My AV1611VET Challenge

[Nathan Poe]

I'm confused, [serious]. How so, what? Is there something I can clear up? I don't understand what you're getting at.

If everyone took the Bible like atheists do, there would be no United States of America.

What's so hard to understand?

All of it, for starters -- there's absolutely no logic or basis in reality offered in your statement here.

 

[Allegory]

but that's assuming that something has to be correct to be believed by groups of people. I don't think AV is arguing that. At least not without explaining why so many people believe things he thinks are false.

I have no idea what he's even talking about. I was just throwing it out there.

 

[flatworm]

Other parts of the Bible would make no sense.

Example:

[bible]Genesis 3:19[/bible]

Why can't this be understood in a metaphorical sense?

 

[TheManeki]

Christianity is founded on the truth that man's rebellion separated man from GOD and that GOD saved man HIMSELF, so that whosoever will believe maybe reunited with GOD. If the rebellion was not real then sin is not real and there is nothing to be saved from....

"The fall" is simply the first of many attempts in the Bible to explain why suffering exists. See also the Book of Job.

 

[Gremlins]

For one thing, the United States of America wouldn't exist.

What? The USA was founded on decidedly unchristian principles like democracy and freedom of speech (and dodging imperial taxes). Good Christians don't rebel agains their God given government.

 

[jamielindas]

What? The USA was founded on decidedly unchristian principles like democracy and freedom of speech (and dodging imperial taxes). Good Christians don't rebel agains their God given government.

I'm not sure I agree with this totally, but I knew what you were going for.

It drives me nuts when people say this was a Christian Nation because it isn't true. It is, however, true, albeit slightly misleading to say that this country was founded on christian values. That is to say, the values of respect, compassion, individuality, individual worth, individual rights, but these are not the property of christians and they do overlap with the values of many different belief systems.
Many of our founding fathers were believers, though many of them were not fundamentalists, and many were only deists. They did believe in a creator and they did believe the rights of humanity had origins in the divine. However, the did NOT feel this had anything to do with an effective government. They felt, despite having belief in some divinity, that government and its duty to the people were secular and shouldn't be encumbered or dependent on the beliefs of its people.

 

[Inan3]

Logical progression from your post, AV:

Why does it matter if the Bible doesn't make sense?

Spoken as a true Catholic!!!

 

[lemmings]

You mean JERUSALEM?

What about Russia? Several of the letters in its name can be found in the word Jerusalem.

 

[POSW]

Edit: I meant to quote Inan3's post here, but this website's quoting mechanism confuses me.

Oy vey. I'm pretty sure that the question was either rhetorical or Socratic - it was intended to lead somewhere.

I think I'll try to complete the line of questioning -

"Why does it matter if the Bible doesn't make sense?

Because then people wouldn't believe in Christianity.

Why does it matter if people don't believe in Christianity?

Because then everyone would go to Hell.

Where does it say that?

In the Bible.

And why should we believe the Bible?"

And around and around and around we go. Hurray for circular logic.

 

[[serious]]

I'm confused, [serious]. How so, what? Is there something I can clear up? I don't understand what you're getting at.

If everyone took the Bible like atheists do, there would be no United States of America.

What's so hard to understand?

I'm asking you to show why there would be no United States of America if everyone took the Bible like atheists do.

 

[Nathan45]

Edit: I meant to quote Inan3's post here, but this website's quoting mechanism confuses me.

The quickest way to quote someone, is to hit the quick quote button. It'l teleport you to the quick reply button. Make sure the "Quote message in reply?" button is checked. You can then type something and hit reply, and it'll post their post in quotes, then your post after.

Or you can hit "Go advanced" and make a more detailed post.

 

[Nathan45]

I'm asking you to show why there would be no United States of America if everyone took the Bible like atheists do.

Chaos theory?

 

[AV1611VET]

What about Russia? Several of the letters in its name can be found in the word Jerusalem.

JERUSALEM consists of nine letters --- with USA right in the middle.

JERUSALEM
​

 

[lemmings]

JERUSALEM consists of nine letters --- with USA right in the middle.

JERUSALEM
​

So? It's not like the word is a palindrome. If anything, Russia is ahead of us.

 

[Assyrian]

JERUSALEM consists of nine letters --- with USA right in the middle.

JERUSALEM
​

I would be more worried about the way it ends up JERUSALEM

 

[AV1611VET]

I would be more worried about the way it ends up JERUSALEM

Peace?

Salem = Peace

A common Jewish greeting is "Shalom" - (peace).

To which the reply is, "Shalom Shalom" - (perfect peace).

 

[Nathan Poe]

Peace?

Salem = Peace

A common Jewish greeting is "Shalom" - (peace).

To which the reply is, "Shalom Shalom" - (perfect peace).

Ironic, isn't it?

 

[AV1611VET]

Ironic, isn't it?

Yes --- Jerusalem --- city of peace --- has seen anything but peace.

And won't --- until the Prince of Peace comes.

 

[Nathan Poe]

Yes --- Jerusalem --- city of peace --- has seen anything but peace.

Salem had its own less-than-peaceful history as well.

You might say that it's unfair to judge a place based on one embarassing incident in its history, and you'd be right -- but nobody said history was fair.

And won't --- until the Prince of Peace comes.

Funny thing about Salem -- its peace came when the religious hysteria subsided and cooler, more rational heads prevailed.

One would think that we'd have learned a lesson from that -- but nobody said history was fair.

 

[AV1611VET]

Salem had its own less-than-peaceful history as well.

You might say that it's unfair to judge a place based on one embarassing incident in its history, and you'd be right -- but nobody said history was fair.



Funny thing about Salem -- its peace came when the religious hysteria subsided and cooler, more rational heads prevailed.

One would think that we'd have learned a lesson from that -- but nobody said history was fair.

What are you talking about? Salem, Massachusetts?

[bible]Hebrews 7:1-2[/bible]

Are you okay?