Meteorite has expert stumped.

[sjastro]

From the Bassikounou sample is a microscopic image of a spherule possibly a 4.5 billion year old chondrule.

Only Pb-Pb dating will verify this.

While Randy Koretev was very non committal on meteorite fluorescence he has dug his heels in on this one.
He disputes the image of being of a 4.5 billion old chondrule by supplying this link.
I've responded by stating his link is about 'meteorwrongs', the image is of a meteorite and even if 'round things' do exist in meteorites it doesn't rule out chondrules as the sample is classified as a H5 chondrite originating from one of three possible asteroid candidates 6 Hebe, 3 Juno or 7 Iris.

Currently we have reached an impasse.....

 

[SelfSim]

While Randy Koretev was very non committal on meteorite fluorescence he has dug his heels in on this one.
He disputes the image of being of a 4.5 billion old chondrule by supplying this link.
I've responded by stating his link is about 'meteorwrongs', the image is of a meteorite and even if 'round things' do exist in meteorites it doesn't rule out chondrules as the sample is classified as a H5 chondrite originating from one of three possible asteroid candidates 6 Hebe, 3 Juno or 7 Iris.

Currently we have reached an impasse.....

As a matter of interest, how was your sample authenticated?
(Ie: Will he ultimately accept that authentication authority?)

 

[sjastro]

As a matter of interest, how was your sample authenticated?
(Ie: Will he ultimately accept that authentication authority?)

The company I purchased the meteorite from is Aerolite Meteorites Inc. which issues certificates of authenticity and whose cliental are not only private buyers but also museums and universities.
Never buy meteorites from ebay...........

Randy Korotev has never questioned the authenticity of the sample only the image of a spherule that might be a chondrule.
He has a website where 99%+ of images of meteorites sent to him turn out to being meteorwrongs.

https://sites.wustl.edu/meteoritesite/items/what_to_do/

 

[ViaCrucis]

I can't offer anything helpful whatsoever to this thread. But I will say that it's a very cool space rock. I want a glowing space rock now.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[sjastro]

While Randy Koretev was very non committal on meteorite fluorescence he has dug his heels in on this one.
He disputes the image of being of a 4.5 billion old chondrule by supplying this link.
I've responded by stating his link is about 'meteorwrongs', the image is of a meteorite and even if 'round things' do exist in meteorites it doesn't rule out chondrules as the sample is classified as a H5 chondrite originating from one of three possible asteroid candidates 6 Hebe, 3 Juno or 7 Iris.

Currently we have reached an impasse.....

The impasse has been resolved.

Sorry, I'm not paying attention. Round things in a chondrite are probably chondrules.

So it is highly probable my image is of a 4.5 billion year old object.
Cool!

 

[SelfSim]

A recent study into carbonaceous chondrites (Murchison and Allende) showed up in the media a day or so ago.
They analysed using mass spectrometry (mainly because they were more interested in the organic content):
Team uses mass spectrometry to study composition of meteorites
Sulphur compounds seem to feature quite a bit(?)

 

[SelfSim]

Perhaps sending the (Mars) imaging folk a more general query about where we can go to learn up more on how they expect to interpret any specific 'glows' they might find?

I realise its a bit off topic from specifically meteorite analysis, but these Mars investigation dudes recently went to the Greenland ice sheets to test their latest invention, 'WATSON', which works via UV Flourescence to detect organics:

We used a deep-ultraviolet fluorescence mapping spectrometer, coupled to a drill system, to scan from the surface to 105 m depth into the Greenland ice sheet. The scan included firn and glacial ice and demonstrated that the instrument is able to determine small (mm) and large (cm) scale regions of organic matter concentration and discriminate spectral types of organic matter at high resolution.

Their published paper is here. Some of their analysis is around @sjastro's λ = 365nm wavelength.

At the very least, I guess the paper represents state of the art analysis of UV flourescence (organics), I suppose?:

The Spectral Types we identified had spectra that are similar to microbes, lignin-phenols, fused- ring aromatic molecules, including PAHs, and environmentally complex fulvic acids of microbial and multicellular origin.

 

[sjastro]

I realise its a bit off topic from specifically meteorite analysis, but these Mars investigation dudes recently went to the Greenland ice sheets to test their latest invention, 'WATSON', which works via UV Flourescence to detect organics:
Their published paper is here. Some of their analysis is around @sjastro's λ = 365nm wavelength.

At the very least, I guess the paper represents state of the art analysis of UV flourescence (organics), I suppose?:

Unsaturated organic molecules which contain double or triple bonds are composed of sigma and pi bonds.
Pi bonded electrons sit in energy levels where the difference between the ground and excited state is compatible to the energy range of photon in the UV-Vis range.

 

[Halbhh]

Once in space basically nothing.
The composition of the meteorite depends on the type of asteroid being impacted and the region of the asteroid where the fragments originate.

​

A fragment from a type S asteroid for example, if from the core which reaches the Earth is an iron meteorite; from the mantle-core boundary a Pallasite or stony-iron meteorite; and from the crust a stony meteorite.

Nice graphic. thanks!

 

[Halbhh]

So it is highly probable my image is of a 4.5 billion year old object.
Cool!

Very cool!

 

[sjastro]

​

In an earlier post I made the comment the 4.5 billion year old chondrule pictured can be confirmed by Pb-Pb dating.
Randy Korotev has stated that is the hard way of doing things.
Chondrules are identified by their olivine and pyroxene content.

FeO-rich, porphyritic pyroxene chondrules in unequilibrated ordinary chondrites - ScienceDirect.