Martin Luther King Jr - Rape observer and Orgies, as per FBI

[Quid est Veritas?]

FBI tapes reveal Martin Luther King’s affairs ‘with 40 women’

The FBI has released files in a data dump a while ago - amongst these a noted Martin Luther King biographer came across transcripts of tapes from a bugging operation. These state that King and a fellow pastor discussed which female parishioners would be "suitable for natural or unnatural sex acts" and when one objected, she was raped by the other pastor - while King encouraged him and laughed. Similarly, the transcripts report his numerous affairs, orgies with prostitutes and violence toward these women.

Now you could argue this is all fabricated by the hostile FBI at the time - but why hide something if your goal is to besmirch someone? The tapes themselves will only be released in a couple of years, when their classified status expires. This should give one pause. Further, this comes from reputable sources, not the fringes.

Regardless, very disturbing in the extreme.

 

[lambofgod43985889]

if it's true, it's bad indeed

 

[essentialsaltes]

His extramarital affairs have long been an open secret. Being complicit to rape would be pretty startling. You ask "but why hide something if your goal is to besmirch someone?". This is not 'besmirching' - this is being an accomplice to a serious crime. If the FBI thought this was legit, they would not besmirch him, but arrest him.

It's hard to evaluate the evidence here. Per the Atlanta Journal Constitution:

"Garrow pitched the story last fall to several U.S. publications, including The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, which declined to publish the 7,800-word essay without access to the original source material."

 

[essentialsaltes]

Other historians chime in.

The most incendiary claim is made in a handwritten notation by an unknown person on one of the typed summaries. If accurate, the notation indicates that King was witness to a sexual assault.

“I would question the veracity of an anonymous, handwritten note on an FBI report,” said Yale historian Glenda Gilmore, who has worked extensively with FBI reports on civil rights activists. Files like these contain “a great deal of speculation, interpolation from snippets of facts, and outright errors.”

Johns Hopkins University historian Nathan Connolly, who has also examined FBI files, said, “I would be deeply suspicious.”

“That [the allegations] can just be put out there by a historian as if it happened is obviously the height of being archivally irresponsible,” Mr. Connolly said.

 

[Pommer]

FBI tapes reveal Martin Luther King’s affairs ‘with 40 women’

The FBI has released files in a data dump a while ago - amongst these a noted Martin Luther King biographer came across transcripts of tapes from a bugging operation. These state that King and a fellow pastor discussed which female parishioners would be "suitable for natural or unnatural sex acts" and when one objected, she was raped by the other pastor - while King encouraged him and laughed. Similarly, the transcripts report his numerous affairs, orgies with prostitutes and violence toward these women.

Now you could argue this is all fabricated by the hostile FBI at the time - but why hide something if your goal is to besmirch someone? The tapes themselves will only be released in a couple of years, when their classified status expires. This should give one pause. Further, this comes from reputable sources, not the fringes.

Regardless, very disturbing in the extreme.

if it's true, it's bad indeed

His extramarital affairs have long been an open secret. Being complicit to rape would be pretty startling. You ask "but why hide something if your goal is to besmirch someone?". This is not 'besmirching' - this is being an accomplice to a serious crime. If the FBI thought this was legit, they would not besmirch him, but arrest him.

It's hard to evaluate the evidence here. Per the Atlanta Journal Constitution:

"Garrow pitched the story last fall to several U.S. publications, including The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, which declined to publish the 7,800-word essay without access to the original source material."

Other historians chime in.

The most incendiary claim is made in a handwritten notation by an unknown person on one of the typed summaries. If accurate, the notation indicates that King was witness to a sexual assault.

“I would question the veracity of an anonymous, handwritten note on an FBI report,” said Yale historian Glenda Gilmore, who has worked extensively with FBI reports on civil rights activists. Files like these contain “a great deal of speculation, interpolation from snippets of facts, and outright errors.”

Johns Hopkins University historian Nathan Connolly, who has also examined FBI files, said, “I would be deeply suspicious.”

“That [the allegations] can just be put out there by a historian as if it happened is obviously the height of being archivally irresponsible,” Mr. Connolly said.

Awww....thread go BOOM!

 

[mala]

such gems of the hoover era fbi where false allegations were taken as gospel truth as long as they furthered hoover's goals.

 

[kiwimac]

I think it's BS personally.

 

[Quid est Veritas?]

without access to the original source material."

While laudable to seek original sources, news media seldom do so in most other cases. Usually they just appeal to the authority making the claims. Look at how they present claims on origins of dialects, popular science articles, or all the Russia collusion rumours they touted as news. I find it odd that so many American media outlets are loathe to print this.

Anyway, you can go through the released FBI files it is based on if you want, so hardly much of an excuse. The tapes themselves will be released in about 10 years reportedly, so then they will be evaluated - unless they were destroyed long ago, or something untoward happens.

Regardless, if you engage in numerous extra-marital affairs and orgies, which is well established in King's case, I don't think the probability of further sexual misconduct and degrading activity toward women, is impossible. It would be a natural progression of his proven infidelity and low regard for women in other sources. That is why this seems credible enough that non-US media have no problem publishing such claims. It reminds me of how India suppressed the reports of Gandhi forcing his nieces to sleep in the same bed with him, or China supresses Mao's battalion of young women he kept around.

 

[kiwimac]

While laudable to seek original sources, news media seldom do so in most other cases. Usually they just appeal to the authority making the claims. Look at how they present claims on origins of dialects, popular science articles, or all the Russia collusion rumours they touted as news. I find it odd that so many American media outlets are loathe to print this.

Anyway, you can go through the released FBI files it is based on if you want, so hardly much of an excuse. The tapes themselves will be released in about 10 years reportedly, so then they will be evaluated - unless they were destroyed long ago, or something untoward happens.

Regardless, if you engage in numerous extra-marital affairs and orgies, which is well established in King's case, I don't think the probability of further sexual misconduct and degrading activity toward women, is impossible. It would be a natural progression of his proven infidelity and low regard for women in other sources. That is why this seems credible enough that non-US media have no problem publishing such claims. It reminds me of how India suppressed the reports of Gandhi forcing his nieces to sleep in the same bed with him, or China supresses Mao's battalion of young women he kept around.

He is not here to defend himself. Given Hoover's proclivities towards fake reports in order to attack those he felt were communists I would take anything from his time with a salt lick.

 

[paul1149]

The basic facts about King's infidelities have been known for decades, and have even been more or less corroborated by some of his comrades in the civil rights movement in their more candid moments. What has not been known until now, if these latest reports are true, is the extent of them. I don't find this new information outside the realm of possibility, or even probability.

What we need to come to, if we're to have any peace about our past, is accepting the flaws of our heroes as well as their strengths. We have had enough attempts at tearing down of statues of the likes of Thomas Jefferson because of some possible imperfections. If we keep doing this, we will have no history to relate to, to gain perspective on where we are and why we're here, or heroes to inspire us. And that is a very bad thing.

Of course, some want to do just that. They want to strip us of our heritage and cut us off from our cultural moorings, because it's easier to manipulate and redirect a culture that has forgotten its identity. And this is no small movement. Is history even taught anymore in high school?

No one can take away the heroic leadership King gave the civil rights movement. I say let the warts be known as well, without diminishing what he accomplished.

 

[Nithavela]

Personally I dont see why anyone should care.

 

[mindlight]

FBI tapes reveal Martin Luther King’s affairs ‘with 40 women’

The FBI has released files in a data dump a while ago - amongst these a noted Martin Luther King biographer came across transcripts of tapes from a bugging operation. These state that King and a fellow pastor discussed which female parishioners would be "suitable for natural or unnatural sex acts" and when one objected, she was raped by the other pastor - while King encouraged him and laughed. Similarly, the transcripts report his numerous affairs, orgies with prostitutes and violence toward these women.

Now you could argue this is all fabricated by the hostile FBI at the time - but why hide something if your goal is to besmirch someone? The tapes themselves will only be released in a couple of years, when their classified status expires. This should give one pause. Further, this comes from reputable sources, not the fringes.

Regardless, very disturbing in the extreme.

Somebody reliable told me this 24 years ago. Guess it raises the question of whether the private lives of public idols should be allowed to break those idolatries and whether it means we can disregard their public achievements. BUt a lot of liberal heroes were like this: Kennedy was an adulterer but hey he put a man on the moon, Gandhi was a wife beater but brought freedom to India, King David was an adulterer and a murderer but hey didn't he write some good psalms etc etc.

Today we have weighted justice around how men of power treat women. Rape is the ultimate crime and MLK is just not PC even though he is black. I tend to agree that he was a bit of a hypocrite and maybe the real work of black liberation was something others were doing and which he simply hitched a ride on but I did like his "I have a dream.." speech.

 

[Aldebaran]

Personally I dont see why anyone should care.

He has a statue, and his own holiday.
In this country, when someone is less than perfect or offends someone decades or centuries later, we knock down their statues. It makes us feel better.

 

[Nithavela]

He has a statue, and his own holiday.
In this country, when someone is less than perfect or offends someone decades or centuries later, we knock down their statues. It makes us feel better.

Everyone needs a hobby.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

He has a statue, and his own holiday.
In this country, when someone is less than perfect or offends someone decades or centuries later, we knock down their statues. It makes us feel better.

It makes some people feel better. Personally I think it just takes the History away.

 

[Ophiolite]

It makes some people feel better. Personally I think it just takes the History away.

As I recall, the civil rights movement still got off the mark.

 

[Desk trauma]

It makes some people feel better. Personally I think it just takes the History away.

Are these statues set atop archives that are destroyed with them?

 

[Nithavela]

Are these statues set atop archives that are destroyed with them?

You don't need to read statues. Just look at the guy on a horse with the funny mustache and every good human knows "This important chieftain from past. Me respect."

 

[Aldebaran]

It makes some people feel better. Personally I think it just takes the History away.

So do I. History is history no matter which side wins or loses, or who likes it and who doesn't.

 

[bhsmte]

His extramarital affairs have long been an open secret. Being complicit to rape would be pretty startling. You ask "but why hide something if your goal is to besmirch someone?". This is not 'besmirching' - this is being an accomplice to a serious crime. If the FBI thought this was legit, they would not besmirch him, but arrest him.

It's hard to evaluate the evidence here. Per the Atlanta Journal Constitution:

"Garrow pitched the story last fall to several U.S. publications, including The Atlanta Journal-Constitution, which declined to publish the 7,800-word essay without access to the original source material."

At this time, the hoover run fbi were gathering dirt on anyone hoover deemed as dangerous and also to increase the power he had, if he wanted to use the information.

Why do you think hoover lasted as long as he did? Also, it could expose the fbi to arrest, if it was discovered the information was obtained, illegally.