Move to Maturity

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Move to Maturity

Hebrews 6:1-3
Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith in God, instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do, if God permits.…​

A call to maturity calls for laying aside the laying on of hands so how do we reconcile all the other references from old and new testament accounts of laying on of hands especially in light of Hebrews 6? We will attempt to explore that here...

The first time we see the laying on of hands NT is when John and Peter went to where Philip was teaching. The same instance shows Philip being whisked away to baptize the Ethiopian eunuch.
Nestled between these 2 incidents is Simon the Sorceror attempting to purchase the power he associated with the laying on of hands when he saw the Holy Spirit being conferred onto the Samaritans.

Acts 8:1-8 With the death of Stephen, Saul/Paul began to destroy the church imprisoning both men and women resulting in them being scattered, preaching as they went. The first section brings us to where Philip was preaching in Samaria. There were great signs and miracles everywhere with men and women being baptized including one called Simon that was astonished at the power exhibited and, it becomes obvious, envious of the attention now deprived from him for he had been called "the great power of God" by the people. Acts 8:9-13

The people there had been baptized into the name of Jesus by identification with Him, which is like that of Jesus breathing upon the disciples before Pentecost, but they had not received the power from on high outwardly like the Spirit alighting on the 120 disciples at Pentecost.
Peter and John had been sent for so as to open the door to the group at Samaria, that were not of the Jews nor of the gentiles, to including them also in the body of Christ.
The laying on of hands in the OT was for identification. The example of Peter with Cornelius had Peter directly to bring in the gentiles into the church membership.

Leviticus 1:4
And he shall lay his hand on the head of the burnt offering, and it shall be accepted for him, to make expiation for him.​

The laying on of hands was honored by the Holy Spirit by falling upon the samaritans in addition to having received the Spirit essentially when they believed.Acts 8:14-17

1 Corinthians 12:12-13
For even as the body is one and has many members, yet all the members of the body, being many, are one body, so also is the Christ.
For also in one Spirit we were all baptized into one Body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all given to drink one Spirit.​

The gospel had spread from the racially pure Jews to the racially impure Samaritans thru Philip, Peter and John.
From Acts 8:26-40 the Holy Spirit directed Philip to contact the gentiles. Thereby proving that the spread of the gospel was by the Spirit's leading and directing, not by man's devise and schedule and thereby ending the Old Covenant and inagurating the Kingdom under God in Spirit and truth (as at Pentecost when the Spirit first arrived)

It may be that Philip only preached water baptism to the eunich not Spirit baptism or it may be that with the Spirit definately there that both were applied, we are not told. But the preceeding events would seem to indicate that only an identification with His death had been applied earlier and not a reality of life in Christ, which is the Spirit baptism of power from on high and used to further the ministry. We are not told in the bible what the Eunich did from there.
It does seems to show the need of not just the indwelling Christ for life but the outward reality for the great commission.

The seven items of Hebrews 6:1-4 are foundational and once applied need not be applied again. Many think that repentance must be obtained again and again but John the baptist had the ministry of baptism unto repentance and baptism is not continually needed by water. Baptism by the Spirit is renewed daily and we know that picking up the cross is daily following Him, the conscience being cleansed in His blood and obtained at the throne of grace, not at the water font.(OT analogy of washing at the laver to enter the first veil. His blood then moves one thru the second veil)
That's why we are to move on from there because we need to build on the foundation. Too many Christians think that sitting on the foundation or just the cornerstone is enough. Many return to the old foundation of law just to cover the bases not realizing they need to forge ahead! Build on rock not on sand!... Or your cardboard castle will fall!

Acts 8:20
But Peter said to him, May your silver go with you into destruction, because you thought that you would acquire the gift of God through money.
Hebrews 10:39
But we are not of those who shrink back to ruin but of them who have faith to the gaining of the soul.​

Those who forsake the New Coveant to return to the Old Covenant are in danger of destruction just as those who seek to purchase the power of laying on of hands, in regarding Christ's blood a common thing and insulting the Spirit. Hebrews 10:27-31

Acts 8:18-19
But when Simon saw that through the laying on of the hands of the apostles the Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying,
Give me also this authority that on whomever I lay my hands he may receive the Holy Spirit.​

The destruction is of a person's deeds and work, not a destruction of life and limb.
1 Corinthians 3:15
If anyone's work is consumed, he will suffer loss, but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

 

[Haipule]

Move to Maturity

Hebrews 6:1-3
Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith in God, instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do, if God permits.…​

A call to maturity calls for laying aside the laying on of hands so how do we reconcile all the other references from old and new testament accounts of laying on of hands especially in light of Hebrews 6? We will attempt to explore that here...

The first time we see the laying on of hands NT is when John and Peter went to where Philip was teaching. The same instance shows Philip being whisked away to baptize the Ethiopian eunuch.
Nestled between these 2 incidents is Simon the Sorceror attempting to purchase the power he associated with the laying on of hands when he saw the Holy Spirit being conferred onto the Samaritans.

Acts 8:1-8 With the death of Stephen, Saul/Paul began to destroy the church imprisoning both men and women resulting in them being scattered, preaching as they went. The first section brings us to where Philip was preaching in Samaria. There were great signs and miracles everywhere with men and women being baptized including one called Simon that was astonished at the power exhibited and, it becomes obvious, envious of the attention now deprived from him for he had been called "the great power of God" by the people. Acts 8:9-13

The people there had been baptized into the name of Jesus by identification with Him, which is like that of Jesus breathing upon the disciples before Pentecost, but they had not received the power from on high outwardly like the Spirit alighting on the 120 disciples at Pentecost.
Peter and John had been sent for so as to open the door to the group at Samaria, that were not of the Jews nor of the gentiles, to including them also in the body of Christ.
The laying on of hands in the OT was for identification. The example of Peter with Cornelius had Peter directly to bring in the gentiles into the church membership.

Leviticus 1:4
And he shall lay his hand on the head of the burnt offering, and it shall be accepted for him, to make expiation for him.​

The laying on of hands was honored by the Holy Spirit by falling upon the samaritans in addition to having received the Spirit essentially when they believed.Acts 8:14-17

1 Corinthians 12:12-13
For even as the body is one and has many members, yet all the members of the body, being many, are one body, so also is the Christ.
For also in one Spirit we were all baptized into one Body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all given to drink one Spirit.​

The gospel had spread from the racially pure Jews to the racially impure Samaritans thru Philip, Peter and John.
From Acts 8:26-40 the Holy Spirit directed Philip to contact the gentiles. Thereby proving that the spread of the gospel was by the Spirit's leading and directing, not by man's devise and schedule and thereby ending the Old Covenant and inagurating the Kingdom under God in Spirit and truth (as at Pentecost when the Spirit first arrived)

It may be that Philip only preached water baptism to the eunich not Spirit baptism or it may be that with the Spirit definately there that both were applied, we are not told. But the preceeding events would seem to indicate that only an identification with His death had been applied earlier and not a reality of life in Christ, which is the Spirit baptism of power from on high and used to further the ministry. We are not told in the bible what the Eunich did from there.
It does seems to show the need of not just the indwelling Christ for life but the outward reality for the great commission.

The seven items of Hebrews 6:1-4 are foundational and once applied need not be applied again. Many think that repentance must be obtained again and again but John the baptist had the ministry of baptism unto repentance and baptism is not continually needed by water. Baptism by the Spirit is renewed daily and we know that picking up the cross is daily following Him, the conscience being cleansed in His blood and obtained at the throne of grace, not at the water font.(OT analogy of washing at the laver to enter the first veil. His blood then moves one thru the second veil)
That's why we are to move on from there because we need to build on the foundation. Too many Christians think that sitting on the foundation or just the cornerstone is enough. Many return to the old foundation of law just to cover the bases not realizing they need to forge ahead! Build on rock not on sand!... Or your cardboard castle will fall!

Acts 8:20
But Peter said to him, May your silver go with you into destruction, because you thought that you would acquire the gift of God through money.
Hebrews 10:39
But we are not of those who shrink back to ruin but of them who have faith to the gaining of the soul.​

Those who forsake the New Coveant to return to the Old Covenant are in danger of destruction just as those who seek to purchase the power of laying on of hands, in regarding Christ's blood a common thing and insulting the Spirit. Hebrews 10:27-31

Acts 8:18-19
But when Simon saw that through the laying on of the hands of the apostles the Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying,
Give me also this authority that on whomever I lay my hands he may receive the Holy Spirit.​

The destruction is of a person's deeds and work, not a destruction of life and limb.
1 Corinthians 3:15
If anyone's work is consumed, he will suffer loss, but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

Aloha Cassia:

Therefore leaving the elementary [teaching about] the Christ(anointed) [Word], let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, Heb 6:1 NASB

"teaching about" was added by the translators. "Word" was left out. "christos" is transliterated and NOT translated for you. The Greek adjective christos means: anointed. To be anointed means: to be given a destiny and purpose. We Christians are anointed with a purpose and destiny. However, the translators insistence on transliterating THE ADJECTIVE christos and give it a capital 'C', making it always a reference to Jesus, completely masks the NT's teaching of "anointed".

Do you remember what John said, "Thee anointing which you all know..." I'm sorry Johnny-Boy but, we don't know because the translators have hid it from us!

Unfortunately, the translators also left out an extremely important word, logos-Word(pun intended) and translated it instead as “teaching”. The reason being is beyond me.

Rather: through-which(conjunction linking “trained” from 5:14) ones-leaving-from(the subject of)* specifically—thee of-the first-most of-thee anointed Word,…

Unfortunately, it's extremely difficult to go beyond the "elementary training" of thee anointed Word into a more mature understanding when our teacher don't even know what the anointed Word is!!! They do not understand it's God given anointed destiny or purpose!!! Do they even understand that WE, you and I, have been anointed by God Himself, with a God given destiny and purpose beyond "theology"(elementary teaching)?

 

[Marilyn C]

They do not understand it's God given anointed destiny or purpose!!! Do they even understand that WE, you and I, have been anointed by God Himself, with a God given destiny and purpose beyond "theology"(elementary teaching)?

Hi Haipule,

God`s purpose for the believers in Christ is -

`...to be conformed to the image of His Son,.....` (Rom. 8: 29)

There is nothing greater. Then our gifts and talents are for serving one another -

`...the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share causes the growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.` (Eph. 4: 16)

regards, Marilyn.

 

[Haipule]

Hi Haipule,

God`s purpose for the believers in Christ is -

`...to be conformed to the image of His Son,.....` (Rom. 8: 29)

There is nothing greater. Then our gifts and talents are for serving one another -

`...the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share causes the growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love.` (Eph. 4: 16)

regards, Marilyn.

Aloha Marilyn:

`...to be conformed to the image of His Son,.....` (Rom. 8: 29)

People often ask me, "Why does God bless you so much"?

You know, I asked God the same question and He told me, "Bill, it's just that you remind me sooo much, of My Son!"

Well then, I must be doing something right!

All kidding aside:

If you continue on into Romans 8:30, God's anointed destiny, for us all, is OUR glorification. And that, according to the rest of Romans 8:30(those He...), is by HIS doing.

Principle: By His doing, our calling, we are glorified! By our subsequent glorification, He is glorified! If WE look good, He looks good--we become a living witness and testimony: proof of God's glory and promise of life! Stay shiny my friend! Don't hide it under a basket! Rather, fill the whole room with it! It's OK girlfriend, for you to live and shine like the moon in a dying world of darkness! We all LOVE it! Why? Because it gives us all, EVEYONE, hope!

As far as Ephesians 4:16, "WE" will learn that when "WE" learn to use whatever elementary theological fork we've been handed, to eat the spaghetti of God's Word. Until then, we will continue to fight about stupid theological forks--and STARVE!

Well, not on my watch--I LOVE TO COOK! And I got plenty to share!

Only to His glory, Bill

 

[Marilyn C]

Aloha Marilyn:

`...to be conformed to the image of His Son,.....` (Rom. 8: 29)

People often ask me, "Why does God bless you so much"?

You know, I asked God the same question and He told me, "Bill, it's just that you remind me sooo much, of My Son!"

Well then, I must be doing something right!

All kidding aside:

If you continue on into Romans 8:30, God's anointed destiny, for us all, is OUR glorification. And that, according to the rest of Romans 8:30(those He...), is by HIS doing.

Principle: By His doing, our calling, we are glorified! By our subsequent glorification, He is glorified! If WE look good, He looks good--we become a living witness and testimony: proof of God's glory and promise of life! Stay shiny my friend! Don't hide it under a basket! Rather, fill the whole room with it! It's OK girlfriend, for you to live and shine like the moon in a dying world of darkness! We all LOVE it! Why? Because it gives us all, EVEYONE, hope!

As far as Ephesians 4:16, "WE" will learn that when "WE" learn to use whatever elementary theological fork we've been handed, to eat the spaghetti of God's Word. Until then, we will continue to fight about stupid theological forks--and STARVE!

Well, not on my watch--I LOVE TO COOK! And I got plenty to share!

Only to His glory, Bill

Hi Haipule,

Thank you for being relational, funny and friendly, - everything I wasn`t. Sorry about that. I sometimes get job focused, and need to remember the other person is a child of God. So bro, would love to taste your spaghetti, and keep up the great `smother them with love,` attitude.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Aloha Cassia:

Therefore leaving the elementary [teaching about] the Christ(anointed) [Word], let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, Heb 6:1 NASB

"teaching about" was added by the translators. "Word" was left out. "christos" is transliterated and NOT translated for you. The Greek adjective christos means: anointed. To be anointed means: to be given a destiny and purpose. We Christians are anointed with a purpose and destiny. However, the translators insistence on transliterating THE ADJECTIVE christos and give it a capital 'C', making it always a reference to Jesus, completely masks the NT's teaching of "anointed".

Do you remember what John said, "Thee anointing which you all know..." I'm sorry Johnny-Boy but, we don't know because the translators have hid it from us!

Unfortunately, the translators also left out an extremely important word, logos-Word(pun intended) and translated it instead as “teaching”. The reason being is beyond me.

Rather: through-which(conjunction linking “trained” from 5:14) ones-leaving-from(the subject of)* specifically—thee of-the first-most of-thee anointed Word,…

Unfortunately, it's extremely difficult to go beyond the "elementary training" of thee anointed Word into a more mature understanding when our teacher don't even know what the anointed Word is!!! They do not understand it's God given anointed destiny or purpose!!! Do they even understand that WE, you and I, have been anointed by God Himself, with a God given destiny and purpose beyond "theology"(elementary teaching)?

Hi I've been taking my time to respond to this post because I think your so far out of left field that I just don't know where to begin. But let me try to break it down to something close to semblence:

Aloha Cassia:

Therefore leaving the elementary [teaching about] the Christ(anointed) [Word], let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, Heb 6:1 NASB

"teaching about" was added by the translators. "Word" was left out. "christos" is transliterated and NOT translated for you. The Greek adjective christos means: anointed. To be anointed means: to be given a destiny and purpose. We Christians are anointed with a purpose and destiny. However, the translators insistence on transliterating THE ADJECTIVE christos and give it a capital 'C', making it always a reference to Jesus, completely masks the NT's teaching of "anointed".

Let's assume for a moment that I agree with you that half the bible is ficticious. Let us leave behind the elementary and let us press on to maturuty. The first reference to anointed was with Hannah in her Nazarite prayer. Not an adjective but a noun.

Do you remember what John said, "Thee anointing which you all know..." I'm sorry Johnny-Boy but, we don't know because the translators have hid it from us!

you have not expressed what the mystery is that you think has been kept in the dark

Unfortunately, the translators also left out an extremely important word, logos-Word(pun intended) and translated it instead as “teaching”. The reason being is beyond me.

Trying to wrap my mind around the Greek play on words that you are attempting here. Are you replacing logos with Pneuma?

Rather: through-which(conjunction linking “trained” from 5:14) ones-leaving-from(the subject of)* specifically—thee of-the first-most of-thee anointed Word,…

Unfortunately, it's extremely difficult to go beyond the "elementary training" of thee anointed Word into a more mature understanding when our teacher don't even know what the anointed Word is!!! They do not understand it's God given anointed destiny or purpose!!! Do they even understand that WE, you and I, have been anointed by God Himself, with a God given destiny and purpose beyond "theology"(elementary teaching)?

Could yo please go into more specifics to attempt at a reasonable discussion here. Thanks

 

[Haipule]

Hi I've been taking my time to respond to this post because I think your so far out of left field that I just don't know where to begin. But let me try to break it down to something close to semblence:
Let's assume for a moment that I agree with you that half the bible is ficticious. Let us leave behind the elementary and let us press on to maturuty. The first reference to anointed was with Hannah in her Nazarite prayer. Not an adjective but a noun.
you have not expressed what the mystery is that you think has been kept in the dark

Trying to wrap my mind around the Greek play on words that you are attempting here. Are you replacing logos with Pneuma?

Could yo please go into more specifics to attempt at a reasonable discussion here. Thanks

"I think your so far out of left field"

Your in good company! A lot of people think that and many of whom I love.

"Let's assume for a moment that I agree with you that half the bible is ficticious."

I don't think that. I think the NT is unrecognizably translated. I can translate the koinE Greek into English perfectly and found the Book of Romans--The Bride of Frankenstein! Phrases hacked, words added, words removed, word orders changed, etc. Ephesians is even worse! The entire NT is translated to support theologies. Not to honor the writers words!

Background: I've been studying theology since I was 13yrs old. I am a pastors(non-denominational) kid and had access to an extensive library. Even books on translating, lexicons and Greek grammar. My stepfather never stopped studying Greek. However, I am self taught and did not go to seminary school where I would be forced to get a good grade and do it their way. Their way is to NEVER question the translators! So, the problem I see has been handed down century after century from professors to students! And by the way, they justify themselves with "advanced" grammar technics which are nothing more then an tool to manipulate!

"Not an adjective but a noun. You have not expressed what the mystery is that you think has been kept in the dark".

The Greek word christos which means: anointed--is an adjective! It was used by the writers as an adjective. It's declension and usage is just like that of the Greek adjective, agathos which means: good. Admittedly, some reference books identify it as a noun while others identify it as an adjective such as blueletterbible.org which is an awesome resource giving us the lexical work of Strong's, Vine's and Thayer.

I personally contacted a Jewish community center and asked them if the Aramaic word mashiyach(translated "Messiah"--Daniel 9), the equivalent of christos(according to the LXX), was a noun, or an adjective? They said it is an adjective and means: anointed.

The "mystery" is that the translators do not honor it as such and hide from us the Scriptural teaching about OUR anointing! Anything that is christos is anointed which figuratively means to be given a purpose and destiny--a mission! Many times the writers used christos to refer to us, or something else anointed, and NOT just Jesus!

"Trying to wrap my mind around the Greek play on words that you are attempting here. Are you replacing logos with Pneuma?"

I would never replace logos with pneuma and that's a whole nother can of worms. Back to christos. The translators, by leaving out the word "logos", instead put: "teaching about christos/Christ". And failed to honor what the writer of Hebrews wrote: "thee anointed/christos Word". christos was used here by the writer as an attributive adjective modifying the noun logos. Other examples:

But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: "DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, 'WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?' (that is, to bring Christ down--what?), or 'WHO WILL DESCEND INTO THE ABYSS?' (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead--you’ve got to be kidding!)." Rom 10:6-7 NASB (all parenthesis’, as punctuation marks, were added by editors and/or translators)

Rather, Hyper-literal(same verse): Yet thee out-from(source) of-trust righteousness(feminine) thusly she-is-speaking: “NO YOU-MIGHT-SAY, IN THE HEART OF-YOU, ANY-ONE? HE-SHALL(in the future, acting upon himself)-UP-STEP INTO THE SKY”, this-thing(neuter, refers to the gramma--written word, which is a neuter noun, as Paul is quoting Moses’ writing) it-is christos-anointed to-lead-down*, or “ANY-ONE? HE-SHALL(in the future, acting upon himself)-DOWN-STEP INTO THE (sea without bottom)ABYSS”, this-thing it-is christos-anointed, out-from of-dead-ones(people whose dysfunctional lives are described as dead), to-lead-up*. Rom 10:6-7

Yet, Paul’s Romans 10:6-8 is a quote of Moses in Deuteronomy 30:11-14 which says in the NASB:

"For this commandment(instruction) which I command you(instruct of you) today is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach. "It is not in heaven, that you should say, 'Who will go up to heaven for us to get it for us and make us hear it, that we may observe it?' "Nor is it beyond the sea, that you should say, 'Who will cross the sea for us to get it for us and make us hear it, that we may observe it?' "But the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may observe it.

Do we really think that Paul was “filling up that which is lacking in Christ’s affliction”? Colossian 1:24 NASB

Rather:

Hyper-Literal: Who(Paul) now I-am-rejoicing in thee affliction of-me over(a position in authority and for) you-all and-also I-am-instead-of(in spite of, affliction)-up-filling(filling up) thee-all-things deficiencies(things lacking) of-thee(related to) pressures(afflictions, tribulations, straits, all which have needs) of-thee anointed(you and I, collectively) in thee flesh of-me over(position) thee body(neuter) of-same(anointed) which-thing(body) it-is thee out-called(we as a body are one anointed whole which has been called out): Col 1:24

Our faith is anointed:

For even though I am absent in body, nevertheless I am with you in spirit, rejoicing to see your good discipline and the stability of your faith in Christ. Col 2:5 NASB

Rather:

...of-thee into christos-anointed faith of-you-all.

Of course, Jesus is anointed. iEsous christos = Jesus, anointed-being(predicate adjective) christos iEsous = anointed Jesus(attributive adjective) christos as a stand alone reference to Jesus, the Anointed-One, is a substantive adjective used appellatively. In order to be used as an appellative, then it must be an ADJECTIVE.

Next time I get to be blue!

 

[Marilyn C]

Hi Haipule,

Thank you for that very informative post.

Marilyn.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Informative as to what tho in context with the op? I'm seeing a jump into another topic. Not a reply to the thread.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

"I think your so far out of left field"

Your in good company! A lot of people think that and many of whom I love.

"Let's assume for a moment that I agree with you that half the bible is ficticious."

I don't think that. I think the NT is unrecognizably translated. I can translate the koinE Greek into English perfectly and found the Book of Romans--The Bride of Frankenstein! Phrases hacked, words added, words removed, word orders changed, etc. Ephesians is even worse! The entire NT is translated to support theologies. Not to honor the writers words!

Background: I've been studying theology since I was 13yrs old. I am a pastors(non-denominational) kid and had access to an extensive library. Even books on translating, lexicons and Greek grammar. My stepfather never stopped studying Greek. However, I am self taught and did not go to seminary school where I would be forced to get a good grade and do it their way. Their way is to NEVER question the translators! So, the problem I see has been handed down century after century from professors to students! And by the way, they justify themselves with "advanced" grammar technics which are nothing more then an tool to manipulate!

"Not an adjective but a noun. You have not expressed what the mystery is that you think has been kept in the dark".

The Greek word christos which means: anointed--is an adjective! It was used by the writers as an adjective. It's declension and usage is just like that of the Greek adjective, agathos which means: good. Admittedly, some reference books identify it as a noun while others identify it as an adjective such as blueletterbible.org which is an awesome resource giving us the lexical work of Strong's, Vine's and Thayer.

I personally contacted a Jewish community center and asked them if the Aramaic word mashiyach(translated "Messiah"--Daniel 9), the equivalent of christos(according to the LXX), was a noun, or an adjective? They said it is an adjective and means: anointed.

The "mystery" is that the translators do not honor it as such and hide from us the Scriptural teaching about OUR anointing! Anything that is christos is anointed which figuratively means to be given a purpose and destiny--a mission! Many times the writers used christos to refer to us, or something else anointed, and NOT just Jesus!

"Trying to wrap my mind around the Greek play on words that you are attempting here. Are you replacing logos with Pneuma?"

I would never replace logos with pneuma and that's a whole nother can of worms. Back to christos. The translators, by leaving out the word "logos", instead put: "teaching about christos/Christ". And failed to honor what the writer of Hebrews wrote: "thee anointed/christos Word". christos was used here by the writer as an attributive adjective modifying the noun logos. Other examples:

But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: "DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, 'WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?' (that is, to bring Christ down--what?), or 'WHO WILL DESCEND INTO THE ABYSS?' (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead--you’ve got to be kidding!)." Rom 10:6-7 NASB (all parenthesis’, as punctuation marks, were added by editors and/or translators)

Rather, Hyper-literal(same verse): Yet thee out-from(source) of-trust righteousness(feminine) thusly she-is-speaking: “NO YOU-MIGHT-SAY, IN THE HEART OF-YOU, ANY-ONE? HE-SHALL(in the future, acting upon himself)-UP-STEP INTO THE SKY”, this-thing(neuter, refers to the gramma--written word, which is a neuter noun, as Paul is quoting Moses’ writing) it-is christos-anointed to-lead-down*, or “ANY-ONE? HE-SHALL(in the future, acting upon himself)-DOWN-STEP INTO THE (sea without bottom)ABYSS”, this-thing it-is christos-anointed, out-from of-dead-ones(people whose dysfunctional lives are described as dead), to-lead-up*. Rom 10:6-7

Yet, Paul’s Romans 10:6-8 is a quote of Moses in Deuteronomy 30:11-14 which says in the NASB:

"For this commandment(instruction) which I command you(instruct of you) today is not too difficult for you, nor is it out of reach. "It is not in heaven, that you should say, 'Who will go up to heaven for us to get it for us and make us hear it, that we may observe it?' "Nor is it beyond the sea, that you should say, 'Who will cross the sea for us to get it for us and make us hear it, that we may observe it?' "But the word is very near you, in your mouth and in your heart, that you may observe it.

Do we really think that Paul was “filling up that which is lacking in Christ’s affliction”? Colossian 1:24 NASB

Rather:

Hyper-Literal: Who(Paul) now I-am-rejoicing in thee affliction of-me over(a position in authority and for) you-all and-also I-am-instead-of(in spite of, affliction)-up-filling(filling up) thee-all-things deficiencies(things lacking) of-thee(related to) pressures(afflictions, tribulations, straits, all which have needs) of-thee anointed(you and I, collectively) in thee flesh of-me over(position) thee body(neuter) of-same(anointed) which-thing(body) it-is thee out-called(we as a body are one anointed whole which has been called out): Col 1:24

Our faith is anointed:

For even though I am absent in body, nevertheless I am with you in spirit, rejoicing to see your good discipline and the stability of your faith in Christ. Col 2:5 NASB

Rather:

...of-thee into christos-anointed faith of-you-all.

Of course, Jesus is anointed. iEsous christos = Jesus, anointed-being(predicate adjective) christos iEsous = anointed Jesus(attributive adjective) christos as a stand alone reference to Jesus, the Anointed-One, is a substantive adjective used appellatively. In order to be used as an appellative, then it must be an ADJECTIVE.

Next time I get to be blue!

it's an adjective in the sence of anointed with oil. I don't think it's an adjective in the verse I referenced. The horn of His anointed:
1Sa 2:10
They that strive with Jehovah shall be broken to pieces; in the heavens will he thunder upon them. Jehovah will judge the ends of the earth; and he will give strength unto his king, and exalt the horn of his anointed.

Aloha Cassia:

Therefore leaving the elementary [teaching about] the Christ(anointed) [Word], let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, Heb 6:1 NASB

"teaching about" was added by the translators. "Word" was left out. "christos" is transliterated and NOT translated for you. The Greek adjective christos means: anointed. To be anointed means: to be given a destiny and purpose. We Christians are anointed with a purpose and destiny. However, the translators insistence on transliterating THE ADJECTIVE christos and give it a capital 'C', making it always a reference to Jesus, completely masks the NT's teaching of "anointed".

Do you remember what John said, "Thee anointing which you all know..." I'm sorry Johnny-Boy but, we don't know because the translators have hid it from us!

Unfortunately, the translators also left out an extremely important word, logos-Word(pun intended) and translated it instead as “teaching”. The reason being is beyond me.

Rather: through-which(conjunction linking “trained” from 5:14) ones-leaving-from(the subject of)* specifically—thee of-the first-most of-thee anointed Word,…

Unfortunately, it's extremely difficult to go beyond the "elementary training" of thee anointed Word into a more mature understanding when our teacher don't even know what the anointed Word is!!! They do not understand it's God given anointed destiny or purpose!!! Do they even understand that WE, you and I, have been anointed by God Himself, with a God given destiny and purpose beyond "theology"(elementary teaching)?

There are references to anointed other than that of Christ. Fi:
2Co 1:21
Now he that establishes us with you in Christ, and has anointed us, is God,

 

[Haipule]

it's an adjective in the sence of anointed with oil. I don't think it's an adjective in the verse I referenced. The horn of His anointed:
1Sa 2:10
They that strive with Jehovah shall be broken to pieces; in the heavens will he thunder upon them. Jehovah will judge the ends of the earth; and he will give strength unto his king, and exalt the horn of his anointed.
There are references to anointed other than that of Christ. Fi:
2Co 1:21
Now he that establishes us with you in Christ, and has anointed us, is God,

!!!EXCELLENT!!!

Yes, 2 Cor 1:12 is a PERFECT example!

"Now he that establishes us with you in Christ(christon--the accusative masculine singular adjective of christos), and has anointed(chrisas--nominative masculine singular, aorist active participle--verbal adjective of christos means: One-anointing) us, is God,"

Sorry, I did not purposely try to side track your thread nor the important topic of maturity using Hebrew 6:1. It's just that I didn't expect your response. I felt it was necessary for me to defend my post.

Honestly, I was trying to be helpful and useful--not against nor useless.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

!!!EXCELLENT!!!

Yes, 2 Cor 1:12 is a PERFECT example!

"Now he that establishes us with you in Christ(christon--the accusative masculine singular adjective of christos), and has anointed(chrisas--nominative masculine singular, aorist active participle--verbal adjective of christos means: One-anointing) us, is God,"

Sorry, I did not purposely try to side track your thread nor the important topic of maturity using Hebrew 6:1. It's just that I didn't expect your response. I felt it was necessary for me to defend my post.

Honestly, I was trying to be helpful and useful--not against nor useless.

Not a problem. I just didn't see the relevance to the topic from your pov. Perhaps moreso now that you have expanded on it. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Aseyesee]

[QUOTE="~Cassia~, post: 7147392 The first reference to anointed was with Hannah in her Nazarite prayer. [/QUOTE]

There's the word pitch ... which if I remember correctly, is the word anoiting.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

FFT on 'Pernicious' in the Bible

Job 30:12
At my right hand rise the young brood; they push away my feet, and raise up against me their pernicious ways;
1 Timothy 6:9
But people who are determined to be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many unwise and pernicious ways which sink mankind in destruction and ruin.
2 Peter 2:2
And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.​

Not much to say ____ kinda jus speaks for itself.

 

[Aseyesee]

Move to Maturity

Hebrews 6:1-3
Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith in God, instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. And this we will do, if God permits.…​

A call to maturity calls for laying aside the laying on of hands so how do we reconcile all the other references from old and new testament accounts of laying on of hands especially in light of Hebrews 6? We will attempt to explore that here...

The first time we see the laying on of hands NT is when John and Peter went to where Philip was teaching. The same instance shows Philip being whisked away to baptize the Ethiopian eunuch.
Nestled between these 2 incidents is Simon the Sorceror attempting to purchase the power he associated with the laying on of hands when he saw the Holy Spirit being conferred onto the Samaritans.

Acts 8:1-8 With the death of Stephen, Saul/Paul began to destroy the church imprisoning both men and women resulting in them being scattered, preaching as they went. The first section brings us to where Philip was preaching in Samaria. There were great signs and miracles everywhere with men and women being baptized including one called Simon that was astonished at the power exhibited and, it becomes obvious, envious of the attention now deprived from him for he had been called "the great power of God" by the people. Acts 8:9-13

The people there had been baptized into the name of Jesus by identification with Him, which is like that of Jesus breathing upon the disciples before Pentecost, but they had not received the power from on high outwardly like the Spirit alighting on the 120 disciples at Pentecost.
Peter and John had been sent for so as to open the door to the group at Samaria, that were not of the Jews nor of the gentiles, to including them also in the body of Christ.
The laying on of hands in the OT was for identification. The example of Peter with Cornelius had Peter directly to bring in the gentiles into the church membership.

Leviticus 1:4
And he shall lay his hand on the head of the burnt offering, and it shall be accepted for him, to make expiation for him.​

The laying on of hands was honored by the Holy Spirit by falling upon the samaritans in addition to having received the Spirit essentially when they believed.Acts 8:14-17

1 Corinthians 12:12-13
For even as the body is one and has many members, yet all the members of the body, being many, are one body, so also is the Christ.
For also in one Spirit we were all baptized into one Body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and were all given to drink one Spirit.​

The gospel had spread from the racially pure Jews to the racially impure Samaritans thru Philip, Peter and John.
From Acts 8:26-40 the Holy Spirit directed Philip to contact the gentiles. Thereby proving that the spread of the gospel was by the Spirit's leading and directing, not by man's devise and schedule and thereby ending the Old Covenant and inagurating the Kingdom under God in Spirit and truth (as at Pentecost when the Spirit first arrived)

It may be that Philip only preached water baptism to the eunich not Spirit baptism or it may be that with the Spirit definately there that both were applied, we are not told. But the preceeding events would seem to indicate that only an identification with His death had been applied earlier and not a reality of life in Christ, which is the Spirit baptism of power from on high and used to further the ministry. We are not told in the bible what the Eunich did from there.
It does seems to show the need of not just the indwelling Christ for life but the outward reality for the great commission.

The seven items of Hebrews 6:1-4 are foundational and once applied need not be applied again. Many think that repentance must be obtained again and again but John the baptist had the ministry of baptism unto repentance and baptism is not continually needed by water. Baptism by the Spirit is renewed daily and we know that picking up the cross is daily following Him, the conscience being cleansed in His blood and obtained at the throne of grace, not at the water font.(OT analogy of washing at the laver to enter the first veil. His blood then moves one thru the second veil)
That's why we are to move on from there because we need to build on the foundation. Too many Christians think that sitting on the foundation or just the cornerstone is enough. Many return to the old foundation of law just to cover the bases not realizing they need to forge ahead! Build on rock not on sand!... Or your cardboard castle will fall!

Acts 8:20
But Peter said to him, May your silver go with you into destruction, because you thought that you would acquire the gift of God through money.
Hebrews 10:39
But we are not of those who shrink back to ruin but of them who have faith to the gaining of the soul.​

Those who forsake the New Coveant to return to the Old Covenant are in danger of destruction just as those who seek to purchase the power of laying on of hands, in regarding Christ's blood a common thing and insulting the Spirit. Hebrews 10:27-31

Acts 8:18-19
But when Simon saw that through the laying on of the hands of the apostles the Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying,
Give me also this authority that on whomever I lay my hands he may receive the Holy Spirit.​

The destruction is of a person's deeds and work, not a destruction of life and limb.
1 Corinthians 3:15
If anyone's work is consumed, he will suffer loss, but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

Be careful how you build, be careful how you hear, have the same connotation, both point to the fact that unless the Lord builds the house they labor in vain that build it.

The truth of the house you are is relative to the name of the city, as it is to the light fofound in the city that comes down from God, out of heaven.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Be careful how you build, be careful how you hear, have the same connotation, both point to the fact that unless the Lord builds the house they labor in vain that build it.

The truth of the house you are is relative to the name of the city, as it is to the light fofound in the city that comes down from God, out of heaven.

The post is actually about laying on of hands. How profound is that?

 

[Aseyesee]

The post is actually about laying on of hands. How profound is that?

Its all connected ...

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Its all connected ...

I think you missed the point of the op. It's not all relative. Please address the op or find another place to play. Thank you.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

[QUOTE="~Cassia~, post: 7147392 The first reference to anointed was with Hannah in her Nazarite prayer.

There's the word pitch ... which if I remember correctly, is the word anoiting.

Where in the thread did you get this quote from? Please readdress as to content.

 

[Aseyesee]

Where in the thread did you get this quote from? Please readdress as to content.

Post #6