Mikvah

[xDenax]

Who is "they"? I thought you wanted to know what the mikveh sponsor thought but maybe you mean you want to know what ChavaK thinks?

 

[BatZion]

Who is "they"? I thought you wanted to know what the mikveh sponsor thought but maybe you mean you want to know what ChavaK thinks?

My question is a generalized one. I'm speaking hypothcially about a possible scenario. I appreciate anyone's opinion. So, really anyone can answer. The "they" is a generalized they, meaning anyone who mivkahs, the people who sponsor it, etc.

 

[xDenax]

My question is a generalized one. I'm speaking hypothcially about a possible scenario. I appreciate anyone's opinion.

Ah, okay. I got it now.

 

[calmone]

I want to know how they feel about any Jew who wants to use it who adheres to any other kind of faith other than Judaism who wants to use it out of a sense of tradition.

I have not been a Jew long enough to be knowledgable to be able to answer this. However, I can see two distinct possibilities.

First, I would assume no group would allow a gentile member of the Messianic faith to use the mikveh. I do not necessarily see this as a bad thing for Messianics as it should encourage them to build their own, as well as whatever institutions they require. I do not see Messianics, especially gentiles, ever being accepted into the Jewish community and they should accept this and develope their own community and supporting instituions.

As far as Messianics who are halachly Jewish, I can see one of two things occuring.
If a Jewish messianic woman who is married to a Jew wishes to use the mikveh, a rabbi could possibly allow it because the commandment to use the mikveh is still encumbant upon her. There is also the issue of any children she bearss. I would also think this would apply to a Jewish woman who is not Messianic, but who is a member of a religion other than Judaism. A Jew who is an atheist would have no problem using the Mikveh because she has not strayed into avodah zara. But I do not know why an atheist would choose to use it anyway.

The second scenario I can see is that a Jewish woman who has accepted another religion, Messianic or not, ould be considered to have cut herself off from Judaism and from the people of Israel and would not be welcomed.

I would think that one should consult a rabbi to determine which is the case, because undoubtedly there will be varying opinions.

 

[BatZion]

I have not been a Jew long enough to be knowledgable to be able to answer this. However, I can see two distinct possibilities.

First, I would assume no group would allow a gentile member of the Messianic faith to use the mikveh. I do not necessarily see this as a bad thing for Messianics as it should encourage them to build their own, as well as whatever institutions they require. I do not see Messianics, especially gentiles, ever being accepted into the Jewish community and they should accept this and develope their own community and supporting instituions.

As far as Messianics who are halachly Jewish, I can see one of two things occuring.
If a Jewish messianic woman who is married to a Jew wishes to use the mikveh, a rabbi could possibly allow it because the commandment to use the mikveh is still encumbant upon her. There is also the issue of any children she bearss. I would also think this would apply to a Jewish woman who is not Messianic, but who is a member of a religion other than Judaism. A Jew who is an atheist would have no problem using the Mikveh because she has not strayed into avodah zara. But I do not know why an atheist would choose to use it anyway.

The second scenario I can see is that a Jewish woman who has accepted another religion, Messianic or not, ould be considered to have cut herself off from Judaism and from the people of Israel and would not be welcomed.

I would think that one should consult a rabbi to determine which is the case, because undoubtedly there will be varying opinions.

Thanks for the insights. I appreciate it. This post was really helpful.

 

[calmone]

Thanks for the insights. I appreciate it. This post was really helpful.

I am glad that you found the post of benefit, but please keep in mind I am not knowledgable enough to give you an answer. My response is my opinion alone and should not be considered as being authoritative.

 

[calmone]

Thanks for the insights. I appreciate it. This post was really helpful.

Does your community have plans to build a mikveh? Why not just use any resources that you currently have-natural bodies of water, swimming pool,rather than follow the Jewish traditions in how mikvaot are built?

 

[bugkiller]

This is an interesting subject to me. I see the title of the thread spelled mikvah and see the word spelled mikveh? What is the difference? Will any one please explain exactly what this is to me? Christianity relates to John the Baptist pretty clearly for me. How is the rite or ritual observed. I have heard of women being required to do this. I do read something in the law about ritual cleansing. Is this a private affair or done with witnesses such as baptismin Christianity? Of course I did not hear about it from any church I have attended.

This is strictly for educational purposes. I have no idea what or how to debate or discuss the subject. If you use Jewish words, could you give an English equivalent or something close?

thanks

bugkiller

 

[xDenax]

The Mikvah - Mikvah

This link is from an Orthodox perspective but it gives quite a bit of information.

 

[anisavta]

I'm in a mikvah study using the book Rivkah Slonim's introduction to Total Immersion: A Mikvah Anthology (Jason Aronson, 1996)
Very enlightening.

 

[xDenax]

I'm in a mikvah study using the book Rivkah Slonim's introduction to Total Immersion: A Mikvah Anthology (Jason Aronson, 1996)
Very enlightening.

Rivkah Slonim is the author of the link I posted above.

 

[anisavta]

I know!
When I began reading your link and it sounded familiar, I scrolled down to the end.
She actually the edited the book. It is made up of essays and stories concerning mikvah. There are some rich gems.

 

[xDenax]

I have never read it but I have it on my "books to read" list.

 

[siseleanor]

There's no reason not to use the ocean or a natural body of water. I know it may take a time to travel to a suitable place, but frum women have been known to travel to another country every month for their kosher immersion - I read this is what Rivky Holtzberg had to do before there was a mikvah in Mombai, she travelled all the way to Thailand. If women understand its importance they will find a way and overcome all obstacles.

 

[ChavaK]

If women understand its importance they will find a way and overcome all obstacles.

 

[washedagain]

There's no reason not to use the ocean or a natural body of water. I know it may take a time to travel to a suitable place, but frum women have been known to travel to another country every month for their kosher immersion - I read this is what Rivky Holtzberg had to do before there was a mikvah in Mombai, she travelled all the way to Thailand. If women understand its importance they will find a way and overcome all obstacles.

Hi! I am the completely ignorant christian that has no idea of it's importance.

Edit... I read the link... VERY informative.... love this part

The mikvah personifies both the womb and the grave; the portals to life and afterlife. In both, the person is stripped of all power and prowess. In both there is a mode of total reliance, complete abdication of control. Immersion in the mikvah can be understood as a symbolic act of self-abnegation, the conscious suspension of the self as an autonomous force. In so doing, the immersing Jew signals a desire to achieve oneness with the source of all life, to return to a primeval unity with G-d. Immersion indicates the abandonment of one form of existence to embrace one infinitely higher. In keeping with this theme, immersion in the mikvah is described not only in terms of purification, revitalization, and rejuvenation but also -- and perhaps primarily -- as rebirth.



Thanks!