Metafallacy

[Received]

Or you're just making more terms for people to have to be familiar with.

English already has by far the most words, and this one isn't really a great addition.

The mere fact that you are proposing to use words more efficiently than I do seems ironically remarkable to me right now.

I'm not trying to add anything to the English language. I'm not contacting dictionary companies, and I'm not asking anyone to.

The mere fact that I'm proposing a word has to do with the other reasons you didn't address in my last post.

 

[variant]

I'm not trying to add anything to the English language. I'm not contacting dictionary companies, and I'm not asking anyone to.

The mere fact that I'm proposing a word has to do with the other reasons you didn't address in my last post.

You don't have to try.

Irregardless is likely to be a word before I die, and I am guessing "begs the question" will eventually morph into the idea that people mean when they say that in informal conversations.

You want to talk about "metafallacies" which are not even proper fallacies but just improper labels in a bad counterargument.

True I don't seem to appreciate your attempt.

Live with it.

 

[Received]

You don't have to try.

Irregardless is likely to be a word before I die, and I am guessing "begs the question" will eventually morph into the idea that people mean when they say that in informal conversations.

You want to talk about "metafallacies" which are not even proper fallacies but just improper labels in a bad counterargument.

True I don't seem to appreciate your attempt.

Live with it.

You can be such a grumpy cat, dude. And a great argument for how ethics applies to arguments.

And metafallacies are fallacies, hence my attempt to equate them with question begging, and even if not they're fallacious in themselves.

 

[variant]

You can be such a grumpy cat, dude. And a great argument for how ethics applies to arguments.

Grumping actually makes me happy.

And I am doing my taxes today what do you want?

And metafallacies are fallacies, hence my attempt to equate them with question begging, and even if not they're fallacious in themselves.

I don't think it is a fallacy to incorrectly claim a fallacy, just a mistake rather than a logical error.

So your metafallacy is going to be a good example of itself?

Perhaps It does deserve the meta...

 

[Davian]

Can our use of fallacies be fallacious?

The Adventures of Fallacy Man - Existential Comics

 

[variant]

The Adventures of Fallacy Man - Existential Comics

I especially like the end where fallacy man's opponent invokes the fallacy fallacy in the debate championship.

Very ironic.

 

[Received]

Grumping actually makes me happy.

And I am doing my taxes today what do you want?

Well, that makes sense.

I don't think it is a fallacy to incorrectly claim a fallacy, just a mistake rather than a logical error.

As I said to quatona, logic is implicit in all our discussions, so I don't think this is true.

So your metafallacy is going to be a good example of itself?

Perhaps It does deserve the meta...

I don't understand, unless you're saying my use of metafallacy means I'm exhibiting this problem by my use of it. Which would only be true if I offered no justification for my use of metafallacy, but I have.

 

[variant]

As I said to quatona, logic is implicit in all our discussions, so I don't think this is true.

Logic is implicit, but that doesn't make every mistake a logical mistake.

There are for instance observational errors:

The sky is green.

Factual errors:

1955 was before the civil war.

Definitional errors:

FDR was a woman.

None of which are making a logical claim but a factual or truth claim that doesn't turn out to be true.

They are still fallacies in the general sense just not logical ones, so it's either not terribly logically fallacious or it's not terribly meta.

I don't understand, unless you're saying my use of metafallacy means I'm exhibiting this problem by my use of it. Which would only be true if I offered no justification for my use of metafallacy, but I have.

Your justification can be wrong just like everyone eases.

 

[BL2KTN]

The term is "unsubstantiated claim".

 

[Received]

Logic is implicit, but that doesn't make every mistake a logical mistake.

There are for instance observational errors:

The sky is green.

Factual errors:

1955 was before the civil war.

Definitional errors:

FDR was a woman.

None of which are making a logical claim but a factual or truth claim that doesn't turn out to be true.

They are still fallacies in the general sense just not logical ones, so it's either not terribly logically fallacious or it's not terribly meta.

I wouldn't call these fallacies, just descriptive statements that have truth value without applicable rationality. These are different.

Your justification can be wrong just like everyone eases.

I'm not saying I can't be wrong.

 

[quatona]

A statement made within the confines of an argument is fair ground for being fallacious.

I disagree.

Otherwise half a million fundamentalists aren't being fallacious when they say "Jesus is God, you know" when they're discussing the existence of God.

"Appeal to consequence" fallacy.
They are not committing a logical fallacy when saying "Jesus is God".

You can follow up by saying "I don't get how the grass being green means mosquitos exist."

Sure - and they can follow up by saying "Prove how it doesn´t."
(Apart from the fact that you argued for your term as a means of reducing words - and here you´d end up using a lot of words as a result of saying "It´s a fallacy.")

ETA: I'd also say that logic is implicit in any exchange between individuals (and inherent to all thinking as well) so long as you're not just thinking or exchanging ideas descriptively.

Sure logic is implicit in every statement, and certain complex statements can indeed contain a fallacy. That, however, is only the case when a logical progression is explicitly or implicitly attempted.

So in this case, fallacies abound whether or not we're having a formal discussion.

I don´t recall saying anything about formal discussions. I said something about logical deductions.

Just be at one of my staff meetings and see the reason why I pull out my hair every week.

I pull out my hair often, too. But stupidity, irrationality or poor solutions do not require there to be a logical fallacy.

 

[variant]

I wouldn't call these fallacies, just descriptive statements that have truth value without applicable rationality. These are different.

They are in the most general informal sense wrong or mistaken which is all that is required by most general application of the definition.

You weren't using that definition that way so it doesn't matter.

I'm not saying I can't be wrong.

In the case that you are it becomes very meta is the thing