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Marijuana

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Starcrystal

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I'm for the legalization, but a large part of that is for non THC producing hemp for fiber, paper, lumber, etc. I also feel it is less harmful than alcohol, and that it could be a cash crop and offer jobs to small farmers who struggle. It does have medicinal value as well. I've personally experienced this when I injured my eye and could only see a fuzzy blur out of one eye. It took only 1 hit and my vision came into focuss and stayed that way for the night. That was 8 years ago though.
Smoking it regularly though can lead to similar problems as smoking cigarettes because it still has tars in it.

And no, I'm not a user of this plant any longer.
 
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Reformationist

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...it's obviously not a sin unless you smoke it which is harming your temple...

It is a sin to violate the laws of man, unless they contradict the law of God (Rom 13:1,2; Acts 5:29). With the exception of very few places (at least in the U.S.), possessing marijuana is illegal, regardless of whether you smoke it, eat it, sell it, plant it, etc. Therefore, depending on where you're at, it could very well be a sin to even possess it.

God bless
 
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noparty

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It is a sin to violate the laws of man, unless they contradict the law of God (Rom 13:1,2; Acts 5:29). With the exception of very few places (at least in the U.S.), possessing marijuana is illegal, regardless of whether you smoke it, eat it, sell it, plant it, etc. Therefore, depending on where you're at, it could very well be a sin to even possess it.

God bless

Is it a sin to drive 5 mph over the speed limit?
 
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mont974x4

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Yes, noparty, it is.

So is taking more breaks or longer breaks than your employer allows, or stealing time in any other way.

It is also a sin to not wear your seatbelt or stop to give assistance when you see an accident...in many areas.


It's also a sin to drive to slow in some areas.

Its also a sin to bad mouth our President.
 
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noparty

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Yes, noparty, it is.

So is taking more breaks or longer breaks than your employer allows, or stealing time in any other way.

It is also a sin to not wear your seatbelt or stop to give assistance when you see an accident...in many areas.


It's also a sin to drive to slow in some areas.

Its also a sin to bad mouth our President.

What if I heal someone on the sabbath?
 
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Reformationist

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I was just saying this excessive legalism sounds familiar.

Acknowledging what the Bible calls sin isn't legalism, excessive or otherwise. Legalism deals with the issue of obtaining salvation through adherance to the law. You asked if it was a sin to break the law. The Bible clearly says it is. That is not legalism.

God bless
 
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noparty

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Acknowledging what the Bible calls sin isn't legalism, excessive or otherwise. Legalism deals with the issue of obtaining salvation through adherance to the law. You asked if it was a sin to break the law. The Bible clearly says it is. That is not legalism.

God bless

Not speeding is a good idea. Obeying the government is a good idea, particularly if that government is the Roman Empire and the punishment for disobeying them is death. But the notion that every little legal infraction is a "sin" is ridiculous. Nobody even knows all the laws. How can anyone be sure they're adhering to them all? What if I live on the Tennessee/Alabama border and I want to have oral sex with my wife? Is it only a sin on the Alabama side of the house? New Hampshire has a law banning people from tapping their feet to music in a restaurant. In Denver, CO, it is illegal to lend your vaccuum cleaner to your neighbor. In Boston, it's illegal to take more than 2 baths in a 1 month period. In Washington State, it's illegal to have sex with a virgin, even if you just married her.

I'm not sure that's the sort of thing Paul had in mind when he advised people to obey the governing authorities.
 
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mont974x4

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noparty, Why stoop to ridiculous speculation? As I recall you like bringing in absurd speculation when having discussions.

We know we are to obey the laws of the land so long as they don't directly command us to disobey God. We also know God won't hold us accountable for things we do not know.

Approach things with at least some of the common sense that God gave us.
 
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noparty

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noparty, Why stoop to ridiculous speculation? As I recall you like bringing in absurd speculation when having discussions.

We know we are to obey the laws of the land so long as they don't directly command us to disobey God. We also know God won't hold us accountable for things we do not know.

Approach things with at least some of the common sense that God gave us.

That's what I'm saying. The notion that driving 71 in a 70 zone because you were paying attention to the road instead of the speedometer is a sin is completely absurd.
 
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mont974x4

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Do you know driving 71 in a 70 is wrong? Is it breaking the law re: the speed limit? Yes, it is sin. If you can;t maintain a legal speed and pay adequate attention to the road then consider walking or having someone else drive.


Just to be fair...this is a sin I have an issue with but He's working with me on and I am getting better.
 
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noparty

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Do you know driving 71 in a 70 is wrong? Is it breaking the law re: the speed limit? Yes, it is sin. If you can;t maintain a legal speed and pay adequate attention to the road then consider walking or having someone else drive.


Just to be fair...this is a sin I have an issue with but He's working with me on and I am getting better.

If you honestly believe that speeding is a sin, then I agree, you shouldn't do it. Since you don't believe we're accountable for laws we do not know about, is it better to avoid learning the laws so we do not have to follow them, or should we do extensive research to find out what all the laws are and then keep current on all judicial rulings to know when laws change?

I personally do not believe speeding is a sin. If you're intentionally endangering someone else's life, then you're not loving that person and that's already covered in the Bible. I broke the speed limit several times running errands today. It wasn't an act of malice or defiance. I was simply driving the speed of the people in front of me. Likewise, the people behind me were driving the same speed as me. If that's the sort of thing that God will condemn me to hell for, then I'm a lost cause.
 
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noparty

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But the notion that every little legal infraction is a "sin" is ridiculous.

Noparty, in the interest of intelligent conversation, I'm going to ignore your ridiculous attempts to derail this thread with inane citations of outdated laws that are not even enforced. I would imagine that we are all in agreement that the laws you cite are silly. That said, a law forbidding someone from taking a bath more than twice in a month is entirely different than laws forbidding speeding. You know this. I know this. We both know the other knows this. Your pointless clouding of the issue is a waste of time.

Either way, if there are laws on the books that are available to the public then the public is responsible for knowing them. Ignorance of the law is never an excuse. Ignorance may serve as the basis for a person incurring a less severe punishment but it doesn't change their guilt. As has been shown from Scripture, we are commanded to obey civil authorities so long as their laws do not incite us to disobey God. Not doing so shows a lack of respect for the sovereign God who has placed that authority in its position. That is sinfulness, whether you think it is ridiculous or not.

God bless
 
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mont974x4

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Who said anything about being condemned to hell?

When you scoot about town and drive 30 in a 25 just because you can because you know cops will let you? Rebellion pure and simple.


When you are doing 80 in a 70 because that is the flow of traffic and doing the speed limit would actually place people in harms way...imo... the saftey issue would trump the speed limit issue. However, doing 80 in a 70 when traffic allows you to do the spped limit (admittedly a rare case in many areas..like maybe 3 AM in LA lol ) then again it is sin.


As to learning the laws? What do you honestly think? I would say, yes, we need to learn the laws and obey them to the best of our abilities. For the same reason we study the Bible. I want to be the best man God has for me to be....so I must know what is expected of me in all things.

Do I fail at times? Yes. Is it sin? Yes. Should I repenet and treat it as sin? yes. Am i condemend to hell for it? Nope. Thanks and praise to God for His grace and mercy.



YLT
Rom 6:1 What, then, shall we say? shall we continue in the sin that the grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 let it not be! we who died to the sin--how shall we still live in it?
Rom 6:3 are ye ignorant that we, as many as were baptized to Christ Jesus, to his death were baptized?
Rom 6:4 we were buried together, then, with him through the baptism to the death, that even as Christ was raised up out of the dead through the glory of the Father, so also we in newness of life might walk.
Rom 6:5 For, if we have become planted together to the likeness of his death, so also we shall be of the rising again;
Rom 6:6 this knowing, that our old man was crucified with him , that the body of the sin may be made useless, for our no longer serving the sin;
Rom 6:7 for he who hath died hath been set free from the sin.
Rom 6:8 And if we died with Christ, we believe that we also shall live with him,
Rom 6:9 knowing that Christ, having been raised up out of the dead, doth no more die, death over him hath no more lordship;
Rom 6:10 for in that he died, to the sin he died once, and in that he liveth, he liveth to God;
Rom 6:11 so also ye, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to the sin, and living to God in Jesus Christ our Lord.
Rom 6:12 Let not then the sin reign in your mortal body, to obey it in its desires;
Rom 6:13 neither present ye your members instruments of unrighteousness to the sin, but present yourselves to God as living out of the dead, and your members instruments of righteousness to God;
Rom 6:14 for sin over you shall not have lordship, for ye are not under law, but under grace.
Rom 6:15 What then? shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? let it not be!
Rom 6:16 have ye not known that to whom ye present yourselves servants for obedience, servants ye are to him to whom ye obey, whether of sin to death, or of obedience to righteousness?
Rom 6:17 and thanks to God, that ye were servants of the sin, and--were obedient from the heart to the form of teaching to which ye were delivered up;
Rom 6:18 and having been freed from the sin, ye became servants to the righteousness.
Rom 6:19 In the manner of men I speak, because of the weakness of your flesh, for even as ye did present your members servants to the uncleanness and to the lawlessness--to the lawlessness, so now present your members servants to the righteousness--t sanctification,
Rom 6:20 for when ye were servants of the sin, ye were free from the righteousness,
Rom 6:21 what fruit, therefore, were ye having then, in the things of which ye are now ashamed? for the end of those is death.
Rom 6:22 And now, having been freed from the sin, and having become servants to God, ye have your fruit--to sanctification, and the end life age-during;
Rom 6:23 for the wages of the sin is death, and the gift of God is life age-during in Christ Jesus our Lord.
 
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noparty

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Noparty, in the interest of intelligent conversation, I'm going to ignore your ridiculous attempts to derail this thread with inane citations of outdated laws that are not even enforced. I would imagine that we are all in agreement that the laws you cite are silly. That said, a law forbidding someone from taking a bath more than twice in a month is entirely different than laws forbidding speeding. You know this. I know this. We both know the other knows this. Your pointless clouding of the issue is a waste of time.

Either way, if there are laws on the books that are available to the public then the public is responsible for knowing them. Ignorance of the law is never an excuse. Ignorance may serve as the basis for a person incurring a less severe punishment but it doesn't change their guilt. As has been shown from Scripture, we are commanded to obey civil authorities so long as their laws do not incite us to disobey God. Not doing so shows a lack of respect for the sovereign God who has placed that authority in its position. That is sinfulness, whether you think it is ridiculous or not.

God bless

The law is the law. Just because it's not enforced or is outdated doesn't mean it's not a law. I don't think you can say breaking man's law is a sin, but then arbitrarily draw exceptions as you wish. Either breaking the law is a sin or it isn't.

I deliberately used absurd examples of the law to show you how absurd the law is. The level of absurdity you see with my examples is the same level of absurdity I see with yours.

There are 3 possible camps here of the level of authority that man has to dictate what is or is not sin. 0%, 100%, or some arbitrary number inbetween. In order to be 100%, you must follow all laws without exception.
 
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