Marilyn Manson / Nirvana ??

[Vehementi Dominus]

I am not into the Satanic Worship this is a Christian Forums and who would want to listen to stuff like that?!! That stuff does not Glorify Christ and let me ask you this question If Jesus came to your house? Would you still listen to it?

Uh... Yeah.

If Jesus didn't like it, he'd be quite welcome to leave.

I used to listen to Manson, not so much anymore, though.

His newer stuff is #@!".

 

[Im_A]

I am not into the Satanic Worship this is a Christian Forums and who would want to listen to stuff like that?!! That stuff does not Glorify Christ and let me ask you this question If Jesus came to your house? Would you still listen to it?

of course. what point does this have to do with anything?

right now i'm listening to:
The Serpentine Offering by Dimmu Borgir

go look up some things about that band if you think Manson and Nirvana is "satanic" LOL thing is, Dimmu isn't even really satanic but more the use of shock value with it, but at least in comparision, i could never perceive how anyone could call manson or nirvana satanic with any use of the word, except that manson claims to be a member of the church of satan, but even then, satanism just seems like a dark humanistic outlook of life, not an actual belief system that worships a being called "Satan."

 

[very_irreverand_Bill]

Does anyone here listen to Marilyn Manson or Nirvana? Those are my two favorite bands. Although the lyrics are sometimes not so good for people to hear, their music is awesome.

I hope I'm not offending anyone by posting this. It shouldn't offend people. Manson is a human just like everyone else and I think he deserves a chance. And if you listen to his lyrics, he talks about how mean people are and how to deal with them. That's just what I get from his music.

Anyway c-ya later people,
Gumby

Not much a fan of grunge. I like Manson, but the only album I have from him is his "lest we forget" best of. I'm not a diehard or anything. But I like some of his stuff, and he seems like a fairly intelligent and definately very interesting bloke.

But I'm more into extreme metal, so...

In Reason:
Bill

 

[very_irreverand_Bill]

I think they're both dreadful, particularly Nirvana. Manson is all image.

Your avatar is one of th best albums of all time. I have the shirt for it. Did you know that David Vincent is back with Morbid Angel again and apparently they are working on new material together?


In Reason:
Bill

 

[very_irreverand_Bill]

I am not into the Satanic Worship this is a Christian Forums and who would want to listen to stuff like that?!! That stuff does not Glorify Christ and let me ask you this question If Jesus came to your house? Would you still listen to it?

LoL!!! Satanic worship, LoL!!!

Like the other dude said, you obviously have ZERO understanding of what that means- "satanic worship", nor of 'Satanism". Obviously you just presume anything that isn't in line with your exact way of thinking is 'satanic" and 'satanic worship".
Nirvana are far from Satanic/Satanists in any respect. Manson himself was given an honorary membership by Anton Lavey into the Church of Satan, though ripped up his membership on stage at a concert after Lavey died, due to his dissatisfaction with the CoS afterwards. He may or may not consider himself Satanist now, if he does- it would be a modern symbolic satanist...not 'satanic worship".

Dude, do some homwork before making uneducated presumptions out of fear for anything different.

Satanic Worship...Hahahahahahahaaaaa!!!

In Reason:
Bill

 

[Followers4christ]

Yah, another completely ignorant post from someone who obviously doesn't understand the concept of what satanic worship is, nor understands that these bands aren't satanic.

Great job there with your educated opinion.

Romans 12:9 Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good.

The only one here being ignorant here is you.How can you confess to love Jesus Christ when the music you enjoy clearly mock Him? You claim to be christian then you support a man who sings about sex,violence,drug use and anti-christian lyrics.When you buy his cds you are supporting his music that mocks the one true God who gave his life for you.Its sort of like confessing to love God yet buying merchadise from satan and hanging out with him while he makes music to mock the God you claimed to love.The bible tells us in 2 Corinthians 11:14 "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light." In this case, he's disguised by the cool, the popular,the trendy themes the media tells us are the culture norms.We as christians must resist and fight the lies that the media is trying to throw at us.

Here is some of Marilyn Manson lyrics:


Title: Coma Black

This was never my world
you took the angel away
I'd kill myself to make everybody pay
This was never my world
you took the angel away
I'd kill myself to make everybody pay


Title: Dead God

The only good god is a dead god.
The only god good for me.
The only good god is a dead god, baby.
The only damn god I need

Title: Valentines Day

slit our wrists and send us to heaven
the first flower after the flood
In the Shadow of the Valley of Death

Title: Fight Song

But I'm not a slave to a god
that doesn't exist
But I'm not a slave to world
that doesn't give a s-

Title: A place in the dirt

Put me in the motorcade
put me in the death parade
dress me up and take me
dress me up and make me
your dying god

 

[peanutbutter12]

Romans 12:9 Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good.

The only one here being ignorant here is you.How can you confess to love Jesus Christ when the music you enjoy clearly mock Him? You claim to be christian then you support a man who sings about sex,violence,drug use and anti-christian lyrics.When you buy his cds you are supporting his music that mocks the one true God who gave his life for you.Its sort of like confessing to love God yet buying merchadise from satan and hanging out with him while he makes music to mock the God you claimed to love.The bible tells us in 2 Corinthians 11:14 "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light." In this case, he's disguised by the cool, the popular,the trendy themes the media tells us are the culture norms.We as christians must resist and fight the lies that the media is trying to throw at us.

Here is some of Marilyn Manson lyrics:
*snip*

I rest my case at Christians complete misinterpretation of the lyrics. Obviously you just don't have a clue. A lot of the lyrics have a deeper than surface, allegorical meaning which you obviously missed while browsing through them looking for ammo to fire, and while Manson is obviously no Christian, he is also in no way a Satanist as some pointed out. Just because someone bashes God doesn't make them a Satanist.

I also enjoyed the way you posted partial songs to prove a point, completely misleading people to the whole direction the song was taking. I bet you do the same thing with Scripture too, don't you?

And I enjoy it because I love his style. I don't necessarily like all his songs, but the majority take a bit more understanding than you are obviously capable of to get the message he's trying to promote within each song. There is no one else that sounds like Manson's style. Period. And these "Christian alternative" bands I always hear about are pathetic at best, trying to rip off other peoples sounds to market their music to people who like that style and want a "safe" version. I didn't realize that plagiarism was a Christian thing to do.

Also, how Christian of you to judge people for the music they listen to. I bet you leave the part about judging people out when posting scripture just like you do when posting lyrics, don't you?

[youtube]ucnA8ElvZQA[/youtube]

 

[Followers4christ]

I rest my case at Christians complete misinterpretation of the lyrics. Obviously you just don't have a clue. A lot of the lyrics have a deeper than surface, allegorical meaning which you obviously missed while browsing through them looking for ammo to fire, and while Manson is obviously no Christian, he is also in no way a Satanist as some pointed out. Just because someone bashes God doesn't make them a Satanist.

I also enjoyed the way you posted partial songs to prove a point, completely misleading people to the whole direction the song was taking. I bet you do the same thing with Scripture too, don't you?

And I enjoy it because I love his style. I don't necessarily like all his songs, but the majority take a bit more understanding than you are obviously capable of to get the message he's trying to promote within each song. There is no one else that sounds like Manson's style. Period. And these "Christian alternative" bands I always hear about are pathetic at best, trying to rip off other peoples sounds to market their music to people who like that style and want a "safe" version. I didn't realize that plagiarism was a Christian thing to do.

Also, how Christian of you to judge people for the music they listen to. I bet you leave the part about judging people out when posting scripture just like you do when posting lyrics, don't you?

Those lyrics do not have a deeper meaning.When someone mocks God in a song do you look for a deeper meaning or do you turn the junk off? I am sorry you are deceived in to believing this is some good music but if he mocks God and rips the word of God up on stage, then as a christian you should not listen to anything this man has to say.In the bible it says 2 John 1:7 "Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist." Now he might not be a Satanist (I have not claimed he was) but he has the spirit of the antichrist in him as scripture tells us.

I should not have to post the entire lyrics to his songs.Because If he mocks God in one part of his songs then the rest of the song is not worth listening too.Now anyone can check out the lyrics to the songs I have posted and see that the entire songs clearly mock God.By the way I have never taken scripture out of context in my post.As a youth specialist I know the importance of keeping the scripture IN context.

It is very unchristian of you to call bands that are singing praises to God as pathetic, Yet standing by music that mocks God.By the way you cannot prove that any of the main stream Christian rock bands ever committed plagiarism nor can you prove that Mansons music has such a deeper meaning that its not mocking God.His music is either mocking God or it isn't.But his lyrics and his acts on stage obviously are mocking our saviour.

You clearly do not understand the scripture at all.Lets look at the whole scripture that so many people misuse:

Matthew 7:1-5 "Do not judge, or you too will be judged.For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.


It's not saying that Judging is wrong, what it is saying is if you judge someone you should not be doing the samething that you are judging the other person for (for that would make you a hypocrite).Just as Ted Haggard condemned Sexual Sin and yet in close doors was committing the very act he was condemning (he refused to look at the sawdust in his own eyes), the church has seen alot of hypocrites.This is what Matthew 7:1-5 is condemning.If we are to judge let us not be hypocrites about it.

1 Corinthians 5:12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside?

1 Corinthians 6:1-6 If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints? Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life! Therefore, if you have disputes about such matters, appoint as judges even men of little account in the church! I say this to shame you. Is it possible that there is nobody among you wise enough to judge a dispute between believers? But instead, one brother goes to law against another—and this in front of unbelievers!

Titus 2:15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.

 

[peanutbutter12]

Those lyrics do not have a deeper meaning.When someone mocks God in a song do you look for a deeper meaning or do you turn the junk off? I am sorry you are deceived in to believing this is some good music but if he mocks God and rips the word of God up on stage, then as a christian you should not listen to anything this man has to say.

I look for what the writer is talking about and why he is putting things in the way he puts them in, much like the figurative parables in the Bible. Music is artistic expression which, in some cases such as Manson, have a deeper than surface point that is being made.

Welcome to the real world. Not everyone is a believer in a higher being. Does that mean you should avoid them at all costs? Not at all. That is one of the problems with modern Christianity: they are scared of what they don't understand and so avoid it at all costs without trying to understand it. To you, it's junk, simply because you don't understand it. Frankly, I applaud Manson for making people think about things. Blind faith is no faith if you don't understand why you believe what you believe other than believing what people tell you. You will have a much better spiritual relationship once you begin to understand and question.

I should not have to post the entire lyrics to his songs.Because If he mocks God in one part of his songs then the rest of the song is not worth listening too.Now anyone can check out the lyrics to the songs I have posted and see that the entire songs clearly mock God.By the way I have never taken scripture out of context in my post.As a youth specialist I know the importance of keeping the scripture IN context.

You miss the point completely then. You post the rest of the song so you can begin to understand what he is talking about, not just the parts about blasting God. Have you never asked WHY someone says something like that? You're just posting what you want people to read so they can get a bias opinion on the subject just like yourself. Hence, another problem with Christianity: deceitful propaganda.

And if you're a youth specialist, I feel sorry for the message you probably promote to your youth.

It is very unchristian of you to call bands that are singing praises to God as pathetic, Yet standing by music that mocks God.By the way you cannot prove that any of the main stream Christian rock bands ever committed plagiarism nor can you prove that Mansons music has such a deeper meaning that its not mocking God.His music is either mocking God or it isn't.But his lyrics and his acts on stage obviously are mocking our saviour.

Heh, I can name about 15 bands that I've worked with personally who have committed plagiarism for the sake of marketing "safe music". I can also name off tons of these bands, bands I've personally work with in the mainstream Christian market, who aren't nearly as Christian off the stage as you are suckered into believing they are. And I never said Manson wasn't mocking. However, that doesn't effect my walk at all, so why should I worry about it? I enjoy the style and the message.

You clearly do not understand the scripture at all.Lets look at the whole scripture that so many people misuse

I understand scripture a lot better than you obviously think I do, so I will avoid your little "teaching" all together. I could also go off on a million reasons your little "Battle Cry" event is nothing but a deceitful waste of time as well which does more bad for people spiritually than it does good for the sake of numbers, but I will refrain simply because this is not the place for that. You aren't nearly as smart as you would like people to believe you are. In fact, you're very condesending, so do yourself a favour and exit stage left, mate.

 

[Followers4christ]

I look for what the writer is talking about and why he is putting things in the way he puts them in, much like the figurative parables in the Bible. Music is artistic expression which, in some cases such as Manson, have a deeper than surface point that is being made.

Welcome to the real world. Not everyone is a believer in a higher being. Does that mean you should avoid them at all costs? Not at all. That is one of the problems with modern Christianity: they are scared of what they don't understand and so avoid it at all costs without trying to understand it. To you, it's junk, simply because you don't understand it. Frankly, I applaud Manson for making people think about things. Blind faith is no faith if you don't understand why you believe what you believe other than believing what people tell you. You will have a much better spiritual relationship once you begin to understand and question.

You miss the point completely then. You post the rest of the song so you can begin to understand what he is talking about, not just the parts about blasting God. Have you never asked WHY someone says something like that? You're just posting what you want people to read so they can get a bias opinion on the subject just like yourself. Hence, another problem with Christianity: deceitful propaganda.

And if you're a youth specialist, I feel sorry for the message you probably promote to your youth.

Heh, I can name about 15 bands that I've worked with personally who have committed plagiarism for the sake of marketing "safe music". I can also name off tons of these bands, bands I've personally work with in the mainstream Christian market, who aren't nearly as Christian off the stage as you are suckered into believing they are. And I never said Manson wasn't mocking. However, that doesn't effect my walk at all, so why should I worry about it? I enjoy the style and the message.


I understand scripture a lot better than you obviously think I do, so I will avoid your little "teaching" all together. I could also go off on a million reasons your little "Battle Cry" event is nothing but a deceitful waste of time as well which does more bad for people spiritually than it does good for the sake of numbers, but I will refrain simply because this is not the place for that. You aren't nearly as smart as you would like people to believe you are. In fact, you're very condesending, so do yourself a favour and exit stage left, mate.

Psalm 1:1 Blessed is the man who does not walk in the counsel of the wicked

Are you really trying to say Manson's music is like the parables in the bible?

Did I say we should avoid him as a person? No I did not.What I said was if he is mocking our lord you should not buy in to the stuff he is selling or listen to him through his music.That means not going to his concerts or buying his music.But it does not mean you cannot reach out to him all that means is you cannot party to his music.I dont think any christian is scared of Manson because our God is stronger then Manson's deception.

I posted the parts where Manson blasted God because any true christian would see that his music is blasphemy and not worth the time to listen too.You cannot say that songs like "Dead God" or GodeatGod" has any deeper meaning the that of mockery.You also cannot say that the lyrics I posted have any deeper meaning then that what was posted.When someone mocks God in a song why would you listen to that junk if you love God.

As me being a Youth specialist I teach them not a watered down message or that of passive christianity, but that of the whole gospel of Jesus Christ.

Yet you have not named one band in your post.Name one main stream Christian rock band that ever committed plagiarism.By the way I will be working with alot of these bands next year in my internship to the Honor Academy (BattleCry's official internship).Let me tell you a little about myself about six years ago I used to be somewhat like you I also went to a bunch of Manson shows (so I know what his music is about) and went to events like ozzfest.I was a cultural christian,I went to church yet acted like the world until my church took me to a Battlecry event that changed my life arround.I am a living testimony that God really moves in ATF/Battlecry events.I have also seen thousands of teenagers lives changed and committed thier lives to Christ. God has really been using Teen Mania to take the gospel to the ends of the earth.

Anyway if you would like to have discussion on Teen Mania I would be more then happy to talk to you about it.We can talk about it either through PM or a public thread.By the way if you knew the scripture you would have not asked a silly question in your last post about "judging".Now if you wish to continue to insult God through your music and fellow believers through your posts, I will not stand in your way.But I ask you to please look pass the deception that the media is throwing at you.God Bless

 

[peanutbutter12]

Are you really trying to say Manson's music is like the parables in the bible?

I am saying that it's similar in the fashion it's written, so yes.

Did I say we should avoid him as a person? No I did not.What I said was if he is mocking our lord you should not buy in to the stuff he is selling or listen to him through his music.That means not going to his concerts or buying his music.But it does not mean you cannot reach out to him all that means is you cannot party to his music.I dont think any christian is scared of Manson because our God is stronger then Manson's deception.

That is your OPINION. And as they say, opinions are like butts; everybody has one, and they all stink. If a persons spiritual walk is not affected by the music they listen to, the movies they watch, etc. then there is no harm nor sin in the actions. I can listen to Manson with no issue and I remain firm in what I believe because I understand why I believe it. Amazingly enough, listening to Manson over the years has only helped for me because part of what he does is make you think, make you question. I don't see why you can't seem to grasp the concept other than having your "Omgooses Manson Evil" blinders on. Different strokes for different folks. What is obviously fine for me isn't for you, however, you seem very irresponsible in your position if you promote a message to your youth to avoid things like this at all costs.

And yes, the church is very afraid of people like Manson. Why do you think they waste their time with worthless protests outside his shows?

I posted the parts where Manson blasted God because any true christian would see that his music is blasphemy and not worth the time to listen too.You cannot say that songs like "Dead God" or GodeatGod" has any deeper meaning the that of mockery.You also cannot say that the lyrics I posted have any deeper meaning then that what was posted.When someone mocks God in a song why would you listen to that junk if you love God.

Oh, so now I'm not a true Christian? lol In part, you're correct. Modern Christianity is a joke. Your posts are one of many many examples why this is. I choose to follow Christ, not Christianity. And yes, I feel songs like Dead God have a much deeper meaning than the shallow way you look at it. And I never said he wasn't mocking God in some of his music either.

Allow me to post a line from a verse of his that I find very inspirational:
"I never really hated, a one true god. But the god of the people I hated..." - MM

Yet you have not named one band in your post.Name one

main stream Christian rock band that ever committed plagiarism.By the way I will be working with alot of these bands next year in my internship to the Honor Academy (BattleCry's official internship). *Edited for pointless information*

And I will not name names either because I am a very respected individual in the world of concert production and won't smear my reputation by being unprofessional because of a silly debate on a Christian Forum.

By the way, good for you. I don't even see how this is relivant to the conversation. I've been working in this industry professionally since I was 18. I've worked one on one with a lot of bands, both secular and christian. I've work on and designed multi-million dollar productions. Do you really think these bands I spoke of would really act out of character in front of people and public? You don't see any of it until you get behind closed doors. You're going to be a glorified publicist. They want you to give them a good image to the public, so you will never see what happens when the crowds and promoters aren't around. Not trying to make you think bad about some bands here, but it is what it is and I am a realist.

Anyway if you would like to have discussion on Teen Mania I would be more then happy to talk to you about it.

Been there, done that, no thank you very much.

 

[WhoseEyesAreThoseEyes]

Title: Dead God

The only good god is a dead god.
The only god good for me.
The only good god is a dead god, baby.
The only damn god I need

Dead God is not a Marilyn Manson song. It is by Skold. The fact that you didn't bother to make sure what you were posting was correct thus makes everything else you said in your post completely meaningless and doubtable.

Know what you are talking about before you speak.

 

[Followers4christ]

Regardless if it is his song or not, this song he not only sings on stage but he also mocks God on stage and through his music. You can try to defend him all you want but true followers of Christ do not listen to music that mocks their savior Jesus Christ. You cant mock God through your music yet praise God in your church. How can you claim to be christian then you support a man who sings about sex,violence,drug use and mocks God?

 

[WhoseEyesAreThoseEyes]

I DID IT FOR THE LULZ

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dear god do you want to tear your knuckles down
And hold yourself

Dear god can you climb off that tree
Meat into the shape of a 'T'

Dear god the paper says you were the King
In the black limousine

Dear John and all the King's men
Can't put you head together again

Before the bullets
Before the flies
Before authorities take out my eyes
The only smiling are you dolls that I made
But you are plastic and so are your brains

Dear god the sky is as blue
As a gunshot wound

Dear god if you were alive
You know we'd kill you

Before the bullets
Before the flies
Before authorities take out my eyes
The only smiling are you dolls that I made
But you are plastic and so are your brains

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I DID IT FOR THE LULZ

 

[A Rhys]

I couldn't stand Nirvana back when they were contemporary. They were just another popular band playing on the radio. They were kind of the Britney Spears or Akon or whatever of their day in that regard. I wasn't old enough then to really understand their impact on changing the music scene from late 80's synth-pop to something more 'real' in a way, so it's mostly in retrospect that I'm able to appreciate both their music and influence.

I never liked Cobain's personality cult because, like him, I'm from small-town Washington and Kurt's worldview/outlook/(anti?)fashion style/lifestyle/music was/is not particularly unique here. Go to Aberdeen and you'll see three dozen Cobains, even now. So I never understood how other people saw him as this enigmatic, insightful, depressed prophet/underground voice of a generation, so that soured me on him early.

On the flip side, I loved Marilyn Manson when he was current. Gotta say the 'shock' he gave the mainstream played a big part, but his music was great, too. Antichrist Superstar is a masterpiece; Mechanical Animals had its moments, everything since then... meh.

I saw him live at OzzFest '03.

 

[Tallerthanatree]

Manson has grown on me.

 

[RedNoma]

I like some of Manson's stuff. I like a lot of Nirvana's stuff. That being said Nirvana is one of the most overrated bands, period. Not saying they're not good, but not to the level of what they're typically put on. As for Manson, I listen to music for the music. I could care less about basing my musical opinions on what the artist believes or sings about. I listen for the the sound, not the meaning.

 

[AdamKane]

Nirvana is pretty good.
Manson's movie scoring is amazing.

 

[BlueStarSkyMonkey]

Nirvana is good. Never been much of a Marilyn Manson fan though.

yeah same here, i like some of Manson's songs but he gets on my nerves after awhile.

 

[BlueStarSkyMonkey]

Regardless if it is his song or not, this song he not only sings on stage but he also mocks God on stage and through his music. You can try to defend him all you want but true followers of Christ do not listen to music that mocks their savior Jesus Christ. You cant mock God through your music yet praise God in your church. How can you claim to be christian then you support a man who sings about sex,violence,drug use and mocks God?

well i can't say i'm a Christian per say but i think Manson just puts on a stage act. He seems like a very intelligent guy otherwise. He seems to just want to shock people, which is does through his music and antics onstage. You can't blame him for people killing other people like society has in the past. What people need to realize is due to no parental guidance and love kids have alot of anger which causes them to act out violently.

that is my opinion and you have yours. I don't want to cause a fight. I respect your opinion 100%.