If you are reading Deuteronomy 30 and find God gives you grace to choose life ! Who in the right mind would pass off such an gracious offer ?

Dear brother, you are not a coward. Only a wicked spirit of coward will reaffirm that.
Don’t trust your thoughts and feelings of cowardice; they are not of you.

If they are of you! Why God would need to trouble Himself to change you?

If God see a wicked spirit of cowardice, God would not tell him to change him; what for !

For you that mattter, choose what God believe is good for you.
God bless you.

 

[kvolm]

I’ve tried doing it. My restrictions on food are down a lot. I’m still restricting other entertainment things like professional sports, video games, and the like. I cut down on video games because in addicted easily. I don’t drink because I don’t want to run the risk of getting drunk. Etc.

Since all change is a process over time, I'm sure these will work in conjunction with the Holy Spirit's internal work to bring about the desired transformation from old self to new self!