My great great granfather was not a monkey!!!!!

[Jan87676]

Well, from what I know, my grandfather wasn't a monkey. We have a common ancestor with monkeys. Creationists are right, your grandfather was not a friggin' monkey.

 

[meebs]

on another forum i am a monkey

in fact - i havent really told any of you but i will finally admit it - i am a monkey

 

[KAG]

Morning has broken
Like the first morning
Blackbird has spoken
Like the first bird

Praise for the singing
Praise for the morning
Praise for them springing
Fresh from the world

Sweet, the rain's new fall
Sunlit from heaven
Like the first dew fall
On the first grass

Praise for the sweetness
Of the wet garden
Sprung in completeness
Where His feet pass

Mine is the sunlight
Mine is the morning
Born of the one light
Eden say play

Praise with elation
Praise ev'ry morning
God's recreation of the new day

Morning has broken
Like the first morning
Blackbird has spoken
Like the first bird

Praise for the singing
Praise for the morning
Praise for them springing
Fresh from the world
(Words by Eleanor Farjeon; Musical Adaptation by Cat Stevens)

 

[Aron-Ra]

Well, from what I know, my grandfather wasn't a monkey. We have a common ancestor with monkeys. Creationists are right, your grandfather was not a friggin' monkey.

I have to disagree. If all humans are monkeys now, our grandparents had to be monkeys too, right?

The important question is; what is a monkey? The answer is that it is any member of the primate sub-order Haplorhini.

 

[Lignoba]

We are not monkeys. Monkeys have tails and do not have opposable thmbs. We are apes.

 

[Aron-Ra]

We are not monkeys. Monkeys have tails and do not have opposable thmbs. We are apes.

Wrong. Even among just the animals you would accept as monkeys, they do have opposable thumbs, and many of them do not have tails.

If you're going to define a group of anything, you have to define it by the characters common to every member of that group. And you can't do that with monkeys without describing apes too. And you can't describe the traits common to all apes without describing people at the same time.

Read the link I gave you which defines Haplorhini precisely, and you'll better understand what I mean.

 

[john crawford]

I have to disagree. If all humans are monkeys now, our grandparents had to be monkeys too, right?

Only the grandparents of humans like neo-Darwinist race theorists who claim to be monkeys themselves could possibly be classified as monkeys also, since the grandparents of all Jews, Christians and Muslims who claim to be descended from one of Noah's three sons were just as human as all of Noah's other human ancestors and descendents were.

 

[john crawford]

We are not monkeys. Monkeys have tails and do not have opposable thmbs. We are apes.

According to self-identified neo-Darwinist monkeys though, apes are monkeys too.

 

[Aron-Ra]

Only the grandparents of humans like neo-Darwinist race theorists who claim to be monkeys themselves could possibly be classified as monkeys also, since the grandparents of all Jews, Christians and Muslims who claim to be descended from one of Noah's three sons were just as human as all of Noah's other human ancestors and descendents were.

Then we still come to the central question, (which creationists will never adequately answer) what is a monkey?

 

[john crawford]

If you're going to define a group of anything, you have to define it by the characters common to every member of that group. And you can't do that with monkeys without describing apes too. And you can't describe the traits common to all apes without describing people at the same time.

Right, and you can't describe the traits common to all animals like rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures without describing some people at the same time.

Read the link I gave you which defines Haplorhini precisely, and you'll better understand what I mean.

Yes, I did, and I understand you much better now.

 

[john crawford]

Then we still come to the central question, (which creationists will never adequately answer) what is a monkey?

Let's see. A monkey is what neo-Darwinists make themselves and their grandparents out of.

 

[gluadys]

Right, and you can't describe the traits common to all animals like rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures without describing some people at the same time.

Not just some people. All people. All people are amniotes, just like rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures.

 

[john crawford]

Not just some people. All people. All people are amniotes, just like rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures.

Are you equating or just comparing people like Abraham, Moses, Buddha, Jesus and Mohammed to rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures?

 

[Grengor]

Are you equating or just comparing people like Abraham, Moses, Buddha, Jesus and Mohammed to rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures?

Equating? No.
Amniotic relationship? Yes.

 

[Grummpy]

Are you equating or just comparing people like Abraham, Moses, Buddha, Jesus and Mohammed to rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures?

Of course not, snakes and vultures are not mammals, all the rest apply though. As are dogs, cats, gorillas, monkeys and even Neanderthal Noah.

Grumpy

 

[john crawford]

Equating? No.
Amniotic relationship? Yes.

What sort of relationship is that? Is it ordained and sanctioned by God or just the typical relationship neo-Darwinist race theorists have got themselves into from time immemorial?

 

[john crawford]

Of course not, snakes and vultures are not mammals, all the rest apply though.

If you read other people's posts properly, you would know that I was referring to animals, not just mammals like you.

 

[Aron-Ra]

you can't describe the traits common to all apes without describing people at the same time.

Right, and you can't describe the traits common to all animals like rats, pigs, snakes, skunks, weasels and vultures without describing some people at the same time.

Exactly. That's why we're animals. But more than that, all the animals you just listed are amniotes also, and so are we.

 

[Aron-Ra]

Then we still come to the central question, (which creationists will never adequately answer) what is a monkey?

Let's see. A monkey is what neo-Darwinists make themselves and their grandparents out of.

See? I told creationists won't answer that question!

 

[john crawford]

Exactly. That's why we're animals. But more than that, all the animals you just listed are amniotes also, and so are we.

Yes, but once we arrive at the primate order, a creationist subset of that order will put humans in a mammalian taxonomic class and family of their own order even though we still share a few special physical traits with other primates in their families.