My $.02 on music

[ByTheSpirit]

So I know this topic gets beat up quite a bit around here, but just wanted to share a couple of thoughts as I see it. Emphasis, this is my view on the topic, but I have some scriptural standing here I believe.

We see no clear, 100% cut and dry definition in scripture of what kind of music is and isn’t sinful. Now we can make some very good and educated guesses on a song by song basis. Such as a song that promotes certain sin, like:

1. Sex
2. Drugs
3. Crime
4. Vulgarity
5. Blasphemy
6. Idolatry
7. etc

Such songs that promote these things either in lyric or another form should be universally denounced among believers as sinful.

The grey area comes in when you look at music that either has no lyrics (such as most classical music, orchestra, etc) or music that doesn’t necessarily promote sin, but doesn’t promote godly living either, such as say “Lean on me” by Bill Withers. Great song, but no mention of God or holiness, etc.

So where should we draw the line? Or should we even draw the line? Perhaps at the point of saying, if what you listen to promotes sin then that’s where the line should be? But what about this:

1 John 2:15-17
"Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world. And the world is passing away along with its desires, but whoever does the will of God abides forever."

What kind of options does scripture like this give us? What is of the world? Anything that is not of God or godly in nature?

What about “So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God” (1 Corinthians 10:31) Does listening to music that doesn’t glorify God bring glory to Him?

Lastly, “Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind” (Romans 12:2) Does worldly music renew our minds to the will of God? Or does it bring us more into conformity with the world?

I’d say based off scriptures, believers should disavow any music at all that does not glorify God, including music that doesn’t necessarily promote sin or worldliness. We should always seek renewal of our minds to God, seeking to honor and glorify Him in everything that we do, separating ourselves from all forms of worldliness.

 

[Unqualified]

Music from any branch that does not abide in Him, and is being burned is probably going to be negative in some way to the Christian.

 

[sandman]

So I know this topic gets beat up quite a bit around here, but just wanted to share a couple of thoughts as I see it. Emphasis, this is my view on the topic, but I have some scriptural standing here I believe.

We see no clear, 100% cut and dry definition in scripture of what kind of music is and isn’t sinful. Now we can make some very good and educated guesses on a song by song basis. Such as a song that promotes certain sin, like:

1. Sex
2. Drugs
3. Crime
4. Vulgarity
5. Blasphemy
6. Idolatry
7. etc

Such songs that promote these things either in lyric or another form should be universally denounced among believers as sinful.

The grey area comes in when you look at music that either has no lyrics (such as most classical music, orchestra, etc) or music that doesn’t necessarily promote sin, but doesn’t promote godly living either, such as say “Lean on me” by Bill Withers. Great song, but no mention of God or holiness, etc.

So where should we draw the line? Or should we even draw the line? Perhaps at the point of saying, if what you listen to promotes sin then that’s where the line should be? But what about this:

1 John 2:15-17
"Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world. And the world is passing away along with its desires, but whoever does the will of God abides forever."

What kind of options does scripture like this give us? What is of the world? Anything that is not of God or godly in nature?

What about “So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God” (1 Corinthians 10:31) Does listening to music that doesn’t glorify God bring glory to Him?

Lastly, “Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind” (Romans 12:2) Does worldly music renew our minds to the will of God? Or does it bring us more into conformity with the world?

I’d say based off scriptures, believers should disavow any music at all that does not glorify God, including music that doesn’t necessarily promote sin or worldliness. We should always seek renewal of our minds to God, seeking to honor and glorify Him in everything that we do, separating ourselves from all forms of worldliness.

It’s worth a lot more than .02 cents

As consequential as lyrics are, the beat is also just as serious in controlling the emotion.

In the devil spirit realm…. music is considered heavy artillery as it is indulged by both hemispheres of the brain…That is why we tend to remember lyrics from 20 years ago, when we can’t remember what we ate yesterday…..There is more to that… but not getting into it now. Just be selective in what you listen to music can be entertaining and relaxing …..it is also a great way for the adversary to get his message across as subtle as it may seem.

 

[frank sears]

Was listening to a little North American Indian music the other day and started to feel like dancing around the campfire, he,he. I suppose the question could be, is all music that arouses the flesh nature wrong? Certainly most of it is. I have listened to flesh arousing music with christian words to it and I do not believe that will work(flesh and spirit oppose each other).

 

[Jonaitis]

I’d say based off scriptures, believers should disavow any music at all that does not glorify God, including music that doesn’t necessarily promote sin or worldliness. We should always seek renewal of our minds to God, seeking to honor and glorify Him in everything that we do, separating ourselves from all forms of worldliness.

I find this statement a bit overboard and legalistic. Music is a form of self-expression, and it doesn't have to be religious in nature. How about we apply this to other forms of media? You should never watch a movie or a tv show ever again unless it specifically glorifies God, even if it doesn't promote sin. You should never appreciate the artwork of others unless it specifically glorifies God, even if it doesn't promote sin. You should never play any type of game that doesn't specifically glorify God, even if it doesn't promote sin. When you follow this line of thinking, which I use to be that way for a long time, you begin to be extremely critical to yourself and others as to what is acceptable. You develop, without realizing it, a judgmental spirit that only looks down on other people for not being as "holy" as you, yet you will justify it because you found Scripture that supports your convictions. How do you think the Pharisees became what they became? They took the Law and became extreme about it.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

I find this statement a bit overboard and legalistic. Music is a form of self-expression, and it doesn't have to be religious in nature. How about we apply this to other forms of media? You should never watch a movie or a tv show ever again unless it specifically glorifies God. You should never appreciate the artwork of others unless it specifically glorifies God. You should never play any type of game that doesn't specifically glorify God. When you follow this line of thinking, which I use to be that way for a long time, you begin to be extremely critical to yourself and others as to what is acceptable. You develop, without realizing it, a judgmental spirit that only looks down on other people for not being as "holy" as you, yet you will justify it because you found Scripture that supports your convictions.

Eh I’d hold up with saying that “if someone does this” “they will begin to judge others”. I don’t watch TV, or play video games, or look at art, etc, but I don’t look down on people.

Any ways, you can’t put your own feelings up against scripture and then say that scripture is wrong because of what it would mean for your quality of life. Scripture says “Do everything for the glory of God”. So can we listen to worldly music and glorify God in it? Scripture says to “love not the world, nor the things of the world”. Scripture says to “be transformed by the renewing of our minds”, can we renew our minds to the mind of Christ by filling our mind with worldly music?

I’d say not. But again, I’m glad you brought it up actually. This is a common issue within those who believe, or say they do anyway. We read a scripture that challenges us and tells us we have to give up something that comes between us and God, and instead of giving it up, we find a way to rationalize it and now we’ve compromised truth for convenience.

 

[Jonaitis]

Eh I’d hold up with saying that “if someone does this” “they will begin to judge others”. I don’t watch TV, or play video games, or look at art, etc, but I don’t look down on people.

Any ways, you can’t put your own feelings up against scripture and then say that scripture is wrong because of what it would mean for your quality of life. Scripture says “Do everything for the glory of God”. So can we listen to worldly music and glorify God in it? Scripture says to “love not the world, nor the things of the world”. Scripture says to “be transformed by the renewing of our minds”, can we renew our minds to the mind of Christ by filling our mind with worldly music?

I’d say not. But again, I’m glad you brought it up actually. This is a common issue within those who believe, or say they do anyway. We read a scripture that challenges us and tells us we have to give up something that comes between us and God, and instead of giving it up, we find a way to rationalize it and now we’ve compromised truth for convenience.

What I am hearing is that unless music has lyrics and specifically glorifies God, it is sinful. I consider that extreme. I am an instrumental guy, I love listening to Jazz. There is nothing worldly about it. It is a form of self-expression that God has given us.

From your last paragraph, you have already begun to judge people based on their taste of music.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

What I am hearing is that unless music has lyrics and specifically glorifies God, it is sinful. I consider that extreme. I am an instrumental guy, I love listening to Jazz. There is nothing worldly about it. It is a form of self-expression that God has given us.

From your last paragraph, you have already begun to judge people based on their taste of music.

Calling out unrighteousness in a group of people is not judgement that God frowns upon. The kind of judgement we are to avoid is the kind that is based on appearances and such. See James 2:1-13, John 7:24. Otherwise Jesus wouldn’t have told us how to identify wolves in sheeps clothing (isn’t that a form of judgement)?

But anyway, do not love the world nor the things of the world… if anyone loves the world the love of the Father is not in them. Again, you can disagree all you like, I’m only quoting scripture to you. That seems rather cut and dry on what we as believers should be filling our minds and hearts with.

 

[Jonaitis]

Calling out unrighteousness in a group of people is not judgement that God frowns upon. The kind of judgement we are to avoid is the kind that is based on appearances and such. See James 2:1-13, John 7:24. Otherwise Jesus wouldn’t have told us how to identify wolves in sheeps clothing (isn’t that a form of judgement)?

But anyway, do not love the world nor the things of the world… if anyone loves the world the love of the Father is not in them. Again, you can disagree all you like, I’m only quoting scripture to you. That seems rather cut and dry on what we as believers should be filling our minds and hearts with.

You're taking the words of the apostles to an extreme. There was a time when congregational psalm-singing was the only liturgical form of music in the Church, and for the most of history it was not metrical, and the argument was backed up by Colossians 3:16. Hymns were seen, and still in some churches, to be unauthorized in worship because of its non-inspiration. Some of the points you're making is the same points they employed centuries ago.

 

[Unqualified]

There is nothing wrong with that it is Christian tradition that Paul talked about. Churches have been falling away from scripture for a long time. But I like the present music and the new Jesus songs. We’re sorry about what we made worship used to be. I’ve heard a few jazz versions. Ok. But don’t mislead yourself that jazz isn’t worldly.

 

[Jamdoc]

I just hope there's room for instrumental music, because I find that when it's lyrical praise music, it has the most milquetoast, dead sounding music accompanying it I could even imagine, if you took away the lyrics you'd probably find it as boring and unstirring as I do.
But because of the lyrics many people like it.
But I pay more attention to music than lyrics.. so.. I'm kind of in a bind when it comes to Christian music since they definitely want to focus on praise lyrics over everything else.

 

[Skye1300]

I think another way to look at it too is that music that doesn't directly mention God can still glorify God indirectly if it's about the good things that come from God like love and peace. Or if someone sings about sunrises, they are singing about the glorious creation of God even if they don't mention Him directly.
I think songs about peace and kindness and family and children etc do glorify God because they sing about good things God created. You can glorify God without mentioning God. Just like how you can see God through His creation, you can glorify Him by admiring His creation. Inspirational songs are good to listen to also. Philippians 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is gracious, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.
But songs about sex, murder, cheating, harming others etc, those songs should be avoided.

 

[Jonaitis]

But don’t mislead yourself that jazz isn’t worldly.

Not everything in the world is bad. As someone pointed out, music can glorify God without directly discussing God.

 

[Unqualified]

I like jazz too once in awhile. But put Jesus first. ‘In all your ways acknowledge Him and He will make your path straight.’ Which king is on the throne of your heart?

 

[Jonaitis]

I like jazz too once in awhile. But put Jesus first. ‘In all your ways acknowledge Him and He will make your path straight.’ Which king is on the throne of your heart?

Who doesn't agree? We say things that can ruin the faith of others. I've seen it done before.

 

[Unqualified]

You mean by offending their consciences. There are carnal Christians in life that need to hear more of what God wants and not their flesh.

 

[Jamdoc]

Not everything in the world is bad. As someone pointed out, music can glorify God without directly discussing God.

I have to wonder though, sometimes worldly music even praises God lyrically, but in an ignorant or incorrect way. Reggae music comes to mind, often mentioning Jah and Yah (words they use to refer to Yahweh) and naming Mount Zion as the place where the creator rules from...
however they have a poor interpretation of the bible that they base most of their theology on, and identify the Emperor of Ethiopia in the 20th century as being the 2nd coming of Christ. A claim that the Emperor (Haile Selassie) himself was appalled by. Bob Marley was converted to Orthodox Christianity before he died, and that was set in motion by Selassie.

and I have to wonder.. is such misguided praise, that is meant to YHWH, but done in incorrect fashion and through the wrong messiah, does it have any honor to God, or is it outright sin when it's in ignorance?
I mean the desire to honor God is there, they just do it incorrectly in ignorance. The sons of Aaron were killed for worshiping God incorrectly, however they had knowledge of how to do it correctly.

 

[Jillybean736]

Not everything in the world is bad. As someone pointed out, music can glorify God without directly discussing God.

I agree. I listen to mostly Christian music now, but still like to listen to some oldies from the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Your Love Keeps Lifting me Higher by Jackie Wilson makes me think of God’s love. Also the song Turn, Turn, Turn by the Byrds is mostly scripture from the Bible.