Melchizedek, is Jesus?

[heterodoxical]

That's right and if I do I have an advocate with the Father and because of my new Nature, "There is now no condemnation for me". Overcoming my flesh is another issue.



No deflection __You are the one who accused me. If, at the first, you would have pointed out what exactly how or what I was being smug, it would given me a chance to apologize. That is now all lost. Perhaps it is you who should examine himself to check for being 'over sensitive'

Ormly, read slower. Scripture says at that point you can not sin, there is nothing anywhere those vss to even hint that it is talking of punishment for sin, thus needing a mediator. If you look in 1 j 1 you will see that comment was given to people that were not in fellowship with god, YET, because they still sinned, walk in the dark.

Now, none of that is what you want to hear, but its what it says.



Its not lost, i put in the post YoU responded to. That's not even deflection, that's stri out misrepresentation. And deflection when some err is pointed at you and you respond, nu uh it was you.

I'm getting better i used to try to falk to the narcissistic crowd now im much more selective. if you regain intellectual acuity, look me u spomewhere.

You never tried to back your lie up with an example, just as i showed yiud do. I rest your case.

 

[Ormly]

Ormly, read slower. Scripture says at that point you can not sin, there is nothing anywhere those vss to even hint that it is talking of punishment for sin, thus needing a mediator. If you look in 1 j 1 you will see that comment was given to people that were not in fellowship with god, YET, because they still sinned, walk in the dark.

Now, none of that is what you want to hear, but its what it says.

Not so. If you take it as I have explained you will understand Paul more correctly when he speaks of himself in Romans 7 followed by verse 1 of Ro.8 to know where the battle lies AFTER one is born again.

Here: "He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil."

How does He do that except Christ gives us His own Nature in which our old nature is made dead, our soul can only have one and it is buried with Christ and we are risen in newness of life upon our new birth in Him. . . . And under a new covenant.

"I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. Galatians 2:20 (KJV)

Therefore . . . . "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother. 1 John 3:8-10 (KJV)

Now, what you have just read is proof and the proof test. "Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall." And
" . . let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. Therefore, "Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates? 1 Corinthians 11:28 (KJV) 1 Corinthians 10:12 (KJV) 2 Corinthians 13:5 (KJV)

Its not lost, i put in the post YoU responded to. That's not even deflection, that's stri out misrepresentation. And deflection when some err is pointed at you and you respond, nu uh it was you.

I'm getting better i used to try to falk to the narcissistic crowd now im much more selective. if you regain intellectual acuity, look me u spomewhere.

You never tried to back your lie up with an example, just as i showed yiud do. I rest your case.

Now that is a smug remark. You oughtta practice what you demand of others, my conceited 'friend'.

 

[heterodoxical]

Now that is a smug remark. You oughtta practice what you demand of others, my conceited 'friend'.

Not so. If you take it as I have explained you will understand Paul more correctly when he speaks of himself in Romans 7

Paul didn't speak of himself in romans 7, not after vs 6 or 7 or so.

If I take as you have explained Paul is a liar. Are you comfortable using a liar to defend your position?

If you say Paul was speaking of himself you over look the hypothetical positioning found with the big fat IFs in vss 16 and 25 I think is the second. IF you flew through the air, you would be superman. THAT IS NOT SAYING YOU ARE SUPERMAN!

You also miss that he's speaking in a historical present tense from vs 7-15. That is a form of speaking where the speaker assumes a role of a person, or in this case, group of people from history. Then he dramatically speaks from their perspective. I'm not making it up. if you say Paul spoke of Himself in those verses 7-15 then he's a liar because of his claims in those verses.

Now, I doubt you have ever looked and studied it to the point to chase down those loose ends. Start with 7:5, I think, where paul, says when we were in the flesh. WERE, past tense, as in at this time no longer in!

followed by verse 1 of Ro.8 to know where the battle lies AFTER one is born again.

I wish you understood the ramifications of what was said, instead of eisigetically shoving it into your box.

Let's look at it, shall we?

rom 8:1 Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. (all from NASB)
Do you think you are in Him?
Consider what it means...1Jo 3:6No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or [fn]knows Him.

Is that who you are?

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. 3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh

1Jo 3:5 You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin.
Not the penalty of sin, but sins.
Col 2:11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

The romans 7 sinful nature you were so concerned about, is gone. Poof. TaDAAAAH!
4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Gal 5:16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.


1Jo 1:5 This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. 1Jo 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 1Jo 1:7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
And their fellowship is then with Father and Son...
1Jo 1:3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.

NET ©For those who live according to the flesh have their outlook shaped by 1 the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit have their outlook shaped by the things of the Spirit.
NIV ©
Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.

Two points, you are either flesh, OR spirit. Not both. And the word "according to" in greek is kata. it could also be "belongs to." Which would be better imo because of tying into the 6:16 vs you are a slave to the one you obey.
And remembering the biblical adage, you can only serve one master, not two.
And rom 8:9 that if the Spirit indwells you, you are no longer in the flesh.


6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

This describes a mindset that is an either OR solution, not an AND solution, which is evident at the verse you wanted to leave out... which is...

9A However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

So, the flesh is gone if the Spirit indwells you.
if you still have the flesh, likewise, the Spirit is NOT yet indwelling you. But, could be working ON you.
************

So, we see your romans 7 vss you threw at me implying I was clueless on, don't feed your argument much at all.
1) Paul states he isn't in the flesh anylonger.
2) romans 8:9 is the answer to WHO WILL HELP ME.... if you are spirit indwelled you aren't in the flesh anymore.

***********************

followed by verse 1 of Ro.8 to know where the battle lies AFTER one is born again.

You silly man. 8 is the solution. At the point the Spirit indwells, the flesh is gone.
Romans 6 is the battle, it says it's the battle, it shows and discusses the battle. Paul takes romans 7 to explain what the battle is about, not what HIS battle is about, and romans 8 to answer the dilemma.

in which our old nature is made dead, our soul can only have one

LOOKIE something we agree on.

and it is buried with Christ and we are risen in newness of life upon our new birth in Him. . . .

That isn't the new birth, that is salvation. In the Apostles days, you weren't baptised until you showed you had changed. The magic prayer and bath, doesn't make you a new man. it makes you a forgiven man.

The new man is when the SPIRIT INDWELLS YOU, you are no longer in the flesh, it was removed by a circumcision done by christ col 2:11, the result is it's no longer YOU who lives in you, but HE who lives in you. the YOU that left is SARX, sinful nature. The He that lives in you is the Spirit.

And if you walk in the spirit you can't surrender to temptation.

SO, if you still have a sinful nature, you aren't yet indwelled by the Spirit and you aren't with HE WHO LIVES IN ME yet. But, you'd have salvation by Grace if you believed.
Too many people claim to have both, that's biblically impossible. Then the other extreme is people claiming what they don't have as theirs.

Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

If you still sin, he is NOT in you.

You can't commit a sin, and claim HE doesn't see it as sin, because the scripture says you can not sin. It's impossible.

Now that is a smug remark. You oughtta practice what you demand of others, my conceited 'friend'.

HOW IN THE LAYERS OF DANTE'S HELL IS IT SMUG, TO ASK YOU TO BACK UP A LIE YOU PERPETRATED AGAINST ME! STOP DEFLECTING AND OWN YOUR SINS. THAT IS RIDICULOUSLY EVASIVE AND NOT OWNING YOUR OWN WORDS> THAT IS REPREHENSIBLE AND FAKE BEHAVIOR.

BTW, I said ****Ormly, read slower. Scripture says at that point you can not sin,****

And you posted the verses that say you can't sin. Umm thanks.

You never commented on 1 john 1 where the ones john wrote to, were NOT in fellowship because they still had sin, but they had a mediator. And John was in fellowship with God, because he walked in the light and had no dark in him, not walking in the dark. I.E> not sinning.

What is most telling about you, is your refusal to NOT answer things that incriminate or discredit your position. Hard to take you seriously.

 

[Ormly]

Now that is a smug remark. You oughtta practice what you demand of others, my conceited 'friend'.



Paul didn't speak of himself in romans 7, not after vs 6 or 7 or so.

If I take as you have explained Paul is a liar. Are you comfortable using a liar to defend your position?

If you say Paul was speaking of himself you over look the hypothetical positioning found with the big fat IFs in vss 16 and 25 I think is the second. IF you flew through the air, you would be superman. THAT IS NOT SAYING YOU ARE SUPERMAN!

You also miss that he's speaking in a historical present tense from vs 7-15. That is a form of speaking where the speaker assumes a role of a person, or in this case, group of people from history. Then he dramatically speaks from their perspective. I'm not making it up. if you say Paul spoke of Himself in those verses 7-15 then he's a liar because of his claims in those verses.

Now, I doubt you have ever looked and studied it to the point to chase down those loose ends. Start with 7:5, I think, where paul, says when we were in the flesh. WERE, past tense, as in at this time no longer in!




I wish you understood the ramifications of what was said, instead of eisigetically shoving it into your box.

Let's look at it, shall we?

rom 8:1 Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. (all from NASB)
Do you think you are in Him?
Consider what it means...1Jo 3:6No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or [fn]knows Him.

Is that who you are?

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. 3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh

1Jo 3:5 You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin.
Not the penalty of sin, but sins.
Col 2:11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

The romans 7 sinful nature you were so concerned about, is gone. Poof. TaDAAAAH!
4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Gal 5:16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.


1Jo 1:5 This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. 1Jo 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 1Jo 1:7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
And their fellowship is then with Father and Son...
1Jo 1:3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.

NET ©For those who live according to the flesh have their outlook shaped by 1 the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit have their outlook shaped by the things of the Spirit.
NIV ©
Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.

Two points, you are either flesh, OR spirit. Not both. And the word "according to" in greek is kata. it could also be "belongs to." Which would be better imo because of tying into the 6:16 vs you are a slave to the one you obey.
And remembering the biblical adage, you can only serve one master, not two.
And rom 8:9 that if the Spirit indwells you, you are no longer in the flesh.


6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

This describes a mindset that is an either OR solution, not an AND solution, which is evident at the verse you wanted to leave out... which is...

9A However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

So, the flesh is gone if the Spirit indwells you.
if you still have the flesh, likewise, the Spirit is NOT yet indwelling you. But, could be working ON you.
************

So, we see your romans 7 vss you threw at me implying I was clueless on, don't feed your argument much at all.
1) Paul states he isn't in the flesh anylonger.
2) romans 8:9 is the answer to WHO WILL HELP ME.... if you are spirit indwelled you aren't in the flesh anymore.

***********************





You silly man. 8 is the solution. At the point the Spirit indwells, the flesh is gone.
Romans 6 is the battle, it says it's the battle, it shows and discusses the battle. Paul takes romans 7 to explain what the battle is about, not what HIS battle is about, and romans 8 to answer the dilemma.




LOOKIE something we agree on.



That isn't the new birth, that is salvation. In the Apostles days, you weren't baptised until you showed you had changed. The magic prayer and bath, doesn't make you a new man. it makes you a forgiven man.

The new man is when the SPIRIT INDWELLS YOU, you are no longer in the flesh, it was removed by a circumcision done by christ col 2:11, the result is it's no longer YOU who lives in you, but HE who lives in you. the YOU that left is SARX, sinful nature. The He that lives in you is the Spirit.

And if you walk in the spirit you can't surrender to temptation.

SO, if you still have a sinful nature, you aren't yet indwelled by the Spirit and you aren't with HE WHO LIVES IN ME yet. But, you'd have salvation by Grace if you believed.
Too many people claim to have both, that's biblically impossible. Then the other extreme is people claiming what they don't have as theirs.






If you still sin, he is NOT in you.

You can't commit a sin, and claim HE doesn't see it as sin, because the scripture says you can not sin. It's impossible.



HOW IN THE LAYERS OF DANTE'S HELL IS IT SMUG, TO ASK YOU TO BACK UP A LIE YOU PERPETRATED AGAINST ME! STOP DEFLECTING AND OWN YOUR SINS. THAT IS RIDICULOUSLY EVASIVE AND NOT OWNING YOUR OWN WORDS> THAT IS REPREHENSIBLE AND FAKE BEHAVIOR.

BTW, I said ****Ormly, read slower. Scripture says at that point you can not sin,****

And you posted the verses that say you can't sin. Umm thanks.

You never commented on 1 john 1 where the ones john wrote to, were NOT in fellowship because they still had sin, but they had a mediator. And John was in fellowship with God, because he walked in the light and had no dark in him, not walking in the dark. I.E> not sinning.

What is most telling about you, is your refusal to NOT answer things that incriminate or discredit your position. Hard to take you seriously.

Then please don't. In fact, forget I am here.

 

[heterodoxical]

Then please don't. In fact, forget I am here.

So, faced with even more details that question your claims.

And having your smugness proven....

rather than come clean, or give up points you can't defend,


You run.

Good call, mr. non evasive.

Consider yourself forgotten, I will only speak beside you, not to you.

 

[Ormly]

So, faced with even more details that question your claims.

And having your smugness proven....

rather than come clean, or give up points you can't defend,


You run.

Good call, mr. non evasive.

Consider yourself forgotten, I will only speak beside you, not to you.

Whatever. Thattal work.

 

[Fireinfolding]

How can Melchizedek - Mel -Che -Za -Dek Aramic / Hebrew '' Ruler of righteousness , Or justice . Be Yashu'a , Isa , Jesus , When according to Hebrews 5 ; 5-6 , And I Quote ; So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest ; but he that said unto him , Thou art my Son , today have I begotten thee . Verse 6 ; As he saith also in another place , Thou art a priest forever after the order of Melchisedec .

Mekchizedq as mentioned in Genesis 14 ; 18 , And verse 19 is the ruler of Salem , The City Of Peace . Melchizedq or Melchisedek mean '' The King Of Justice . He is also know as Malachi -Zodoq , Malachi -Zedek , Al Khidr , Malki -Sedeq , Michael , Kiyka'iyl, and Melchizedek , Also called '' The Enternal Master , Master Of Light ' , Melchizedeq came to teach Abraham about the rite and laws of The Most High Initating him into The Mystic Order Of Melchizedeq ,

The order of the angelic beings passing his three degrees 1 . Rabbi , 2 . Rabboni , and 3 . Rabb , Who you know as El Eloh and called baal . Before Melchizedeq came to Abraham , He was teaching the people to worship the '' Canaanite's Deities . He placed these idols in temples , And commanded the inhabitants of the mountain to worship them . Melchizedeq also came to teach Moses , And he is the high priest of the order of Melchizedeq ( Hebrew 6 ; 20 ) , Bring to Abraham , Also Read Genesis 14 ; 18 - 24 .

Again I ask the question how can Melachizedeq be Yashu'a , Isa , Jesus ?

I have a question (concerning your question). If Melchizedek's title is rendered unto the True God, how then could he be rendered out of that title (as Priest of the Most High) and yet be an idolatrous priest at the same time?

Do you believe In Jesus Christ, or do you just believe the scriptures which we see foreseeing Him?

Just so I know where you are coming from.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Do you acknowledge him as the Son of God? Because you can show it in scripture (old and new) and this is just in part I have various ways and much more detailed (and a but more lengthy) but just a snip here


Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified,both Lord and Christ.

1Cr 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is **manifest** that he is **excepted**, which did put all things under him.

Psalms 110 :1 The LORD said unto MY Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, **until** I make thine enemies thy footstool.

1Cr 15:28 And when all things **shall be** subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

1Cr 8:6 But to us there is but ONE GOD, THE FATHER, of whom are all things, and we in him; AND ONE LORD JESUS CHRIST, by whom are all things, and we by him.

2Cr 5:18 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself

John 20:17 I ascend unto MY FATHER, and YOUR FATHER; and to MY GOD, and YOUR GOD.

For example the next two, do you see these two as equal?

Psalms 110 :1 The LORD said unto MY Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.

And likewise...

Prov 30:4 Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?

Acts 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,

Further explained

Acts 2:30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

Rom 1:4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Luke 1:32 He shall be great, andshall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]John 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.[/FONT]

Though, if not the Son, who would this be speaking of here?

Prov 30:4 Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?

Because here you can show the word become flesh, and this verse right here is the question posed which answers only in who has ascended, amd asks directly, whats his name, and his sons name.

See what I mean?

 

[Fireinfolding]

I mean no disrespect but what does the above have to do with Yashu'a being ( Melchizedek ) ? Nor do I accept the trinity . Nor have Yashu'a ever claim to be his own father . Meaning if Yashu'a is the way to his Father which is Yahuwa , And some christian call Yashu'a , Yahuwa , Then my question would be where is Yashu'a taking us ? If you need some scriptures I can give you some .

It doesnt, because I asked you a question first about Melchizedek and you didnt answer that one. Given it seems you appear to cast doubt on the scripture I just thought it best to ask you if yor believed in Jesus Christ (at all) I wasnt sure (given the above). You said yes, as Messiah but never mentioned Him as Son, and dissaprove of the NT placing him as Melchizedek.

So I figured, just go with what he is willing to answer, and asked you what do you do with that other scripture that speaks of the Son and the ascension (by which is declared the Son of God?

Then you diverted again to the trinity (of which I said nothing) and then asked me another question again.

So, I didnt press the issue with you (I let you divert) However everytime I turn around Im being pressed by you, seems you desire to control the converstion, cast doubt on scripture, answer nothing but demand folks answer you. Im not really into that, seems this isnt an isolated incident either. Given that, you dont need to answer my question because its only important that I know who its speaking of.

However, not into wrangling with you (I say that to all the fellows).

I just cant stand that vomit aftertaste in my throat when I do... Know what I mean? Some really seem to prefer the flavor of it but Im really put off by it.

Good night to ya

 

[Fireinfolding]

Was looking at something in this, so went back and pulled up this thread to add to it rather then start another one

The oath of God mentioned elsewhere as well

Heb 7:20 And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:

Heb 7:21 (For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec)

Ecc 8:2 I counsel thee to keep the king's commandment, and that in regard of the oath of God.

Heb 7:2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;

Ecc 8:4 Where the word of a king is, there is power: and who may say unto him, What doest thou?

John 4:27 And upon this came his disciples, and marvelled that he talked with the woman:yet no man said, What seekest thou? or, Why talkest thou with her?


Just thought Id add these in

God bless

 

[razeontherock]

Now that is a smug remark. You oughtta practice what you demand of others, my conceited 'friend'.



Paul didn't speak of himself in romans 7, not after vs 6 or 7 or so.

If I take as you have explained Paul is a liar. Are you comfortable using a liar to defend your position?

If you say Paul was speaking of himself you over look the hypothetical positioning found with the big fat IFs in vss 16 and 25 I think is the second. IF you flew through the air, you would be superman. THAT IS NOT SAYING YOU ARE SUPERMAN!

You also miss that he's speaking in a historical present tense from vs 7-15. That is a form of speaking where the speaker assumes a role of a person, or in this case, group of people from history. Then he dramatically speaks from their perspective. I'm not making it up. if you say Paul spoke of Himself in those verses 7-15 then he's a liar because of his claims in those verses.

Now, I doubt you have ever looked and studied it to the point to chase down those loose ends. Start with 7:5, I think, where paul, says when we were in the flesh. WERE, past tense, as in at this time no longer in!




I wish you understood the ramifications of what was said, instead of eisigetically shoving it into your box.

Let's look at it, shall we?

rom 8:1 Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. (all from NASB)
Do you think you are in Him?
Consider what it means...1Jo 3:6No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or [fn]knows Him.

Is that who you are?

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. 3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh

1Jo 3:5 You know that He appeared in order to take away sins; and in Him there is no sin.
Not the penalty of sin, but sins.
Col 2:11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

The romans 7 sinful nature you were so concerned about, is gone. Poof. TaDAAAAH!
4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Gal 5:16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.


1Jo 1:5 This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. 1Jo 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth; 1Jo 1:7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin.
And their fellowship is then with Father and Son...
1Jo 1:3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.

NET ©For those who live according to the flesh have their outlook shaped by 1 the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit have their outlook shaped by the things of the Spirit.
NIV ©
Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.

Two points, you are either flesh, OR spirit. Not both. And the word "according to" in greek is kata. it could also be "belongs to." Which would be better imo because of tying into the 6:16 vs you are a slave to the one you obey.
And remembering the biblical adage, you can only serve one master, not two.
And rom 8:9 that if the Spirit indwells you, you are no longer in the flesh.


6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

This describes a mindset that is an either OR solution, not an AND solution, which is evident at the verse you wanted to leave out... which is...

9A However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you.

So, the flesh is gone if the Spirit indwells you.
if you still have the flesh, likewise, the Spirit is NOT yet indwelling you. But, could be working ON you.
************

So, we see your romans 7 vss you threw at me implying I was clueless on, don't feed your argument much at all.
1) Paul states he isn't in the flesh anylonger.
2) romans 8:9 is the answer to WHO WILL HELP ME.... if you are spirit indwelled you aren't in the flesh anymore.

***********************





You silly man. 8 is the solution. At the point the Spirit indwells, the flesh is gone.
Romans 6 is the battle, it says it's the battle, it shows and discusses the battle. Paul takes romans 7 to explain what the battle is about, not what HIS battle is about, and romans 8 to answer the dilemma.




LOOKIE something we agree on.



That isn't the new birth, that is salvation. In the Apostles days, you weren't baptised until you showed you had changed. The magic prayer and bath, doesn't make you a new man. it makes you a forgiven man.

The new man is when the SPIRIT INDWELLS YOU, you are no longer in the flesh, it was removed by a circumcision done by christ col 2:11, the result is it's no longer YOU who lives in you, but HE who lives in you. the YOU that left is SARX, sinful nature. The He that lives in you is the Spirit.

And if you walk in the spirit you can't surrender to temptation.

SO, if you still have a sinful nature, you aren't yet indwelled by the Spirit and you aren't with HE WHO LIVES IN ME yet. But, you'd have salvation by Grace if you believed.
Too many people claim to have both, that's biblically impossible. Then the other extreme is people claiming what they don't have as theirs.






If you still sin, he is NOT in you.

You can't commit a sin, and claim HE doesn't see it as sin, because the scripture says you can not sin. It's impossible.



HOW IN THE LAYERS OF DANTE'S HELL IS IT SMUG, TO ASK YOU TO BACK UP A LIE YOU PERPETRATED AGAINST ME! STOP DEFLECTING AND OWN YOUR SINS. THAT IS RIDICULOUSLY EVASIVE AND NOT OWNING YOUR OWN WORDS> THAT IS REPREHENSIBLE AND FAKE BEHAVIOR.

BTW, I said ****Ormly, read slower. Scripture says at that point you can not sin,****

And you posted the verses that say you can't sin. Umm thanks.

You never commented on 1 john 1 where the ones john wrote to, were NOT in fellowship because they still had sin, but they had a mediator. And John was in fellowship with God, because he walked in the light and had no dark in him, not walking in the dark. I.E> not sinning.

What is most telling about you, is your refusal to NOT answer things that incriminate or discredit your position. Hard to take you seriously.

1) How many instances of flaming are going on here?

2) A person not professing to be a Christian, feigns to teach professing Christians? Something is horribly awry.

3) This is a perfect example of why Discipleship is a necessary part, rather than just going it alone (smh)

4) Look at the fruits: strife, division ...

 

[eachallberg]

Notice heterodoxical's faith symbol is "other" he is not Christian.
Maybe still rejecting John 4:24 & 10:30?

Some thoughts on Melchizedek are; he was born of immaculate conception.

"The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all."
(John 3:31)

First, his name means “king of righteousness”; then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace.” Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God he remains a priest forever.
(Hebrews 7:2,3)

Notice king of peace, and the other implications of Melchizedek being not of this world just like Jesus Christ said in John 17:16?

For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
(Isaiah 9:6)

Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights...
(James 1:17)

And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending unto him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth...
(Acts 10:11)

Heaven is the sky besides it being used to describe eternal paradise.

Its all reminiscent of Ezekiel.

Peace.