Messianics take stand on "Passion" Movie

[Sephania]

Didn't see this anywhere in this forum so I thought I would share this with you.

UNION OF MESSIANIC JEWISH CONGREGATIONS










February 10, 2004





On The Passion by Mel Gibson

A Messianic Jewish Statement



Recently the film “The Passion” by Mel Gibson has been a source of controversy among Christians and Jews. Some have asked where Messianic Jews stand, as members of the Jewish community who are also believers in Jesus, or Yeshua.



Many Christians report that the film is a compelling work that closely follows the account in the Gospels and gives honor to Messiah and his sacrificial work. Why would such a film raise objections? For two reasons, one with which we sympathize but do not agree, and one with which we sympathize and agree.



First, some, both Christians and Jews, believe that the film is anti-Semitic because the Gospel accounts are anti-Semitic. They consider a close following of the Gospel accounts, therefore, to be wrong and dangerous.



Second, some believe that the film has dangers because of the history of anti-Semitic distortion and misuse of the Gospels. The problem is not with the Gospels but with their use in the history of Christianity.



We reject the first view and do not believe that the Gospels, written by Jews, are anti-Semitic. The Gospels teach that only elements of the Jewish leadership, in unity with Roman authority, were involved in the death of Yeshua. Certainly, this was not the whole nation, nor the great majority of Jews, who did not at that time even live in Israel. In addition, the Bible teaches that Messiah died to atone for the sins of us all. The sin of all humanity was the reason for his crucifixion, and this was by the design of God. Only a gross misinterpretation of the Gospels supports anti-Semitism. We firmly reject any view that accuses the Biblical writers of anti-Semitism.



We agree with the second view. Because of the history of Christianity, the Passion story must be presented without imputing blame upon the Jewish people as a whole for the sin of putting Yeshua to death. This presentation requires emphasizing Roman injustice as well as the specificity of the small group of Jews that violated the Torah in seeking Yeshua’s death. Any film on the Passion should include some explanation that the Romans bore ultimate responsibility, since they alone had the power of capital punishment. A rider or introduction with such an historical explanation would be essential.



In addition, we are concerned about Mel Gibson’s recent interview with Peggy Noonan (for the March, 2004 Readers’ Digest). Mr. Gibson shows both ignorance and insensitivity when he equates the Holocaust with other tragedies, such as Stalin’s crimes. Hitler sought to eliminate a whole people because of who they were. Stalin’s goal was not to eliminate the Ukrainians whom Mr. Gibson mentions, but to see all bow to his dictatorship. The Holocaust is unique. If Mr. Gibson does not make a strong statement accepting the historical record of the Holocaust, he undercuts the very testimony of the Gospels he seeks to put forth.



We urge Mr. Gibson to help further the message of his film by the following two actions.



1. To repudiate Holocaust denial and anti-Semitism in the strongest possible terms, including an affirmation that anti-Semitism and the Holocaust are unique tragedies.



2. To include a rider or introduction to make it clear that only a small number of Jews sought the death of Yeshua, and these were the Roman collaborators. Any curse upon the Jews for the death of the Messiah is absolutely wrong and dangerous.



Christians will tend to view The Passion through the lens of Scriptural accuracy and impact. Jews will view it through the lens of history, where similar Passion plays, from the Middle Ages on, have resulted in mass persecution. Our hope is that controversy over the film may lead to increased dialogue between Christian and Jewish organizations. We urge Christians and Jews to avoid polarizing over this film, but seek to understand each other’s responses to it.



The Passion is currently being promoted for use in Christian education and evangelism. Those using the film in these ways must take responsibility to counter any anti-Semitic implications that could be falsely derived from it.



As Messianic Jews, we affirm the incomparable story of the death and resurrection of the Messiah on behalf of all humanity. We also share the concerns of Jewish leaders that this story can be distorted into an indictment against the Jewish people. In particular, we encourage our Christian brothers and sisters to go beyond defending the Biblical accuracy of The Passion to recognize the historic perspective of the Jewish community. Christians who love Yeshua must do all they can to counter any anti-Semitic distortion of his story.



Jamie Cowen

President



Russell Resnik

Executive Director



Union of Messianic Jewish Congregations

 

[Christy4Christ]

Hi everyone,

I can speak for myself as a Catholic (which should be quite obvious based on my little first communion picture here ) I do not think that any responsible Christians will develop hate after seeing this movie. I know there will be a lot of ignorant people in the world who will say and do a lot of ignorant things but anyone who has read scripture already knows the story and so it shouldn't come as a shock to them that there were both Romans and Jews equally persecuting Christ. I also think that people should take into consideration that anyone Roman or Jewish who was involved in the crucifxion of Christ live TWO THOUSAND years ago!! I feel for the most part people will be so touched by the movie that they will not be trying to place blame. I certainly do hope that I am right because it would be a serious disapointment to God if something that was meant to be so beautiful and spiritual was turned around for hate. I am very excited about this movie and I know that *I* will do my part to counter any possible anti-semitism that I may hear afterward. I would also like to inform those of you who may not be aware of this that The Catholic church will be handing out a 150 page book to each diocese within the church and this book will be meant to squash anti-semitism. I also know that the reason Mel Gibson is no longer in communion with The Church is because he had an issue with The Church trying to take the collective blame for the crucifixion off of "The Jews". Please try to look past that and think about how many people who see this movie might be brought to Christ. This movie could be a very powerful evangelical tool.

God Bless

Christy

 

[Sephania]

I think we all need to see it first.

My opinion is that this film will be an accurate Biblical description of our Messiah's death.

The UMJC can speak for Messianics... but this Messianic can speak for herself and I disagree with their accusations.

I must say I am confused, do you think that the Messianics shouldn't have made a statement? Remained quiet? The statement was not about if this is an acurate Biblilcal depiction ( I think that is what you meant?).

I also don't understand when you say:

I disagree with their accusations

What accusations are you speaking of?

Personally I think it was a good pro-active statement.This film has been marketed not just for the US, but Europe and the Middle east as well. They are trying to prevent history repeating itself and that is a good think in MHO.

As Messianic Jews, we affirm the incomparable story of the death and resurrection of the Messiah on behalf of all humanity. We also share the concerns of Jewish leaders that this story can be distorted into an indictment against the Jewish people.

Christians will tend to view The Passion through the lens of Scriptural accuracy and impact. Jews will view it through the lens of history, where similar Passion plays, from the Middle Ages on, have resulted in mass persecution.

Who will stand with the Jewish unbelievers during this time quickly approaching?


I thought that Messianics would be happy about this, it greatly disturbs me to see that there are those that speak against this, that will only help to protect maybe thousands of Jews in the coming months.

 

[Godz Marine]

Didn't see this anywhere in this forum so I thought I would share this with you.

UNION OF MESSIANIC JEWISH CONGREGATIONS










February 10, 2004





On The Passion by Mel Gibson

A Messianic Jewish Statement



Recently the film “The Passion” by Mel Gibson has been a source of controversy among Christians and Jews. Some have asked where Messianic Jews stand, as members of the Jewish community who are also believers in Jesus, or Yeshua.



Many Christians report that the film is a compelling work that closely follows the account in the Gospels and gives honor to Messiah and his sacrificial work. Why would such a film raise objections? For two reasons, one with which we sympathize but do not agree, and one with which we sympathize and agree.



First, some, both Christians and Jews, believe that the film is anti-Semitic because the Gospel accounts are anti-Semitic. They consider a close following of the Gospel accounts, therefore, to be wrong and dangerous.



Second, some believe that the film has dangers because of the history of anti-Semitic distortion and misuse of the Gospels. The problem is not with the Gospels but with their use in the history of Christianity.



We reject the first view and do not believe that the Gospels, written by Jews, are anti-Semitic. The Gospels teach that only elements of the Jewish leadership, in unity with Roman authority, were involved in the death of Yeshua. Certainly, this was not the whole nation, nor the great majority of Jews, who did not at that time even live in Israel. In addition, the Bible teaches that Messiah died to atone for the sins of us all. The sin of all humanity was the reason for his crucifixion, and this was by the design of God. Only a gross misinterpretation of the Gospels supports anti-Semitism. We firmly reject any view that accuses the Biblical writers of anti-Semitism.



We agree with the second view. Because of the history of Christianity, the Passion story must be presented without imputing blame upon the Jewish people as a whole for the sin of putting Yeshua to death. This presentation requires emphasizing Roman injustice as well as the specificity of the small group of Jews that violated the Torah in seeking Yeshua’s death. Any film on the Passion should include some explanation that the Romans bore ultimate responsibility, since they alone had the power of capital punishment. A rider or introduction with such an historical explanation would be essential.



In addition, we are concerned about Mel Gibson’s recent interview with Peggy Noonan (for the March, 2004 Readers’ Digest). Mr. Gibson shows both ignorance and insensitivity when he equates the Holocaust with other tragedies, such as Stalin’s crimes. Hitler sought to eliminate a whole people because of who they were. Stalin’s goal was not to eliminate the Ukrainians whom Mr. Gibson mentions, but to see all bow to his dictatorship. The Holocaust is unique. If Mr. Gibson does not make a strong statement accepting the historical record of the Holocaust, he undercuts the very testimony of the Gospels he seeks to put forth.



We urge Mr. Gibson to help further the message of his film by the following two actions.



1. To repudiate Holocaust denial and anti-Semitism in the strongest possible terms, including an affirmation that anti-Semitism and the Holocaust are unique tragedies.



2. To include a rider or introduction to make it clear that only a small number of Jews sought the death of Yeshua, and these were the Roman collaborators. Any curse upon the Jews for the death of the Messiah is absolutely wrong and dangerous.



Christians will tend to view The Passion through the lens of Scriptural accuracy and impact. Jews will view it through the lens of history, where similar Passion plays, from the Middle Ages on, have resulted in mass persecution. Our hope is that controversy over the film may lead to increased dialogue between Christian and Jewish organizations. We urge Christians and Jews to avoid polarizing over this film, but seek to understand each other’s responses to it.



The Passion is currently being promoted for use in Christian education and evangelism. Those using the film in these ways must take responsibility to counter any anti-Semitic implications that could be falsely derived from it.



As Messianic Jews, we affirm the incomparable story of the death and resurrection of the Messiah on behalf of all humanity. We also share the concerns of Jewish leaders that this story can be distorted into an indictment against the Jewish people. In particular, we encourage our Christian brothers and sisters to go beyond defending the Biblical accuracy of The Passion to recognize the historic perspective of the Jewish community. Christians who love Yeshua must do all they can to counter any anti-Semitic distortion of his story.



Jamie Cowen

President



Russell Resnik

Executive Director



Union of Messianic Jewish Congregations

I have yet to see this movie but eagerly await it's arrival in my area.

Now it is just my opinion but it was more than the Jews and the Romans which crucified Yeshua. He was sent to atone for the sins of the world. Not just for that day alone but for all time until the end. It didn't matter who put Yeshua to death that day, it was unavoidable. In all actuallity, you, I , and all mankind for all time put Yeshua to death because of our sin which He became on the cross.

 

[Hix]

Mel Gibbson's father is a world famous holocaust denier who claims that it was all a zionist coo to get the Jews back to Eretz Yisrael. That truely discusts me, but you can see were Mel got his anti-semitic ideals from. They belong to a very small break away sect of Roman Catholicism which is very traditional and hasnt accepted the pope's status since hundreds of years ago and thusly havent agreed when the Pope and catholocism in general admitted that it WASNT the Jews fault, and theres no reason to suggest Jews will be going to hell.

Ive seen discussions on this one on other boards and I think its safe to assume that this film is just a reflection on history. My people have undergone unthinkable oppression over this very theology and becuase of people who see nothing wrong with the subliminal messaging contained within which is designed to heap all of the blame for the crucifixion of Yeshua squarely on the yarmulke of the Jew. *shakes head* needless to say I wont be watching it.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[yod]

I've read some reviews that made me sob. This is not just a motion picture, folks. EVERY review I've seen had one sentence in common.

"I will never be the same"

What you are going to see in this movie is that NO ONE escapes blame....especially the audience. The jewish leaders are portrayed as trying to avoid being crushed by Romans for insurrection of another "messiah" more than being envious of Yeshua's popularity.

I'm giving away too much here...but the conclusion is that the one responsible was Satan...and in doing this he was defeated.

But let's be realistic. There was only one good guy that day. Peter denied. Thomas ran. Caiaphus equivocated. Pilate passed responsibility. On and on and on....humans failed God when their "position" was on the line.

I sincerely believe this movie could set off a revival like nothing we've seen before. It's that important.

I also believe that jews will turn out in droves to what the controversy is...and leave as believers in the goodness of Yeshua.

 

[Christy4Christ]

Yod,

~I agree with you about the movie being a big revival.~

Guys and "Gals",
This is about Jesus, this is something we as believers need to do for HIM. There will be many people walking out of that theater with questions and needing support. They are going to have tables set up to hand out literature on how one can get to know Christ! We can't control how others think and what others do. What we CAN control is what we will sacrifice for Jesus today. He sacrificed SO SO much for me and even if I couldn't stand to look at the guy who brought the movie to the theater, I'd go anyway just because I know it will honor and bring glory to my Jesus. This isn't just a movie, this is a tribute to our Messiah and *I* owe Him that. I can't speak for anyone else but I will be there with two boxes of tissues and ready to proudly proclaim my faith to anyone and everyone who will listen! I will also be praying for peace and I will be praying for unity and I will be praying to God that some of His chosen people come to know Jesus. I love all of you, let's please stick together during this event. Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Messianic ALL of us because we are ALL God's children. Let's be an example to others.

Jesus died for us, let us go and witness for Him!

Peace to All... in Him

Christy

 

[Hix]

I've read some reviews that made me sob. This is not just a motion picture, folks. EVERY review I've seen had one sentence in common.

"I will never be the same"

What you are going to see in this movie is that NO ONE escapes blame....especially the audience. The jewish leaders are portrayed as trying to avoid being crushed by Romans for insurrection of another "messiah" more than being envious of Yeshua's popularity.

I'm giving away too much here...but the conclusion is that the one responsible was Satan...and in doing this he was defeated.

But let's be realistic. There was only one good guy that day. Peter denied. Thomas ran. Caiaphus equivocated. Pilate passed responsibility. On and on and on....humans failed God when their "position" was on the line.

I sincerely believe this movie could set off a revival like nothing we've seen before. It's that important.

I also believe that jews will turn out in droves to what the controversy is...and leave as believers in the goodness of Yeshua.

Honestly Yod, I would be HIGHLY surprised if there is even so much as one Jew who questions Judaism over this film. Why? becuase G-d says in Jeremiah that the heart leads astray, we must NOT trust and follow the heart but instead, keep our eyes focused on the unchanging HaShem and rely on our minds. So all the tear jerking movie clips wont have much affect, if any at all. and thats not all, you may have your reviews about this but all of mine come from a Jewish view and they all regard this as anti-semitic, and infact I have seen many christians who also claim the blame is shifted too much on the Jews again. In an interview with Mel he was asked if he felt it blamed the Jews and he answered that he couldnt change what happened......that says it all. The attitude to think that just becuase this is about Yeshua then it MUST be good is exactly the ideal that has caused 2000 years of brutality and hatred for the Jewish people from christianity. This is NOT what Yeshua, a Jew himself, would have wanted at all.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[JewishHeart]

I actually agree with yod. I hear this movie goes almost verbatim from the gospel accounts and doesn't change anything. As a matter of fact, they changed the part where the Jewish crowd said , " His blood be on our hands and our children's hands" and took it out of the movie to make the JDL happy !!! They compromised on a true statement in the Brit HaChadashah to cater to the Jewish community. Even the Australian Jewish Defense League said there was nothing antisemitic about the film and said it goes almost verbatim with the original gospels. Go to 700 clubs website and see the interview with the actor who played Yeshua. He said in this movie the blaim is on all of us, yes the blaim is on the Jews, but also on the Romans, and on the Goyim, and on all mankind. On one hand its sinful and disgustful to target the Jewish people as a singular force for the death of Yeshua, but on the other hand they should take the blaim with the rest of mankind for the forgiveness of their sins. If this is an antisemitic statement then the gospel is antisimetic. I am the number one supporter against antisemetism ! I am very " right" in my politics here in Israel. From what I've heard, the "Passion" is pure gospel. I would like to see one thing though... just as a MJ I'm curious as I've been let down by other gospel accounts.

Does the Passion use unleavened bread in the last Passover?

One of my favorite Yeshua movies doesn't, " Matthew."

Its actually very Jewish in its presentation and concept, but it didn't use unleavened bread.

I wanted to write the producer and ask him why, but don't know where to start.

Anyways... Just to answer many curious questions.... Jewish people in Israel are curious about the movie and are going to see it, that is most the secular population.

Let us pray that they have a revelation of the Messiah, whether you like the movie or not.


HIx you said, " So all the tear jerking movie clips wont have much affect, if any at all."

That is the funniest statement I ever heard as somebody who lives in Israel. The majority secular population (including many traditionals "messurtim") are very moved emotionally from one thing to another. Just look at the tear-jerking media bias put on by the Leftist in Israel that causes much of Israel to sympathize with the Palestinians believing they are on the most part innocent and we are the agressors. Look at how many Israelis, both secular and traditional, stick up for the homosexual community as a viable lifestyle after watching tear-jerking movies about the "misken" homosexual who is treated horribly by society after God made him that way ( according to the movies). Just look at how many Israelis fall for Amir Peretz and the Histadrut socialist organization and demonize BB Netanyahu for wanting to bring capitalism ( Margaret Thatcherism) to Israel. They demonize him after they show the 6 percent cut in the poor persons paycheck from the government after taxes on electronics were dropped by 30 percent, taxes on much grocery food by 15 percent, and so on. The price of bread was subsidixed and was without tax so everybody could afford bread for like 2 shekels ( .35 cents). Benjamin Netanyahu basically took away the government subsidy on bread ( and left the bread still without tax) and the people went nuts !!! But at the same time all the rest of the taxes on groceries dropped. BB said something that the Left demonized, " now even the poor can afford a DVD." They said what does it matter when they can't even buy bread anymore ( the price of bread only went up a shekel .20 cents after BB dropped the govt subsidy so he could drop other taxes. Give me a break... a shekel more for bread is going to break people !!!! Especially after the price of a refrigerator went down 100 dollars !!! But the left still demonizes BB. They see BB as making the rich, richer and the poor, poorer. They don't understand that buisnesses can't survive and close daily because of the socialist stronghold on taxes and therefore there are no jobs. They don't understand that jobs are more important for the poor than a government paycheck. The funny part is the socialists have the PhDs and are the supposedly smart people, yet they support the most ignorant form of economics there is because of tear-jerking news about a poor single mother who got a 6 percent cut in her welfare paycheck because BB dropped taxes. What they need to do is go around to buisnesses that close everyday and buisnessman that work hard, very hard, and pay 70 percent of their earnings to taxes and then the buisness closes ! It happens every day in Israel. And then the left strikes and leaves garbage in the streets, shuts down needed facilities, bankrupts the economy even more, and then blaims the strike on BB and every body complains about the strike with BB in their mouths ( even though it was the Left who called the strike). I call this economic terrorism. So that being said, the Jews in Israel are very much manipulated by biased tear-jerking just like the rest of Europe is.

 

[Woodsy]

The other day my wife sent me the text of an article form the New York Times sick: ) about the fact that the quote from the Gospel of Matthew would not be in the final version of the film. Here is the text of my response, as a Jew, to the article.

"I really think that these Jewish leaders should back off. I am glad that he removed that quote, despite its being present in the Gospel, because it has been (improperly) used to incite anti-Semitic violence too often to ignore.
However, I see Christian discussion of this issue, and this is seen as Jews exerting influence against Christianity. They see Mel as "caving in" to Jews' demands. It just feeds people's anti-Semitism and even provokes it in others who were not anti-Semitic to begin with.

They should voice their concerns about the film, and maybe even prepare other ways to inform the public about their side issue. Maybe even a free videotape respectfully discussing the Jewish side of things, or some such thing.

I also think it's outrageous that they criticise Mel Gibson for putting the 6 million Jews in context with the millions of others who were killed.

The attempted genocide of the Jewish People by the Nazis is a unique world event in its aims and especially its scope, but it is especially meaningful to Jews (and rightly so). However, there is nothing wrong with Christians and/or other groups also looking at the millions of their compatriots who were slaughtered by Nazis and Communists.

To insist otherwise, in my opinion feeds the fires of real anti-Semitism."


Also please see the post here for commentary: http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?p=1745290&highlight=daniel+lapin#post1745290


And one last one from me: http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?p=1073428&highlight=daniel+lapin#post1073428


I agree with Rabbi Lapin...

 

[Hix]

I actually agree with yod. I hear this movie goes almost verbatim from the gospel accounts and doesn't change anything. As a matter of fact, they changed the part where the Jewish crowd said , " His blood be on our hands and our children's hands" and took it out of the movie to make the JDL happy !!! They compromised on a true statement in the Brit HaChadashah to cater to the Jewish community. Even the Australian Jewish Defense League said there was nothing antisemitic about the film and said it goes almost verbatim with the original gospels. Go to 700 clubs website and see the interview with the actor who played Yeshua. He said in this movie the blaim is on all of us, yes the blaim is on the Jews, but also on the Romans, and on the Goyim, and on all mankind. On one hand its sinful and disgustful to target the Jewish people as a singular force for the death of Yeshua, but on the other hand they should take the blaim with the rest of mankind for the forgiveness of their sins. If this is an antisemitic statement then the gospel is antisimetic. I am the number one supporter against antisemetism ! I am very " right" in my politics here in Israel. From what I've heard, the "Passion" is pure gospel. I would like to see one thing though... just as a MJ I'm curious as I've been let down by other gospel accounts.

Does the Passion use unleavened bread in the last Passover?

One of my favorite Yeshua movies doesn't, " Matthew."

Its actually very Jewish in its presentation and concept, but it didn't use unleavened bread.

I wanted to write the producer and ask him why, but don't know where to start.

Anyways... Just to answer many curious questions.... Jewish people in Israel are curious about the movie and are going to see it, that is most the secular population.

Let us pray that they have a revelation of the Messiah, whether you like the movie or not.


HIx you said, " So all the tear jerking movie clips wont have much affect, if any at all."

That is the funniest statement I ever heard as somebody who lives in Israel. The majority secular population (including many traditionals "messurtim") are very moved emotionally from one thing to another. Just look at the tear-jerking media bias put on by the Leftist in Israel that causes much of Israel to sympathize with the Palestinians believing they are on the most part innocent and we are the agressors. Look at how many Israelis, both secular and traditional, stick up for the homosexual community as a viable lifestyle after watching tear-jerking movies about the "misken" homosexual who is treated horribly by society after God made him that way ( according to the movies). Just look at how many Israelis fall for Amir Peretz and the Histadrut socialist organization and demonize BB Netanyahu for wanting to bring capitalism ( Margaret Thatcherism) to Israel. They demonize him after they show the 6 percent cut in the poor persons paycheck from the government after taxes on electronics were dropped by 30 percent, taxes on much grocery food by 15 percent, and so on. The price of bread was subsidixed and was without tax so everybody could afford bread for like 2 shekels ( .35 cents). Benjamin Netanyahu basically took away the government subsidy on bread ( and left the bread still without tax) and the people went nuts !!! But at the same time all the rest of the taxes on groceries dropped. BB said something that the Left demonized, " now even the poor can afford a DVD." They said what does it matter when they can't even buy bread anymore ( the price of bread only went up a shekel .20 cents after BB dropped the govt subsidy so he could drop other taxes. Give me a break... a shekel more for bread is going to break people !!!! Especially after the price of a refrigerator went down 100 dollars !!! But the left still demonizes BB. They see BB as making the rich, richer and the poor, poorer. They don't understand that buisnesses can't survive and close daily because of the socialist stronghold on taxes and therefore there are no jobs. They don't understand that jobs are more important for the poor than a government paycheck. The funny part is the socialists have the PhDs and are the supposedly smart people, yet they support the most ignorant form of economics there is because of tear-jerking news about a poor single mother who got a 6 percent cut in her welfare paycheck because BB dropped taxes. What they need to do is go around to buisnesses that close everyday and buisnessman that work hard, very hard, and pay 70 percent of their earnings to taxes and then the buisness closes ! It happens every day in Israel. And then the left strikes and leaves garbage in the streets, shuts down needed facilities, bankrupts the economy even more, and then blaims the strike on BB and every body complains about the strike with BB in their mouths ( even though it was the Left who called the strike). I call this economic terrorism. So that being said, the Jews in Israel are very much manipulated by biased tear-jerking just like the rest of Europe is.

Im well aware of this JewishHeart but if you DID happen to read what I said in context you would understand that I am reffering soley to religion and theology NOT politics. Of cource I know being a Jew myself that the Jewish people are emotional over these things, but when it comes to religion Jeremiah tells us to not follow our heart as it leads us astray. Perhaps you would like to go back in time and tell Jeremiah how funny you find this? Please in future if you are going to respond to my posts make sure you do so in context and have truely read through what I said.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[JewishHeart]

The heart is deceptive, unless the Holy Spirit rules it. Early Judaism followed the Holy Spirit ( the pillar of fire, the glory cloud, the voice of God, Moses said he would not go if His presence didn't go), but as of late Judaism follows the more Greek example of knowledge. This is Jewish Gnosticism if I may call it that. Ultimately, our knowlege will also fool us, even our knowledge of the word of God ( saying this as someone who treasures the word of God), but it is obeying the voice of the Holy Spirit both in the word of God and day-to-day doings and being passionate for God with an intimate relationship is what counts.

 

[Henaynei]

Does the Passion use unleavened bread in the last Passover?

One of my favorite Yeshua movies doesn't, " Matthew."

Its actually very Jewish in its presentation and concept, but it didn't use unleavened bread.

I wanted to write the producer and ask him why, but don't know where to start.

It wasn't unleavened bread because it *wasn't* the Passover. It was the night BEFORE the Passover. Yeshua died at the time the Pesakh lambs were being laughtered for the Pesakh Seder.

Shalom,
Henaynei

 

[Hix]

The heart is deceptive, unless the Holy Spirit rules it. Early Judaism followed the Holy Spirit ( the pillar of fire, the glory cloud, the voice of God, Moses said he would not go if His presence didn't go), but as of late Judaism follows the more Greek example of knowledge. This is Jewish Gnosticism if I may call it that. Ultimately, our knowlege will also fool us, even our knowledge of the word of God ( saying this as someone who treasures the word of God), but it is obeying the voice of the Holy Spirit both in the word of God and day-to-day doings and being passionate for God with an intimate relationship is what counts.

If we keep our eyes on the Torah then our heart cannot fool us, so says HaShem. But our knowledge can never fool us if you believe what the Tanach says, becuase we know in our heart and mind who the one true G-d is, who came and made an eternal covenant which does not change as he does not change. That is a MAJOR difference between Judaism and Christianity, christianity relies for the most part on faith and following the heart, Judaism has and always will rely on knowledge, which is why it is a mitzvot to question Judaism at least once a day. The Talmud teaches that those who find Torah can never stumble, it is what keeps us on the right path and applies daily to our lives.
Saying Judaism followed the holy spirit is partially correct, however G-d IS a holy spirit, he is without form, he is everywere at every time, that is HaShem.

Anyway Im going off topic, no matter what christians or actors may say, it just isnt them who would get trouble made out of this sort of thing. People who never liked the Jews in the first place can easily use this as further ammo, the past has shown this tragic tale over and over. And at the same time I would be highly surprised if they manage to portray Yeshua as someone who loved being a Jew and loved all the other Jews also, and loved and teached the timeless Jewish message of Torah. In fact il be surprised if there is so much as a Tallit.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[JewishHeart]

From the words of Shaul HaShaliach ( Apostle Paul) - " KNOWLEDGE PUFFS UF, but Love builds up."

 

[JewishHeart]

" God loves a simple people serving an awesomely complex God." - ME!!

 

[Christy4Christ]

Hix,

I have a couple of questions for you.

Did you convert to Christ? If you did convert to Christ, what was your reason? Didn't your emotions have some role in that? I guess what I am trying to say is that if something were able to convert you, why wouldn't you feel other Jewish people would convert and maybe as a result of the effects of this movie?

I have no doubt that the Holy Spirit will be present in every theater across the nation on February 25th. Remember this:

Matthew 18:20 - For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them

There will be alot more than two or three on this night.

 

[Hix]

Convert to Christ? I have no doubt many people have done so off the back of the emotions, they followed their hearts so to speak. Judaism is all about knowledge however, this is becuase Jeremiah plainly tells us not to follow our hearts as they lead us astray, as history has proved to the Jewish people such as with the prophets of Baal. Religions come and go, but to keep strong in their thousands of years old faith the Tanach tells the Jewish people that instead of following their heart, to keep their eyes only on HaShem and use their minds instead. That is why HaShem appeared and gave national revelation infront of a million plus Jewish people, the only religion in the world that can claim that is Judaism and it is an occurance transmitted through the generations so they know what is truth.

This is getting off topic here, but what I ment is that I dont believe this will have any effect on Jewish people. It may well effect Gentiles and for that it is to be commended, especially if it eventually leads to a knowledge of HaShem, but I would respect this film much more if it werent for the obvious implications that the Jewish people are at fault for Yeshua's death.

Shalom and G-d bless
~Hix~

 

[Christy4Christ]

Hix,

I respect what you are saying about a thousands of years old religion, you will get no debate from me on that. I still am not too clear on your stand with Jesus/Yeshua. We are ALL responsible for the death of Christ and I heard someone say earlier, a Jewish person I believe, that the trouble here is that Jewish people don't want to take ANY responsibility for it. Maybe for them it is hard to do that because then they would feel like they were saying "OK we did it!" We all know the truth here. Unfortunately there is none of us who are without guilt. If every one of us would accept our role in the crucifixion we wouldn't have to be so divided. I know how hard something like this must be for many but it is time we face it. All I am saying is wait until we see how it goes, let's not predetermine how things will be after the movie. God is so powerful; with Him all things are possible. Let us keep faith in Him to lead us through all things. I hope nothing I have said has been offensive to anyone that wasn't my intention. I have a couple of good friends who are Jewish and haven't accepted Jesus as Messiah and they are both willing to see the movie, there are a lot of Jewish people out there who don't feel badly about the movie. There is never anyway to make everyone happy, someone will always take issue with something. Keep an open mind, first of all it feels better not to be angry and second of all you may be pleasantly surprised. I will understand if you choose not to respond to me. I just hope you think about what everyone has said to you.


Christy

 

[Sephania]

I'm sorry that this thread has turned into another debate on the movie, I really was hoping to get some responces on what you think of the statement made by the UMJC?

Hiney mah tov umah naim shevet achim gam yachad?