Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
LinkH,
To return to the question being asked, we should certainly ensure that our meetings allow enough time for the Spirit to minister within the assembly by allowing up to three prophecies and three tongues with interpretation - always one at a time and in order.
The commandments of the Lord regarding prophecy do not say to pass the word on to the leadership team to pray first before they share it. This practice would clearly stifle the type of prophetic flow I Corinthians 14 is designed to deal with.
How could all prophesy if they had to go through that bureaucratic process?
Where do you get the limit of two or three prophecies in a meeting? I don't see how one can get that from the passage in question considering the surrounding context.
I would like to open up a discussion of whether it is appropriate for prophecy to interrupt a sermon. The Bible does not directly address this issue (unless the sermon is prophecy or spoken by a prophet.) I would like to share some thoughts on the issue.
Submitting a word to the leadership team is not "bureaucratic process", it's taking the word seriously and praying about it. If someone said to you, "I have a word from God for you" would you accept it blindly without praying about it? All the books I've read about prophesy, counselling and guidance say that if someone tells you they have a word for you, they should also say, "I could be wrong; take it and pray about it." Test everything, as Paul said.
Where do I get the limit of two or three prophecies! .considering the surrounding context this is the only response that is available to us.Where do you get the limit of two or three prophecies in a meeting? I don't see how one can get that from the passage in question considering the surrounding context.
Requiring that believers submit a word to the leadership first before sharing it with the congregation isn't the commandment of the Lord on the subject that Paul gave in I Corinthians 14.
Why does a word have to go through the leaders first? Isn't the congregation supposed to judge certain matters? Isn't prophecy one of them?
Why don't we just do things the way the Lord commands?
Paul wrote that elders had to correct, and 'contradict the gainsayers.' Apostolic instruction for churches requires that elders clean up messes, rather than muzzle the saints to prevent them from create messes. Muzzling the saints hinders edification.
Submitting prophecies to a select few is not a good idea ...
With regard to submitting a word to the leadership team of a church, I would discourage this practice as we are told in 1Co 14 that it is up to the congregation to judge a prophecy and not with just a select few.
All too often when congregations insist that a couple of people are to vet any prophecy it usually indicates control or insecurity issues exist within the leadership structure. Remember, the Spirit provides the prophecy through the believer to the other believers and not to a select few.
if you stop to think about it, the Holy Spirit does not interrupt Himself. so it is only those who are not subject to the Holy Spirit but who are ruled by their own desire to speak immediately who would be interrupting while another prophet was speaking. the exception would be if there was an emergency situation, as has been noted above.
I would like to open up a discussion of whether it is appropriate for prophecy to interrupt a sermon. The Bible does not directly address this issue (unless the sermon is prophecy or spoken by a prophet.) I would like to share some thoughts on the issue.
First of all, let us consider what prophecy is. Peter describes the nature of prophecy in Old Testament.
II Peter 2
21For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
The New Testament uses the same word translated prophet to describe New Testament and Old Testament prophets. The same words are used to describe New Testament and Old Testament prophecy. There are two accounts of a man specifically identified as a prophet after the ascension giving a prophecy. One of them, he precedes with the words Thus saith the Holy Ghost which is quite similar to the Old Testament expression prophets used Thus saith the Lord. In both cases, he spoke words given him by the Holy Spirit. In these cases, as it happened, he predicted the future. Not all prophecies in the Old Testament are predictions, but many are.
It stands to reason that New Testament prophecy, like Old Testament prophecy, involves speaking as moved by the Spirit of God.
Do Preachers Prophecy?
If we look up usage of the word preach in the KJV New Testament, we see that it is used to refer to three different Greek words. These words are almost always used in the context of evangelistic proclamation of the Gospel. The apostles preached the good news to unbelievers, to those who had not already believed the message. Much of modern preaching is actually teaching or exhortation.
But it is also possible that a preacher may be prophesying when he speaks. If the Spirit comes on him, and he speaks as moved by the Spirit, isnt that prophesying? The one who prophesies speaks as the Spirit moves him, what the Spirit reveals to be spoken for that time. The teacher expounds precepts that have already been revealed. Prophecy does not have to be a prediction of the future. Nor does it have to be some concept that is completely new to the audience. The Spirit says whatever He wishes.
Prophets Yielding the Floor to Others
Many people believe that it is Gods will for a church gathering to culminate in a sermon. One man, usually the senior pastor, an associate pastor, or perhaps a guest speaker, gives a 30 to 45 minute oration. One person does the teaching, and the rest fall silent. There are some believers who think that this is something sacred that cannot be tampered with. They think there must be the Sunday sermon and that things must be done this way.
It is ironic that the Bible never instructs us that a church must have one Sunday sermon delivered by one man. There are few passages which give instructions regarding church meetings. This passage is the one passage used to argue that believers must go to church. Notice what it says:
Hebrews 10:24-25
24And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Notice the instruction here is for the readers, not to be silent and listen to an exhortation, but to exhort one another when they assemble.
None of the passages regarding church gatherings instruct us to have one long sermon delivered by a pastor while all else are silent. In I Corinthians 14, we read the longest passage.
I Corinthians 14
26How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.
Notice that the speaker here is not one man. There is no reference to the pastor in I Corinthians 14. It does mention prophets speaking, but not pastors. Instead of assigning all the speaking to one man, the passage gives instructions for how every one of you can speak or sing to edify the body in an edifying manner.
Specific instructions were given for those who would speak in tongues and interpret in the gatherings.
27If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.
28But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.
The following passage is quite fascinating. It is clearly something most Pentecostal and Charismatic churches have not mastered.
29Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
30If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.
31For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.
In verse 29, Paul instructs that the prophets speak two or three and to let the other judge. This can be interpreted as referring to two or three prophets speaking, or prophets speaking two or three utterances. Perhaps Paul is saying that a judgment (or weighing carefully) must be made after two or three prophecies.
Some argue for a maximum of two or three prophecies in a church meeting. The passage does not say that.. If the Corinthians had more than three people in a meeting, then it could not be possible that all of them were allowed to prophesy one by one. Verse 24 also mentions the idea of all prophesying in a positive light.
Notice in verse 30, that if a prophet is speaking, he must yield the floor if someone else sitting by receives a revelation. Taken with verse 31, we see here that prophecy is revelatory. This is the mechanism by which ye may all prophesy. It must be fascinating to be in a church where the Spirit speaks a message by one person, then His message moves to another, and then to another. No wonder an unbeliever, hearing the secrets of his heart made manifest through this group of believers, would fall on his face and declare that God is truly among them.
The Holy Spirit Doesnt Interrupt Himself
I have heard it argued that no one should ever receive a prophecy to be given during a sermon because The Holy Spirit does not interrupt Himself. But is this a Biblical perspective on the issue? The preacher is not the Holy Spirit. And in I Corinthians 14:30 even a prophet speaking is to be silent if a revelation comes to another person.
I know some would argue against the idea of a prophet being silent for another prophet to share a revelation because Paul writes in verse 40 of this passage, Let all things be done decently and in order. But the order referred to in this verse is the order that God has revealed, not traditional notions of how a church meeting should be conducted.
After giving instructions regarding church meetings, including the instruction that the prophet should hold his peace if another sitting by received a revelation, Paul wrote,
37If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
If a prophet did not want to yield the floor and let someone who had received a revelation speak, he was the one who was out of order. He needed to acknowledge that Paul was giving Gods commands.
Prophecy Superior to Teaching
Paul lists a ranked order of ministries in I Corinthians 12. He ranks apostle as first and prophets as second, followed by teachers. While both of these ministries are essential, prophet is ranked higher.
I Corinthians 12
28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
Ephesians 4
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Paul urges believers to desire to prophesy. He spoke highly of all prophesying church.
I Corinthians 14
1 Pursue love, and desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.
(NKJV)
If a prophet should yield the floor if someone in the congregation receives a revelation, shouldnt a teacher do the same?
A Note on Order
I am not advocating one person interrupt another per se. Paul wrote about a prophet speaking holding his peace when another sitting by received a revelation. Typically, in the Jewish culture of the first century, a teacher sat. Students may have stood at times to learn. Christ sat down to teach occasions. Perhaps in the church, this was reversed. Agabus stood and prophesied about a coming famine (Acts 11:28.) Peter arose to address the Jerusalem assembly. (Acts 15:7.) Perhaps the prophet speaking in I Corinthians 14:30 was standing, and when another received a revelation, he stood. The speaking prophet was to make the choice to hold his peace. The passage does not say to interrupt him, but rather for the prophet to hold his peace. This was something the prophet had to choose to do for proper order in the church meeting.
Scripture to consider:
Acts 10: 44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. 45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles. 46 For they heard them speaking in tongues[b] and praising God.
How can tongues be a sign to the unbeliever if they're never spoken in church? [FONT="]I[/FONT] Cor 14:22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: ...
On the "submitting words to leadership" track (which I know is slightly off-track), I want to say this - the way my home church does it is that for each service there is a "gatekeeper" - and in our church that person is apostle, pastor, or elder - and whenever someone receives a word to give during worship/ministry time, that someone should go to the gatekeeper and submit the word. The gatekeeper decides before the Lord whether the word is correct and whether it is for here and now or not. If it passes both of those tests, the person gets the mike, and the word is given. I like this, because there is accountability, but we don't have to wait a week before the word is given.
I don't see where the New Testament teaches that every prophetic word has to be filtered through a pastor or whatever. I don't see where Paul required that everything be filtered through him or any of the other apostles.
Submitting prophecies to a select few is not a good idea ...
With regard to submitting a word to the leadership team of a church, I would discourage this practice as we are told in 1Co 14 that it is up to the congregation to judge a prophecy and not with just a select few.
All too often when congregations insist that a couple of people are to vet any prophecy it usually indicates control or insecurity issues exist within the leadership structure. Remember, the Spirit provides the prophecy through the believer to the other believers and not to a select few.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?