Microevolution vs. Macroevolution

[Loudmouth]

I do not know that you end up with anything. The variation was there from the beginning.

Actually, it wasn't. There are many domestic pigeon breeds that are not found in the wild.

We could also look at dogs. Do you think chihuahuas were running around in the wild 5,000 years ago?

That is the way God created pigeons, with lots of variation.

Do you have evidence for this?

 

[Split Rock]

I do not know that you end up with anything. The variation was there from the beginning. That is the way God created pigeons, with lots of variation. So they can adjust and adapt to changing conditions in their biodiverse ecology.

Unfortunately, this doesn't work either. There is just too much varaition. For example, humans have literally hundreds of alleles (variants of a single gene locus) for genes of the HLA complex which governs things like tissue compatability. Now, ask yourself this question... how is it possible to shovel hundreds of variants into one gene locus if you start with one man and one woman 6,000 years ago? The maximum you can have with two diploid organisms is four. This of course ignores the fact that Eve was just a clone of Adam which would technically reduce the variation to just two (but lets be generous). HLA-B - major histocompatibility complex, class I, B - Genetics Home Reference

You see, its easy to make blanket statements like, "God put all that varaition in there," or "genetic similarities just mean similar lifestyles or same designer," but the reality of genetics doesn't fit with such statements. This reality is what we scientists work with everyday.

 

[And-U-Say]

Yes, a question followed by a statement:

Has Micro-evolution ever been observed to lead to Macro-evolution resulting in the development of new species?

Why.... yes! The fossil record shows they macro changes quite clearly. And the genetic information much more so. The nested hierarchy is the frosting on the cake. The evidence is overwhelming.

Has anyone ever seen this actually take place?

You don't really understand this Science thing, do you.

or is this just an assumption based on the interpretations of dried up, old bones and the like?

I think it is about 4 orders of magnitude more complicated then that. (look up "orders of magnitude")

I ask because it is said that:
Source

1) Source doesn't work
2) This is a pretty lame quote

 

[Naraoia]

Unfortunately, this doesn't work either. There is just too much varaition. For example, humans have literally hundreds of alleles (variants of a single gene locus) for genes of the HLA complex which governs things like tissue compatability. Now, ask yourself this question... how is it possible to shovel hundreds of variants into one gene locus if you start with one man and one woman 6,000 years ago?

A lot of gene copies

 

[sfs]

A lot of gene copies

Or (for most variants) 4 original copies with lots and lots of recombination.