Micheal Vick

[b&wpac4]

Then I'd recommend reading Slaughterhouse by Gail Eisnitz, or just doing some reading on the treatment of veal calves or how foie gras is made. While they don't have cow fights, there is certainly mistreatment and suffering at the same level as what Vick's dogs went through.

I gave up eating veal once I found out exactly what the animals had to go through. I actually find myself sliding more and more toward being a vegetarian because of how the meat industries treat most animals.

 

[katautumn]

Or you know, we could teach them that even if you make a huge mistake, once you serve the just (or excessive, in Vick's case) punishment for it, you can remake yourself and change who you are.

I fail to see how nineteen months is excessive. And someone who is cruel to animals has problems that run deeper than a stint in a celebrity prison can fix. By the way, all of the time was not solely for cruelty to animal charges. The biggest chunk of his sentence was for operating an illegal gambling ring and tax evasion.

 

[Chajara]

I fail to see how nineteen months is excessive. And someone who is cruel to animals has problems that run deeper than a stint in a celebrity prison can fix. By the way, all of the time was not solely for cruelty to animal charges. The biggest chunk of his sentence was for operating an illegal gambling ring and tax evasion.

Yeah, this. Anybody who can torture an animal has serious issues and it's gonna take a lot more than a short stint in prison to make me believe he's "redeemed". Those sorts of issues I rank right up there with serial killers or child molesters. Not in terms of severity of the crime, mind you, obviously ruining a child's life through molestation is worse than torturing an animal, but they're both mental issues and I don't think they just go away because the person who has them gets caught and punished.

As for meat, people are starting to catch on to all the crap that goes on in the meat industry and (surprise surprise!) they're disgusted and looking for an alternative. That alternative is either veganism/vegetarianism or finding sources of humanely and ethically raised meat. It can be as simple as buying from a local farmer who pastures his cattle, pigs, and poultry instead of confining them and feeding them the cheapest corn-based feed he possibly can while pumping them full of antibiotics so he has less dead animals to dispose of each day. I'm making the change and so can you.

 

[clarksided]

I'm all for "once you've served your time the slate is clean", but winning an adversity award is obscene. Players go through adversity when something happens to them, not when they themselves commit the crime and pay for it.

Vikings safety Madieu Williams donated $2 million dollars... yes, that's MILLION folks, to found a centre for Global Health initiative's at the University of Maryland. Where's his reward?

The other several million dollars his salary entails? Don't lionize him, anyone could donate 5% of their salary to charity without taking a serious hit.

 

[clarksided]

19 months is excessive for dog fighting when people who steal regularly get off with probation.

Stealing from any human is infinitely worse than fighting dogs, because dogs aren't people.

 

[b&wpac4]

Stealing from any human is infinitely worse than fighting dogs, because dogs aren't people.

I completely disagree. We have degrees of theft because we understand there is a difference between stealing a loaf of bread and stealing a car. If I steal of loaf of bread from you, it does far less harm than if I basically torture another living creature.

You can give me a "Dogs don't have souls" speech, if that's how you believe, but it's obvious from the reactions of animals that they in pain and suffering. It is an act of extreme cruelty to torture animals for pleasure and those who perform such actions should be punished.

 

[katautumn]

19 months is excessive for dog fighting when people who steal regularly get off with probation.

Stealing from any human is infinitely worse than fighting dogs, because dogs aren't people.

Dogs aren't people, that's true; however, they feel pain and they deserve a basic level of care and respect, hence why we have laws against animal cruelty. Not to mention, things that are stolen can usually be replaced. Torturing an animal to death for fun is a symptom of a serious mental illness.

Also, he did steal. He stole from the government by operating an illegal gambling ring and not paying taxes on the profits he made from it.

 

[TerranceL]

The other several million dollars his salary entails? Don't lionize him, anyone could donate 5% of their salary to charity without taking a serious hit.

Why shouldn't he be lionized? Vick gets a reward for dog fighting... this guy actually made the earth a better place.

 

[david_x]

From an ethical point of view, was what Vick did any worse than what the average person does when they support the veal industry, eat factory farmed chicken, or any of those sorts of things?

Cause that's the same as mutilation?

 

[TheOtherHockeyMom]

Cause that's the same as mutilation?

Yep....mutilation is even part of it, as well as other types of cruelty. There are lots of resources out there if one is interested in learning what goes on in factory farms to mass produce meat and dairy products (as well as leather).
Go visit this link, watch the video Meet Your Meat, then see if you think that what Michael Vick did to cause animal suffering was so different than what goes on in the industry most of the US partakes in every time they eat.
GoVeg.com // Cruelty to Animals: Mechanized Madness

 

[katautumn]

A better film to watch is "The Earthlings", directed by Shaun Monson. It goes into all aspects of animal cruelty including the fur and leather trades, circuses, pet neglect and animal testing.

 

[david_x]

Yep....mutilation is even part of it, as well as other types of cruelty. There are lots of resources out there if one is interested in learning what goes on in factory farms to mass produce meat and dairy products (as well as leather).
Go visit this link, watch the video Meet Your Meat, then see if you think that what Michael Vick did to cause animal suffering was so different than what goes on in the industry most of the US partakes in every time they eat.
GoVeg.com // Cruelty to Animals: Mechanized Madness

The family kills most of my meat, and a few horror stories are not going to make me go vegan. Lettuce is for rabbits. I eat my salads chef.

 

[TheOtherHockeyMom]

A better film to watch is "The Earthlings", directed by Shaun Monson. It goes into all aspects of animal cruelty including the fur and leather trades, circuses, pet neglect and animal testing.

Yeah, Earthlings is a great movie, and I'd sure like to get as many folks to watch that one as possible.

 

[TheOtherHockeyMom]

The family kills most of my meat, and a few horror stories are not going to make me go vegan. Lettuce is for rabbits. I eat my salads chef.

I'm not trying to preach veganism here (for a change )...just noting that it is inconsistent to get all up in arms about what Michael Vick did but not care at all about similar cruelty to animals that is ongoing in the factory farms and slaughterhouses. It's just that for some reason we seem to have a different standard for dogs and cats than for other mammals. If one feels that there is no moral or ethical responsibility to treat animals well, then they shouldn't have any more problem with what Vick did than they do with what went into putting the veal on their plate. If they feel there is a moral or ethical responsibility to treat animals well, then maybe along with being outraged about this dogfighting ring, they should also consider whether or not they need to support the meat industry, and perhaps think about getting their meat from more humane sources or giving it up entirely.

 

[david_x]

I'm not trying to preach veganism here (for a change )...just noting that it is inconsistent to get all up in arms about what Michael Vick did but not care at all about similar cruelty to animals that is ongoing in the factory farms and slaughterhouses. It's just that for some reason we seem to have a different standard for dogs and cats than for other mammals. If one feels that there is no moral or ethical responsibility to treat animals well, then they shouldn't have any more problem with what Vick did than they do with what went into putting the veal on their plate. If they feel there is a moral or ethical responsibility to treat animals well, then maybe along with being outraged about this dogfighting ring, they should also consider whether or not they need to support the meat industry, and perhaps think about getting their meat from more humane sources or giving it up entirely.

I consider the treatment of food animals to be adequate, that being said I only eat it occasionally. Mostly I eat my Grandparents cows.