My Alcohol Challenge

AV1611VET · Apr 20, 2015

Elendur said:
I see no mention of sin.

Smoking is not a sin either, is it?

And it has less Biblical support than drinking.

AV1611VET · Apr 20, 2015

TLK Valentine said:
No, drinking excessively is a sin.

Two waterpots of six firkins apiece come to 72 - 108 gallons of wine.

Split Rock · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
I believe Jesus is the One here being accused of turning water into scientist-wine.

Yes, I believe they drank alcoholic wine at wedding celebrations, but when Jesus supplied the wine, it was of the non-alcoholic type.

My KJV1611 perfect Bible says it was "wine," therefore it was wine not grape juice. Just like "unicorn" is a unicorn and bats are "fowl."

Subduction Zone · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Because drinking is a sin.

Wrong. Excessive drinking to the point of drunkenness was thought to be a sin. Drinking itself was quite well accepted and Jesus drank wine with alcohol. Wine was not grape juice. Grape juice would not keep in those days without refrigeration, wine would since ethyl alcohol is a preservative.

Here is just one of the many articles that explain how wine was commonly consumed in Biblical times:

https://www.gci.org/series/alcohol/bible

As usual the Bible is against excess, not against the product itself. Just as the Bible is not against sex, though a surprising number of Christians here act as if it is. Nor is it against eating food. Yet it is against gluttony. It is the excesses that the Bible rails against, it is not against moderation.

And speaking of moderation I have a replica of a wooden sign from an old bar in New England. It simply says "Temperance". That did not mean at that time "Don't Drink" it simply meant "Don't over do it".

Split Rock · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Proverbs 20:1 Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.

I believe it was common to mix wine with water at the time, therefore, it would not be considered "strong drink," if it was drunk in the usual manner.

PsychoSarah · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Smoking is not a sin either, is it?

And it has less Biblical support than drinking.

The bible doesn't ok TV either, or computers, etc. Just because smoking doesn't have a special mention doesn't make it a sin.

contango · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Smoking is not a sin either, is it?

And it has less Biblical support than drinking.

I don't see any Biblical support for eating a nice slice of Black Forest Gateau. Maybe all those lovely patisseries are doing the work of the devil.

Elendur · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Smoking is not a sin either, is it?

I wouldn't know.

AV1611VET said:
And it has less Biblical support than drinking.

Not my fault that you're not literal.

AV1611VET · Apr 20, 2015

Split Rock said:
My KJV1611 perfect Bible says it was "wine," therefore it was wine not grape juice. Just like "unicorn" is a unicorn and bats are "fowl."

Does your perfect KJV1611 have the term "grape juice" in It?

If not, perhaps the term came along later to differentiate non-alcoholic wine from alcoholic wine?

Kinda like saying "berries" all the time, until the terms "raspberries" and "blue berries" were coined.

bhsmte · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Does your perfect KJV1611 have the term "grape juice" in It?

If not, perhaps the term came along later to differentiate non-alcoholic wine from alcoholic wine?

Kinda like saying "berries" all the time, until the terms "raspberries" and "blue berries" were coined.

AV, is this whole thing, because you can't bring yourself to believe Jesus was ok with people consuming real wine?

AV1611VET · Apr 20, 2015

bhsmte said:
AV, is this whole thing, because you can't bring yourself to believe Jesus was ok with people consuming real wine?

Drinking is a sin.

bhsmte · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Drinking is a sin.

Yes, I realize that is your opinion.

AV1611VET · Apr 20, 2015

bhsmte said:
Yes, I realize that is your opinion.

In fact, it's against the law to drink, if you are under 21.

In another fact, it's against the law to sell alcohol to anyone under 21.

bhsmte · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
In fact, it's against the law to drink, if you are under 21.

In another fact, it's against the law to sell alcohol to anyone under 21.

Yes, this is the case.

It is also against the law to drive without a drivers license.

Split Rock · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Does your perfect KJV1611 have the term "grape juice" in It?

If not, perhaps the term came along later to differentiate non-alcoholic wine from alcoholic wine?

Kinda like saying "berries" all the time, until the terms "raspberries" and "blue berries" were coined.

Interesting that you refuse to use the same consideration for the word "fowl" in the O.T., and insist that there was some type of weird "fowled bat" in the past.

Subduction Zone · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Drinking is a sin.

And yet you cannot support that with Bible verses. Excessive drinking is a sin according to the Bible. Moderate consumption of alcohol was not only not a sin, but was even recommended by at least one of the apostles at times.

Split Rock · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
In fact, it's against the law to drink, if you are under 21.

In another fact, it's against the law to sell alcohol to anyone under 21.

So, our society is OK with adults sinning, but not those under 21?

Armoured · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
In fact, it's against the law to drink, if you are under 21.

In another fact, it's against the law to sell alcohol to anyone under 21.

Not in Australia. Not in plenty of places, IIRC.

Subduction Zone · Apr 20, 2015

Armoured said:
Not in Australia. Not in plenty of places, IIRC.

Nor was it always the case in the U.S.. When I went to college the drinking age was 18 and keggers were actually encouraged in the dormitory where I was living. The idea was that students could drink, get drunk, and crawl to their rooms, rather than drive to a bar, drink, get drunk, and crash on the way home. A housemate of mine died in such an accident after he transferred to a school in another state with a drinking age of 21.

PsychoSarah · Apr 20, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Drinking is a sin.

If you pray to Allah.

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